World Cup Qualifiers | October 2017 | Play off draw on Tuesday

MrMarcello said:
I think people get top tier athletes confused as meaning big muscular types, and those types often build themselves up as their sport requires it (or they're just genetic freaks). I'm talking about top tier athletes with speed, agility, strength, etc. that separates them from everyone else. And for a sport like soccer it takes having a brain that understands the sport in addition to high-end athletic ability.
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Even now we match up well athletically with almost everyone. We are far behind a lot of sides technically though.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
We have such a large population even being 4th choice would give us a large player pool. In Soccer you do not need the same type of athletes you need for American Football, Basketball or Baseball. And with the generation that are kids now the names Cristiano Ronaldo and Lionel Messi are probably bigger than say Mike Trout.
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Since I am late to the conversation, @MrMarcello has already beat me to the punch again...

MrMarcello said:
The population comment isn't representative of the actual reality. China has 1.4 billion people and India has 1.3 billion - neither qualified and rarely do.
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I don't think that population can overcome popularity. Especially when, as I said in my previous post, the attitude of the majority of adults towards the sport is so negative.

I do agree that the popularity of the biggest stars will have an impact on young Americans in the future. Pogba, for example, is just pretty damn cool to some of the younger generation (well, me too for that matter :devil:). Maybe that will help change the attitude towards the sport as they grow up. One can hope.
 
Todd said:
Almost a 3hr drive, unfortunately. I'm in the South Bend area, right around Notre Dame. I watch United by myself in my living room every weekend, LOL. It'd be really cool if I lived in a place where I could to go a bar on a Saturday morning and watch the United match with other fans, but that's not gonna happen around here.
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The girlfriend of a friend of mine went to school in Carbondale. Went there once. Not exactly South Bend, but I get your jist :)
 
NecssryEvil said:
Since I am late to the conversation, @MrMarcello has already beat me to the punch again...



I don't think that population can overcome popularity. Especially when, as I said in my previous post, the attitude of the majority of adults towards the sport is so negative.

I do agree that the popularity of the biggest stars will have an impact on young Americans in the future. Pogba, for example, is just pretty damn cool to some of the younger generation (well, me too for that matter :devil:). Maybe that will help change the attitude towards the sport as they grow up. One can hope.
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Just looking at it anecdotally I think the tide has shifted especially with the younger generations. ESPN actually shows Soccer highlights during Sportscenter now and shows scores on the ticker. FIFA sells well in the US. Here in NY Cristiano Ronaldo does ads for Optimum. Even where I grew up Soccer was "cool" but, I know here in the Northeast it is a little different from the rest of the country.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
Because they just failed to qualify for a 24 team Euros.
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I thought we were talking about the US... I assumed you were saying the US not qualifying for the WC wasn't a surprise this time, seeing as the point I was making was that them not making the WC was a much bigger shock than the Dutch...
 
MrMarcello said:
And had the draw been kinder to the Dutch they may have ended up in the group that Belgium drew featuring some of the weakest UEFA nations. The 2002 Dutch side was better than the current side but performed terribly in 2002 considering the talent at hand.

UEFA has a massive region hence why it has nine groups; CONCACAF has a smaller region and the qualifying rounds eliminate many weak nations that trot out amateurs and part-timers (but all nations have a chance to compete). There's really on about 8-9 nations in CONCACAF that field professionals, hence why those nations often make it to final round of six. Four spots is probably too many considering the rankings and quality but that's FIFA not the fault of the competing nations.

The US was garbage this cycle, obviously. But they were head and shoulders above the other CONCACAF nations the past three cycles. I fail to see the correlation here.
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I actually think the Dutch are a bit hard done by here, missing out on the play-offs on GD when they actually bested Sweden H2H (2-0 win at home, 1-1 draw away). For me, the tiebreakers should change and that should take precedent, that's more telling over who is the more deserving side for me than who scores the most goals against the likes of Luxembourg and Belarus.

And yes, absolutely agreed that the CONCACAF has too many spots. I understand that they need to have a diversity of teams at the WC, but most of all it should be competitive and a team like Panama is probably going to get smashed compared to if one of the bigger European/South American teams who'll miss out were there.
 
El cagrejo said:
Isn't the Mexican national team way more popular than the USMNT (and any other sports team in the US)?
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And the Mexican league gets television ratings that rivals the NBA in the US. And up to the 2010 World Cup games involving the US would often get some of the lowest US television ratings of the World Cup.
 
It's a blessing that the US didn't qualify. Perhaps now the the nation will have some introspection and realise how biased the USSF is when it comes to showering the MLS with all the funds they have.

Bruce Arena was a joke of an appointment made only in the knowledge that he would favour home based players over better overseas players (I'm sure you'll agree that Zardes would have played if not for injury).

The US can't keep putting their eggs in the MLS basket in the hopes of breaking the major league strongholds of NBA, NFL, NHL and MLB, is it surprising that the majority of soccer fans in the US would rather wake up at the crack of dawn to watch foreign leagues than the artificially created MLS?

There's alot of things the US need to do but to begin with they need to invest widely in the US and not 22 specific "markets", they need to start heavily investing in the open cup which would allow more interest from fans who don't have a connection to the established structure, and finally perhaps not turn up their noses to latino/hispanic managers and playing styles.
 
US problem this cycle is the same problem the Dutch have. They both had lost generations. For the US everyone was either too young or too old. Very few guys in their "prime ages" and the ones who are are not good enough.
 
At least we wont have to worry now whether the Americans stand, kneel, sit down during their national anthem or even sing it.
 
:lol: at the US not qualifying. When your "star" players collect inflated salaries in MLS and your idea of player development is to scour Germany for the offspring of US servicemen you get here at some point.
 
Sly said:
You disappoint me barros and we are not talking politics this time.

The only time i suffered as much as club level was in the Euro2004 final. Even so the biggest heartbreak was when we lost the UEFA Cup final against CSKA at home. Nothing comes close.
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I was at the stadium for the CSKA game :( that Rogério goal...

Still, country over club for me too. I got more nervous for last year's final than I've ever been for a Sporting game.
 
Probably been asked a lot but when would the qualifiers be?
 
Keeps It tidy said:
US problem this cycle is the same problem the Dutch have. They both had lost generations. For the US everyone was either too young or too old. Very few guys in their "prime ages" and the ones who are are not good enough.
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Lost generation? If Landon Donovan is your best player the last 10 year, I wouldn’t call it a lost generation like it’s something lost. USA suck at soccer
 
beergod said:
:lol: at the US not qualifying. When your "star" players collect inflated salaries in MLS and your idea of player development is to scour Germany for the offspring of US servicemen you get here at some point.
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Exactly. Even after this calamity, you have idiots like Arena and Gulati trumpeting the MLS as the future of the USMNT. They all need to go, and the freakshow marriage between the USF and the MLS needs to end.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
And the Mexican league gets television ratings that rivals the NBA in the US. And up to the 2010 World Cup games involving the US would often get some of the lowest US television ratings of the World Cup.
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They do??? In what country besides Mexico? Certainly not the US unless we're talking about Telemundo or Univision perhaps.

The latter part doesn't matter now days as the US matches drew higher ratings than previously.
 
I'm getting sick of people bemoaning that this is the last we'll see of Dempsey, Howard, etc. The 2010 gang (who weren't exactly world-class in their pomp) are the REASON we lost to T&T, along with the coaching staff who are content to trot out the geriatric ward out of some bizarre sort of loyalty.
 
Borat Sagdiyev said:
Yeah that's totally farcical (re: NBA), but they do outdraw EPL and MLS.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-soccer-baxter-20160501-story.html
http://www.startribune.com/in-the-u-s-most-eyes-glued-to-mexico-s-liga-mx/435947653/
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Telemundo and Univision count in US television ratings??? Because I'm not aware of Liga MX on Fox Sports or NBC Sports or ESPN. I think they did have a mass-televised event recently for the hurricanes and all.

That said, I've often wondered why Liga MX wasn't pushed to a wider audience in the US, specifically in English.
 
MrMarcello said:
Telemundo and Univision count in US television ratings??? Because I'm not aware of Liga MX on Fox Sports or NBC Sports or ESPN. I think they did have a mass-televised event recently for the hurricanes and all.

That said, I've often wondered why Liga MX wasn't pushed to a wider audience in the US, specifically in English.
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The US viewers count for US ratings.

But you're right that only EPL/MLS are promoted on English channels.
 
El cagrejo said:
Isn't the Mexican national team way more popular than the USMNT (and any other sports team in the US)?
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My ex-brother in law has been a Mexico supporter for a very long time. He's as white American redneck as you can get too. I don't get it.

On another note, almost 24 hours later and I'm over the fact the USA did not qualify. In an attempt to make myself feel better I re-watched 2014 Brazil vs Germany semi final this morning and thought about how the Brazilian fans must have felt after that beating.
 
Samid said:
There are currently 20 European teams and 6 CONMEBOL teams in the top 32 of the FIFA ranking. Goes without saying that these two continents are head and shoulders above the others and are getting heavily undervalued with only 13 (plus Russia) and 4.5 spots. In an ideal world the 32 best teams in the world would qualify for the World Cup irrespective of continent.
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Ideal for who?

The world cup has given exposure to a number of countries from different continents.

That's the beauty of the world cup. We would just watch watch the Euros if we wanted to watch 20 plus European teams.
 
James Peril said:
Lost generation? If Landon Donovan is your best player the last 10 year, I wouldn’t call it a lost generation like it’s something lost. USA suck at soccer
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I would just call Landon Donovan unlucky to be born in US.
 
NecssryEvil said:
Unfortunately for us Americans that love the sport, the USMNT will never be competitive at the world level while it languishes in the 4th to 6th range of overall popularity. I came to post something about that but MrMarcello said it very well:



Two anecdotes:

When I was a little kid in the early 70's, nearly every kid in the neighborhood played soccer. At least until they were about 10, then none of my friends played. They were all playing throwball, baseball or basketball. In fact, playing soccer was shunned, not only by the other kids but by gym teachers and coaches of other sports. Not to mention some parents unrealistic ideas of their kids being the next Mantle, Hornung or Russell and refusing to let their kids play that sissy sport. I had a middle school teacher basically insinuate those of us who played soccer were gay (plays soccer cuz he gives good head, stupid shyte like that). A teacher! A grown ass man in charge of "molding the minds" of the kids. Which partly leads to...

On my ride in to work today, the local sports radio station spent about 3-4 minutes talking about the USMNT being eliminated. Know that this is the only 3-4 minutes I have heard them talk about the sport in months. No scores, no news, nothing. And, the only thing they really had to say was "who cares", "it's boring". They went on to saying that they only think of it on occasion, like the Olympics, and specifically brought up a comparison with 4-man bobsled. That they only found it slightly interesting at the time, as a novelty, and could care less the rest of the time. They then stuck the knife in to end the segment saying that if there was a 4-man bobsled league, they would probably watch that over soccer (as long as it only lasted about two weeks, between the Super Bowl and BB spring training). That will be the last I hear for probably the next couple years.

So, let me ask you, if you were a kid listening to that on your way to school, would you stand up to your friends and defend your love for the sport when you know what the grownups are saying? The answer, in most cases, is no. You conform to the popular opinion or be ostracized. Middle school/high school is tough enough to navigate without that to deal with and the other sports are fun to play too.

I wish that soccer was the main sport in America. I love it and I think the US has the athletes that we could in time have a legitimate shot at reaching the QFs in the big tourneys. And, within 50 years, maybe even compete beyond that! Sad that that will never happen in my lifetime.
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Nail on the head. Isn't this a very old state of affairs? I suspect it's not a coincidence that the US also isn't into Cricket and Rugby. I suspect some kind of post-Independence rejection of English sports and the invention of US versions as some sort of assertion of cultural superiority and independence, with denigrating English sports as an inherited culture from that. I can't see it ever changing except for the demographic shift towards Hispanics and their passion for football.
 
Have people seen this ?

Colombia's Radamel Falcao admits discussing draw with Peru's Renato Tapia

www.skysports.com/football/news/29909/11077007/colombias-radamel-falcao-admits-discussing-draw-with-perus-renato-tapia


Falcao said after the game: "We knew what was happening in the other matches, we were playing with (the knowledge of) the other results and in that moment (I tried) to transmit that (to Peru)."

Tapia also admitted in an interview on Wednesday that he had discussed the result of the game with Falcao but denied that any deal had been brokered on the pitch.

"In the last five minutes, the Colombians approached us. They knew what the situation was in the other games," Tapia told Panamericana TV.

"So we managed the game as we needed to... I spoke with Radamel, who told me we were both qualified (as things stood), but it's football and we play to win."


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I was away in Portugal on a bit of business and I saw the Wales V Ireland game in the Pub. Great result by the Republic of Ireland.
 
Blackwidow said:
The name of it is the World Cup... How did he perform the recent three World Cups he participated in?

13 matches - 3 goals against the mighty Iran, North Korea and Ghana... :cool: - not to forget - 2 assists against North Korea and the USA.
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Dont forget eliminating England all on his own in 2006 as well :lol:, Messi cant claim that. (yet)
 
Blackwidow said:
The name of it is the World Cup... How did he perform the recent three World Cups he participated in?

13 matches - 3 goals against the mighty Iran, North Korea and Ghana... :cool: - not to forget - 2 assists against North Korea and the USA.
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Hey, don’t forget that he lucked his way to an EC with probably the least convincing team performance ever!
 
fcbforever said:
Hey, don’t forget that he lucked his way to an EC with probably the least convincing team performance ever!
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Well he might have done it back in 2008 with better performances had proper rules been applied...

And for all the crying about our luck nobody seemed to care about our lack of luck in 2004 or 2012 either.
 
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