When will the money dry up?

Class of 63 said:
If you'd been born 13/14 years later you probably would have though - and it's those that latched onto United when we were in a period of domination who seem to be most critical of the club now that we're not winning trophies left right and centre.

ps. We've got 100's of 1000's of glory hunters in England as well, but they are less likely to switch clubs but rather chose another sport, Rugby League usually :nervous:
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You think they will switch clubs? Football doesn't work the way it used in decades past; if you let standards slip, it's a long way back to the top. Why shouldn't supporters be critical when they are slipping at such an alarming rate? We never finished outside the top 3 in the SAF era; since, we have found finishing in the top 4 a struggle, now we are being told that we may or may not finish in the top 6. This club is being dismantled in spite of its vast resources - there is no excuse for it.
 
Halal Jalal said:
You're conveniently ignoring the fact that vast majority of our fanbase is located outside of England, and these fans have no connection to the club other than being attracted to success and trophies. We've "only" been sh*t for 6 years, relatively a short period given the strength of our brand. Make no mistake though, these fans will switch eventually - Real/Barca most likely, City/Liverpool possibly. Woodward is a short-sighted fool if he genuinely believes that performances on the pitch have no effect on the finances.
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Worst post of the year, possibly ever.
 
Brand association, the badge is popular regardless of the football. Look at New York Yankees for example success or not the cap/logo will be known worldwide and the same applies here.

We may experience a drop off but nothing major and United will continue to rake in massive income.
 
Contrary to popular belief, Woodward is reasonably intelligent and i'm sure will have figured out that if we continue to struggle on the pitch this will inevitably have an impact on our the commercials. I think the brand is incredibly strong and will always make money, however we'll need to perform better on the pitch to maximise the income.
 
M Bison said:
Contrary to popular belief, Woodward is reasonably intelligent and i'm sure will have figured out that if we continue to struggle on the pitch this will inevitably have an impact on our the commercials. I think the brand is incredibly strong and will always make money, however we'll need to perform better on the pitch to maximise the income.
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I'm sure he already knows this and not just recently.
 
kouroux said:
I'm sure he already knows this and not just recently.
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Yes, thats my point. People seem to think Woodward isnt bothered how the results are as long as we keep making money, he's not stupid and will realise they are interlinked.
 
Class of 63 said:
Interesting take.

Or create a "is it safe to go into the united forum yet" thread

Did you go to the MUTV day at the Grand Hotel Excelsior in 2008 or are you camera shy? Or too young?
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I was probably there but United come every year in malta so I don't remember which one I skipped (work commitments)

What I think would happen is that most top reds will go dormant. They won't follow the games regularly and they will stop talking about united. That until things change. I've seen that happening with the Liverpool fans. I thought my Facebook account was Liverpool FC free. Anyone remotely linked with those crap were removed. Turned out I got more Liverpool fan friends then redcafe have united fans. Oh well
 
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I was wondering about this. We loose so much cash not being in the Champions league and we lost what 60 mill for addidas sponsorship alone. I thought this would trigger as 200 mill plus net spend in the summer. But it seems this is not true. I think financialy success in term as of trophies or champs league is no longer viable. With the oil rich clubs it seems most other clubs have realized they can't compete? Even 200 mill won't guarantee top 4 let alone titles and the amount you extra cash you get for winning is no where near 200 mill. Financialy the goal is to spend the minimum amount to appease the manager and the fans. Where that gets you in the table doesn't matter - financially? It's my theory....maybe it's wrong
 
Class of 63 said:
If you'd been born 13/14 years later you probably would have though - and it's those that latched onto United when we were in a period of domination who seem to be most critical of the club now that we're not winning trophies left right and centre.

ps. We've got 100's of 1000's of glory hunters in England as well, but they are less likely to switch clubs but rather chose another sport, Rugby League usually :nervous:
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So any 30 plus below 50 is a glory hunter?

Enlighten me how you can support united without called a glory hunter.

Postcode? Age? Location?
 
Halal Jalal said:
You're conveniently ignoring the fact that vast majority of our fanbase is located outside of England, and these fans have no connection to the club other than being attracted to success and trophies. We've "only" been sh*t for 6 years, relatively a short period given the strength of our brand. Make no mistake though, these fans will switch eventually - Real/Barca most likely, City/Liverpool possibly. Woodward is a short-sighted fool if he genuinely believes that performances on the pitch have no effect on the finances.
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The club will be damn glad of these supporters when the monies really start to dry up. Some of these supporters spend a lot of money in the online store purchasing all the new gear every year. If they cannot get to matches every week in Old Trafford they are only too glad to support the club in other ways. I lived and worked in Manchester for years before I retired back to Ireland but I still travel over and back to games loads of times during the year, and still purchase a lot of Manchester United products all the time. I'm outside of England now but I'm still a big fan.
It's the new generation that will turn away from Manchester United if they are not challenging, and then they will see a big change.
 
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Why aren't the media not hitting Spurs as hard as they are hitting us. More newspaper sales??
 
Bestietom said:
Why aren't the media not hitting Spurs as hard as they are hitting us. More newspaper sales??
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Because we are one of the biggest sides in the world, certainly historically & financially, whereas Spurs are not.
 
Feed Me said:
It strikes me that United are in a quandary in respect of its owners.

They’re not sporting people and so long as Woodward is raking in the cash they have no real incentive to make dramatic changes.

It seems obvious to everyone else that United need to get a proper football infrastructure in place at board level to be competitive again (managerial change alone will fail) but we realistically won’t see any change to the status quo while the commercials are so attractive.

So my question is this: Playing the tumescent football we are, allied with consistently losing and failing to compete; when will the money stop rolling in?

Frankly, I’m astonished that we have continued to break finance records for this long since SAF retired. You almost – almost – need to tip your hat to the Glazers and Woodward in that regard – the massive cnuts.

So yeah, at what point will we see major hits to the commercial side of the business?
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Not until the supporters stop going to matches and buying merchandise, wich i have done the last 1 1/2 years.

The only language the Glazers speak is money. So until they see less money coming in, nothing will change and the club will continue to be a personal ATM machine for the cnut owners.
 
It will start to go of course... The fan base will age and die and young international fans - the ones who make the club the size it is - they'll grow up supporting someone else.

5 years of shite already... The club need to win now or we could easily go the way of many other big clubs of old..
 
Halal Jalal said:
You're conveniently ignoring the fact that vast majority of our fanbase is located outside of England, and these fans have no connection to the club other than being attracted to success and trophies. We've "only" been sh*t for 6 years, relatively a short period given the strength of our brand. Make no mistake though, these fans will switch eventually - Real/Barca most likely, City/Liverpool possibly. Woodward is a short-sighted fool if he genuinely believes that performances on the pitch have no effect on the finances.
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What an absolute idiotic post. I have been a fan of united for more than 20 years and I live in Asia. Connection with United goes beyond England and I can confidently say fans like me will continue to support United even if they get relegated. I cannot fathom supporting another club other than United. That is why the money will not dry up I guess.
 
I'd support the club even if we get relegated. I do think that our financial power will start to drastically decrease from next summer, unless we suddenly change our fortunes and finish in the top 4. CL is very important in order for us to at least maintain our status.
 
I’m sure sponsors are growing weary of having their brand associated with this mess so soon I expect.
 
DoomSlayer said:
I'd support the club even if we get relegated. I do think that our financial power will start to drastically decrease from next summer, unless we suddenly change our fortunes and finish in the top 4. CL is very important in order for us to at least maintain our status.
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I too would support the cub if we got relegated. If the financial power starts dwindling it may be the time where the Glazer's feel that is time to sell up. Which I would be happy with as long as the new owners were as concerned about results on the pitch as they are about making money off it.
 
I have supported the club in bad times, and when we were relegated to the old 2nd division. But at least then we had some good players. Anyone remember Big Jim Holton at CB. Pearson was a very good goalscorer. The squad we have now is shit.
 
M Bison said:
Yes, thats my point. People seem to think Woodward isnt bothered how the results are as long as we keep making money, he's not stupid and will realise they are interlinked.
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And if not, he'll realise it next year when the Adidas money drop by 30%
 
Bulldog United said:
The issue isn't losing our current fans, it's getting the next generation not picking United as their team. Right now, I doubt very few kids (who don't have parents who are United fans) are watching our games thinking this is the team for me. So long-term damage will be done if we don't sort this out.
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That's my thought as well. I'm in Norway, and I can't remember the last time I saw a kid wearing a United kit. 15 years ago, you'd see them everywhere, to the point where it almost became too much. The youngest United fan I know of today is 16. Now, this is all very unscientific, but as others have mentioned, there is little doubt that Champion League success and star names are the main recruitment tools for new fans across the globe. 20-30 years ago, we competed mainly with Liverpool for what is today the middle-aged fanbase. Today, we're up against Real, Barca, Liverpool, PSG, City, and we're definitely losing that battle at the moment. Yeah, we'll always get a certain percentage of new fans while we're in this period of status quo (or decline) through firm and responsible parenting, as well as through extensive media coverage, but I don't think we can go through another decade of blandness without it starting to affect us a tiny bit financially. But, to be honest, I don't really care about our financial results. I'd rather have a club that needs to penny-pinch, as long as it provides a bit of fun every weekend. Being loaded with money does us no good at the moment.
 
Winning breeds a new sets of fans, which inturn will grow into supporter.

Those of you old people starts supporting united because of your parents, ask them why they support united? It's because of glory, and i dont mean title alone, but then romantism that comes with the club.

Maybe it's busby babes, maybe its attacking football, maybe for most of us the co92 and the romance between having beckham in your team, for some maybe it's many things, but they're all glory in their own ways. I started to like united because of beckham, back then i dont even know what united won, but i do get enthralled with the players and their history.

So unless you support teams like norwich, please refrain from calling others glory hunter. It's unsulting and a hollier than thou attitude.
 
Sky1981 said:
Winning breeds a new sets of fans, which inturn will grow into supporter.

Those of you old people starts supporting united because of your parents, ask them why they support united? It's because of glory, and i dont mean title alone, but then romantism that comes with the club.

Maybe it's busby babes, maybe its attacking football, maybe for most of us the co92 and the romance between having beckham in your team, for some maybe it's many things, but they're all glory in their own ways. I started to like united because of beckham, back then i dont even know what united won, but i do get enthralled with the players and their history.

So unless you support teams like norwich, please refrain from calling others glory hunter. It's unsulting and a hollier than thou attitude.
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You realise we existed before the busby babes and were pretty well supported then. My grandfather was a regular and certainly no glory hunter.
 
Sky1981 said:
So anyone supporting united without having a grandad that supports one isna glory hunter?
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No, you made it sound like we only have supporters because of success. People supported the club before then was my point. You realise Manchester is a pretty big city?
 
Feed Me said:
It strikes me that United are in a quandary in respect of its owners.

They’re not sporting people and so long as Woodward is raking in the cash they have no real incentive to make dramatic changes.

It seems obvious to everyone else that United need to get a proper football infrastructure in place at board level to be competitive again (managerial change alone will fail) but we realistically won’t see any change to the status quo while the commercials are so attractive.

So my question is this: Playing the tumescent football we are, allied with consistently losing and failing to compete; when will the money stop rolling in?

Frankly, I’m astonished that we have continued to break finance records for this long since SAF retired. You almost – almost – need to tip your hat to the Glazers and Woodward in that regard – the massive cnuts.

So yeah, at what point will we see major hits to the commercial side of the business?
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It won’t really ever “dry up”...20 years of Unparalled success at a time when English football was being telecasted all over the world has ensured hundreds of millions of loyal United supporters across the world.Sure,maybe 10-20% of “fans” may start supporting other clubs,but the vast majority of Uniteds international support base will remain intact even if we don’t win the league for the next 10 years....
 
AllezLesDiables said:
United has much greater exposure (risk) than the Cowboys or the Canadiens.

The Cowboys can’t be relegated and American football is a religion in Texas. Even when the Cowboys suck they have the NFL draft which gives them the opportunity to draft one of the best young players.The same thing applies to Montreal.

United can be relegated. United doesn’t improve their chances by not being a non-Champions League team.

While United is showing record revenue the effects of poor performance do not immediately show up until later.

If the seemingly unfathomable were to happen and United were to be relegated that would create a massive drop in revenue from missing out on the PL share, plus the sponsors would look elsewhere or play much less once their contacts expired. Who knows what is the contacts but I am sure there is language that addresses what happens if United gets relegated.

However, assuming United never gets relegated, there will be a decrease in fan interest and engagement. Sponsors will use lack of winning as leverage in nevotiatiobs and players will avoid United.
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Bollox. Not a clue about Dallas Sharpshooters but United actually we’re relegated and support didn’t budge an inch. In fact, it increased. Sponsorship deals might drop a bit but they’ll be fully aware we’ll still have enormous pull globally. Liverpool are a fair bit behind us but they’re still well ahead of the next club after their long barren spell. It’s happened before to United and in the unlikely event it happens again, income streams will still be bigger than anyone else, taking into account RM & Barca’s lopsided deals in Spain. Imagine that happening here.
 
fergiesarmy1 said:
No, you made it sound like we only have supporters because of success. People supported the club before then was my point. You realise Manchester is a pretty big city?
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It’s also a very small pond in this modern world.

investors don’t care about Manchester, they want millions on Facebook and social media in general. There’s a reason why the club go on tours of Asia and America every summer - their money is just as important if not more.
 
Adam-Utd said:
It’s also a very small pond in this modern world.

investors don’t care about Manchester, they want millions on Facebook and social media in general. There’s a reason why the club go on tours of Asia and America every summer - their money is just as important if not more.
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Match day revenue is about 20% of our total revenue, pretty important percentage.
 
It won’t

Unlike Liverpool you hit the jackpot with the timing of your decline.
 
devilish said:
I was probably there but United come every year in malta so I don't remember which one I skipped (work commitments)

What I think would happen is that most top reds will go dormant. They won't follow the games regularly and they will stop talking about united. That until things change. I've seen that happening with the Liverpool fans. I thought my Facebook account was Liverpool FC free. Anyone remotely linked with those crap were removed. Turned out I got more Liverpool fan friends then redcafe have united fans. Oh well
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Think it was MUSC's 50th anniversary in 2006 and there was a 'live' phone-in, remember watching it.
 
M Bison said:
Contrary to popular belief, Woodward is reasonably intelligent and i'm sure will have figured out that if we continue to struggle on the pitch this will inevitably have an impact on our the commercials. I think the brand is incredibly strong and will always make money, however we'll need to perform better on the pitch to maximise the income.
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Whilst they’re interlinked, there is the perfect sweet spot. Let’s say we lose 20% worth of commercial revenue over the next five years due to being poor. Spending less on signings and associated wages may more than make up for that drop. In other words, the return on investment for the Glazers may be better if we don’t invest.
 
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