When the 2022 World Cup is confirmed to take place in Winter...

rcoobc

Not as crap as eferyone thinks
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What do you think will the reaction be from the Clubs, Leagues and Nations?

Will the ECA, Premier League and associations of Australia, the USA, Japan and South Korea collectively sue FIFA?

Yet, the ECA chairman (and chairman of Bayern Munich) Karl-Heinz Rummenigge is one of the defenders of moving the World Cup to winter, and would like to see the football calendar move to a "lego" system, where there is a permanent gap in the summer and winter for International Football. Is there then, wider collusion going on behind the scenes?

Or will FIFA come to a behind-the-scenes deal with major parties such as Australia and the USA before announcing the change? I can't see the Premier League doing anything other than going down fighting.
 
A summer and winter gap... would that push leagues into having a first half and second half table, similar to how Mexico and other FAs work?

I would much prefer a universal football calendar but how does FIFA and the FAs make it work for regions that will be affected by climates?
 
I don't understand how they're even legally allowed to keep hosting it. The world cup conditions according to that article stipulate a June/July world cup and the big justification for their winning bid was some reasoning of sci-fi inventions that would make everything ok. Surely then now that they can't hold on the promise for the June/July world cup, their bid is now void? Surely there's enough there for one of those losing bidders to sue and demand a re-vote where at the very least Qatar have to bid on the basis of a winter world cup. They'd still probably win mind.

It just makes a mockery of having a bidding process if a country can basically just make up its bid to win and then decide afterwards that actually, its not possible. Even then the idea that a country should even be allowed to bid to hose when it's deemed high risk on the technical reports is farcical.
 
rcoobc said:
What will the reaction be from the Clubs, Leagues and Nations? Will the ECA, Premier League and associations of Australia, the USA, Japan and South Korea collectively sue FIFA?

Yet, the ECA chairman (and chairman of Bayern Munich) Karl-Heinz Rummenigge is one of the defenders of moving the World Cup to winter, and would like to see the football calendar move to a "lego" system, where there is a permanent gap in the summer and winter for International Football. Is there then, wider collusion going on behind the scenes?
I will say , not a chance will anybdo
Or will FIFA come to a behind-the-scenes deal with major parties such as Australia and the USA before announcing the change? I can't see the Premier League doing anything other than going down fighting.
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Not a chance anybody will chose to sue FIFA.
FIFA will tell them tough that is what happening, live with it.
Yes they will moan and some may even say no we cant change the timing of the leauges, but in the end they will.
FIFA want a winter World Cup and usually what FIFA wants, FIFA gets.
 
MrMarcello said:
A summer and winter gap... would that push leagues into having a first half and second half table, similar to how Mexico and other FAs work?

I would much prefer a universal football calendar but how does FIFA and the FAs make it work for regions that will be affected by climates?
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I'm not sure, but there are so many problems with it.

Let's say that the Summer and Winter International periods are both 4 weekends and 3 midweeks, i.e. 29 days. How much of a gap do you leave between International football and Club football? 1 weekend and 2 midweeks, i.e. 12 days? That makes sense to me, a decent amount of time without missing too many weekends of football. I'll get back to this in a second.

At the moment, the best players around the world have an extra weekend of football now and again, whilst the middling footballers or the aging footballers get a break. I.e. Fabregas and Carrick are playing for Spain and England over this weekend, whilst Ferdinand isn't. Obviously when you have a team of 23 International players it gets a bit dodgy, but for many teams they can simply rest an International player in a game further down the line, to help make sure he doesn't pick up too many injuries. It's not ideal, but many clubs make sure International players get rested in the minor games.

This is no longer possible when all the Internationals are grouped together. When Rooney and Carrick have played 7 times and Ferdinand has had 47 days rest; half the players are going to be completely jaded come the season end, whilst the other half are going to come out of the blocks flying! This is already the case with the summer tournaments, but it's going to get a hell of a lot worse!

4 weekends of International Football means 6 weekends without club football which means 47 days of rest for certain players... and weeks of extra games for others. Obviously I haven't taken into account an actual rest period, presumably in the summer, so you can add that into the equation. But the idea is hugely fecked up.

International Football has moved to 2 games over weekends because thats the best time for it. They've gotten rid of single midweek matches: It's now 12 day periods with 2 International games. The next logical step would be to ban matches on the Sunday before and the Saturday after, to give players some proper rest when flying out huge distances, but this would require UEFA moving Champions League and Europa League matches from Tuesdays and Thursdays so isn't going to happen anytime soon.
 
The one thing I would say about Rummenigge's Lego idea is that it would bring the African Cup of Nations and Asian Cup (sometimes) back into the fold.
 
The problem will come when they realise re-arranging the league schedules fecks up the Champions League, which is about the most lucrative competition in football and has a big impact on the most powerful clubs in football. I can't see that going down well and I can't see those nvolved just sitting back and accepting it when they're used to running the show, to the point of bullying governing bodies like the FA around at will.
 
pauldyson1uk said:
Not a chance anybody will chose to sue FIFA.
FIFA will tell them tough that is what happening, live with it.
Yes they will moan and some may even say no we cant change the timing of the leauges, but in the end they will.
FIFA want a winter World Cup and usually what FIFA wants, FIFA gets.
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I don't know. The US might not sue because there are few candidates to rival it for 2026, but Australia, Japan, Korea, etc could decide to because they won't be able to host it until 2034, which is rumored to be when China will push for it(making it 2046 before they could host). 2030 will most likely be held in Uruguay somehow. I would love to see lawsuits from all of the other bids, but Sunil Gulati, should he be head of US Soccer then, is spineless. He won't do anything to upset the applecart because he's already in it.

As for the leagues, if the big 5 leagues in Europe decide to boycott it, I'm not sure what FIFA could do. If they chose to ban teams, revoke licenses or whatever they require, etc, the leagues already don't care. They could form a breakaway federation started from scratch that could institute many reforms that are impossible in FIFA. It's highly unlikely to happen, but FIFA is only as powerful as it is allowed to be.
 
Having no football to watch over my Xmas holidays would be wank. I vote no.
 
noodlehair said:
The problem will come when they realise re-arranging the league schedules fecks up the Champions League, which is about the most lucrative competition in football and has a big impact on the most powerful clubs in football. I can't see that going down well and I can't see those nvolved just sitting back and accepting it when they're used to running the show, to the point of bullying governing bodies like the FA around at will.
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Doesn't seem a problem for Platini

"...the FIFA president announced that he’d come to share the view of Michel Platini (a staunch supporter of Qatar and of the winter switch from the word go) and Franz Beckenbauer that the 2022 World Cup could only be staged during what is the coolest season in the emirate."
 
It would be feckin brilliant if all the FA's just decided to say 'no' to FIFA and hold there own tournament in the Summer of 2022... I'm not remotely sure how feesible or realistic such an idea is - but I'd approve.
 
Something Bellend Blatter should have thought of before he accepted those massive amounts of oil money.

Dictator. Not sure why or how he's still head of FIFA tbh.

* Disclaimer - I say this with total ignorance. I'm just not a Blatter fan.
 
esmufc14 said:
Doesn't seem a problem for Platini

"...the FIFA president announced that he’d come to share the view of Michel Platini (a staunch supporter of Qatar and of the winter switch from the word go) and Franz Beckenbauer that the 2022 World Cup could only be staged during what is the coolest season in the emirate."
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It will become a problem with the big clubs start getting in his ear about it.

The problem with Platini is that he really is incredibly stupid.
 
noodlehair said:
It will become a problem with the big clubs start getting in his ear about it.

The problem with Platini is that he really is incredibly stupid.
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The Champions League is a fairly easy competition to move though, as has been said the problem is moving all the league's calenders to accommodate a WWC. It's an utter farce. Countries should just withdraw their participation that year, or perhaps 'fail' to qualify.
 
The Champions League does actually already have a winter break. Last season the 6th and final Group Stage game was on the 5th December, whilst the first Knockout Round was on the 12 February.

Sadly almost perfect for a winter world cup.
 
Although possibly for all the wrong reasons, I think FIFAs ambition in this is a good one. The world cup has been too much a European competition with aid from South America, and International football has been dominated by the needs of the European clubs and leagues. This is now higly unreasonable, and not in the best interest of world football. Economic domination of European clubs should not be a reason for favouring them with regards to organization of international football, quite the opposite. A winger break (if so be) is a minor adaption compared to the impracticalities suffered by leagues and confederations in other parts of the world.
 
Grande said:
Although possibly for all the wrong reasons, I think FIFAs ambition in this is a good one. The world cup has been too much a European competition with aid from South America, and International football has been dominated by the needs of the European clubs and leagues. This is now higly unreasonable, and not in the best interest of world football. Economic domination of European clubs should not be a reason for favouring them with regards to organization of international football, quite the opposite. A winger break (if so be) is a minor adaption compared to the impracticalities suffered by leagues and confederations in other parts of the world.
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I think many people would disagree there. Western Europe has given more and more concessions over the years. for example; they had a World Cup every 8 years from the first until 2006, but since then they haven't had one. The earliest a Western European World Cup could be is 2026, 20 years since Germany.

European football is dominant in the world cups; 7 of the last 8 finalists, 2 all European finals in a row. No South American team has beaten a European team in World Cup knockouts since 2002. Brazil showed this could change in the confederations though.

The current number of places for European nations also made sense for UEFA; qualifying for a World Cup was almost exactly as difficult as qualifying for a European Championship. This has changed now anyway though, but was nice and symmetrical. It allowed the qualifying formats for both to be the same.

If you mean more in terms of, the world uses the European Calendar unfairly, then maybe. But no other calander makes better sense. There is no better alternative. Some African nations, some Middle Eastern and parts of South America might prefer International tournaments in December-February, perhaps Australia too. But that's not a coherent reason to have it then. Short of using the "Lego" system, which as I said above is very stupid and of the top European Leagues, only makes sense for Germany, there is no good idea to make it work
 
peterstorey said:
The ambition to share it around is a good one but some counties are impractical due to climate or other reasons. There are plenty of deserving cases ahead of Qatar - wouldn't hold the winter Olympics in Brazil.
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Bit of an understatement there Pete. Not that Qatar can't afford the billions to build stadia, irrigate the desert and whatnot, but the whole thing reeks of corruption. But what's new. FIFA and Blatter are synonymous with corruption and bent deals.
 
esmufc14 said:
The Champions League is a fairly easy competition to move though, as has been said the problem is moving all the league's calenders to accommodate a WWC. It's an utter farce. Countries should just withdraw their participation that year, or perhaps 'fail' to qualify.
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I'm interested to know how the CL works if they don't know who's qualified for it yet due to all the leagues moving around...I doubt the likes of Real, United etc. will happily just sit there being messed around and potentially losing revenue...and I shouldn't think they would be keeping quiet considering they hold the player's contracts and pay their wages.

Remember atm other fixtures, even down to Scottish Cup replays, aren't even allowed to take place at the same time as CL games, due to the fear over any impact it might have on revenue. A world cup appearing n the middle of the schedule is kind of a slightly bigger deal.

It could take place durng the CL's break, but then good luck fitting all the extra cup and league games around the rest of the CL schedule in a way not to disrupt or compete with it.

You'd think Platini might have thought that through, but...it's Platini. Almost nothing that comes out of his mouth seems to go through any kind of thought filter.
 
UEFA has probably set a bad precedent with the 2020 Euros being held everywhere. Did they consult the nations on it? Did it go to a vote? Or did they just decide? Is Turkey suing?

It's such a mess. January and February 2022 World Cup, when will the 2021 Confederations Cup be? December and January? Will the 2020 Euros still be on June-July? Or will it be moved back to May-June.
 
How do European clubs view the release of players for a winter world cup? If the clubs refuse to alter their domestic schedule could they decide the player’s contracts don't include a release clause for a competition in the winter months?

 
711 said:
Why don't Blatter and Platini just return their bribes and give the world cup to whoever came second in the ballot.
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Because they use round-by-round/AV voting, I'm not sure that would be strictly legal.
Don't Kill Bill said:
How do European clubs view the release of players for a winter world cup? If the clubs refuse to alter their domestic schedule could they decide the player’s contracts don't include a release clause for a competition in the winter months?

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This is almost the question. Technically, the players are contracted through their FAs that they will be released for Internationals. But possibly, the clubs could fight that. Does the current Memorandum of Understanding run out, 2018?

The clubs have already shown they hold the cards by forcing FIFA to agree to 9 double headers over two years; taking away the single midweek dates.
 
JulesWinnfield said:
I don't understand how they're even legally allowed to keep hosting it. The world cup conditions according to that article stipulate a June/July world cup and the big justification for their winning bid was some reasoning of sci-fi inventions that would make everything ok. Surely then now that they can't hold on the promise for the June/July world cup, their bid is now void? Surely there's enough there for one of those losing bidders to sue and demand a re-vote where at the very least Qatar have to bid on the basis of a winter world cup. They'd still probably win mind.

It just makes a mockery of having a bidding process if a country can basically just make up its bid to win and then decide afterwards that actually, its not possible. Even then the idea that a country should even be allowed to bid to hose when it's deemed high risk on the technical reports is farcical.
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Indeed. I think it's potentially a massive own goal given the ever-increasing pressures the international game faces from club football.
 
Grande said:
Although possibly for all the wrong reasons, I think FIFAs ambition in this is a good one. The world cup has been too much a European competition with aid from South America, . . ..
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And for good reason. In the article cited by rcoobc above, the author, Phillipe Aucliar states something to the effect that around 69% if the athletes participating in the World Cup play in the major European leagues that would be affected by a change to a winter competition.

Further, as shown by the upheaval during the Confederations Cup, hosting the World Cup, with the costs of building/improving stadia and revamping the transportation infrastructure is a burden economically and socially even in a country as advanced and football prepared as Brazil. While Qatar might have the money to build 8 brand new cathedrals to the sport, most of the nations of the world don't and in uncertain economic times, the excitement of hosting the event could collapse under realities of cost overruns and failure to get the construction done on time and properly.
 
711 said:
Why don't Blatter and Platini just return their bribes and give the world cup to whoever came second in the ballot.
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Wouldn't Blatter have retired by the time 2022 comes around? He's probably not too bothered about the mess it'll create.
 
Australia-New Zealand really would break all the rules, given they are in different confederations these days!
 
George Owen said:
that would be awesome...

2030 will be Argentina-Uruguay so Australia and NZ should go for it on 2026. Sounds good.
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I didn't know the US came second. I would prefer someone it hasn't gone to before, and I like the idea of jointly-held tournaments. And Uruguay in 2030 would be nice, so yeah.

However Scotland, Wales and the Irelands would be good too.
 
rcoobc said:
Australia-New Zealand really would break all the rules, given they are in different confederations these days!
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Unfortunately, although one might ask why "Oceania" even exists these days without Australia. The collection of small island nations should be farmed out to another confederation. There might be a slim chance New Zealand can beat the CONCACAF #4, but they should just be part of the selection process from the confederation to begin with.
 
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