I like someone approaching politics and policy with data in an era where we're used to seeing shite spouted on a regular basis, but as daft as it may seem I also think politicians have to be careful not to become too dependent on data: politics is ultimately going to be ideological to a certain extent, especially when you consider the different ways in which sets of data can be interpreted depending on your perspective, and I think that's something any politician has to consider. And I wonder if the issue with Yang as someone (seemingly) new to this game is that he may not understand that. Although time will tell.
Yang 2020
- Thread starter Pogue Mahone
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I like someone approaching politics and policy with data in an era where we're used to seeing shite spouted on a regular basis, but as daft as it may seem I also think politicians have to be careful not to become too dependent on data: politics is ultimately going to be ideological to a certain extent, especially when you consider the different ways in which sets of data can be interpreted depending on your perspective, and I think that's something any politician has to consider. And I wonder if the issue with Yang as someone (seemingly) new to this game is that he may not understand that. Although time will tell.
I was answering the bolded part which is incorrect. No where in Europe are more people dying than being born.
I haven't seen his Rogan interview yet but I like his approach and hope over time some his ideas gain traction. 2020 is too early for him but you never know!
It has happened in Portugal for 10 years in a row now,it's a well known phenomenon. And other countries too, I'm sure (quick google search confirms it has happened in Greece and Scotland, for example).
Caused by extremely low birth rate and aging, as life expectancy has continuously gone up.
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I read somewhere the EU had more deaths than births in 2017
Consider me wrong and corrected then.
You are correct, for 2016 at least so 2017 is probably also true. At the same time governments are shutting down borders to immigrants...
Immigration will be a necessity, whether people like it or not. Projections in Portugal point to 7 million in 2080 (we're currently above 10 million, and these estimates include immigration, not just births-deaths). And while population decrease per se shouldn't be a problem, aging certainly is, as social security will crumble.
Well, I guess we can always count on robots to take care of us dependent old men, and create enough wealth to go around. Perhaps this automation will turn indeed into a blessing rather than a plague.
Fair enough. Mind you, Biden might have a chance at the nomination, but I doubt he has any real chance of ousting Trump.
Reading through his policies there's a lot to agree with, thinly veiled UBI bribe notwithstanding. Unfortunately they don't matter. Nobody with that surname is getting elected in the US any time soon.
I'm sure people were saying the same about Obama.
Bit different, as I'm sure you're aware.
I’m not aware actually. Why would an African surname be electable but an Asian surname not?
Americans don't generally view Africa as a threat.
Pogue is right
Surely Andrew Yang is much preferable name to have, compared to Barrack Hussein Obama. If you are preparing to run for office.
His middle name was Hussein and it's one letter from Osama. The type of people this would matter to hate Muslim's above all else and nothing screams Muslim quite like the guy who did 9/11.
Yang has a lot of problems in 2020. That isn't really one of them.
Yang a worse name for generic American voter appeal than Barrack Hussein Obama!
Are you having a laugh, @11101?
There really is a Ying Yang Twins pun in there somewhere, sadly I can't find it at the moment.
Its Yin not ying
Issues with Obama's name were limited to the racist backwaters of America. Distrust of China is a majority viewpoint.
no its not
Heard his take on Freakonomics podcast as well. Completely worth a listen.
http://freakonomics.com/podcast/andrew-yang/
http://freakonomics.com/podcast/andrew-yang/
Think he's an idiot. But then I said the same of Trump so he'll probably win.
He’s clearly not an idiot.
He sounds like an interesting guy. I've seen his name mentioned a few times on Reddit too.
He seems a bit dense to me. He's been a running joke around my circles since we discovered #YangGang. He seems like the result of a polling agency asking what policies are popular with 18-30 year olds and making that their platform.
Have you heard him talk?
Yang should take that as a compliment of the highest order
I have, seems like really genuine guy with a way of viewing the world I don’t agree with. The idiot thing was a bit far but I can’t remember a single policy of his I read that didn’t make me think this guy is either trolling or an idiot.
His personal qualities and UBI could make him a big contender though (as you know I don’t agree with it, but it’s obviously very popular right now).
Fortunately for him he hasn’t fallen far enough to a place where he has to care what I think.
Yang doesn't support a $15 wage.
On the other hand Sanders doesn't think UBI is doable right now. You could make an argument that the UBI would cover the no 15/hr issue.
If that's the case, then the Finland experiment should give him pause.
The way most western countries deal with that "soft landing" now is unemployment allowance. To me it makes sense to beef that up instead of applying a UBI, if you are imagining a transition situation. It would both cost less and not get rid of very important things like the child allowance. I'm skpetical that his vision has any more benefits for local businesses in the context of automation than continuing with a strong version of the present welfare system.
It is slightly more dystopian since other welfare program are designed to target and help people with specific needs - healthcare doesn't give you a voucher, it gives you a doctor. Child allowance is a specific allowance so that you can buy things for your baby. A UBI with the "rationalisation" of other benefits will marginally improve many lives while negatively impacting those who need resources most.
More importantly, my scenario where the govt starts owning private stock as a form of wealth or corporate tax, will provide a sustainable source of revenue to the govt, preventing the unchecked expansion of private fortunes (unlike his regressive VAT). In a UBI you can have the exact type of dystopian sci-fi inequality I talked about, with a vast number barely getting by on a single cheque and some very wealthy people, essentially 2 worlds. With my system, there should be more resources available to allow the majority to do something either productive or fun.
I think thats Yang reasoning as well. Although theres a catch(yin and yang situation,I'm so sorry) Yang wants to replace current benefits with this UBI and he doesn't support free health care or collage. The $1000 dollars a month is the end game situation where with Bernie a $15 wage is just one stepping stone.
That will be an interesting part of the debate. Certainly better than the “I’m for good things and against bad things” crap some of the others will be offering
Why would you think UBI has anything to do with minimum wage?
Edit: though most UBI proposals actually work to adding $5 to minimum wage...which should kinda mean the same. $1000/25 days/ 8 hrs.
As the latter part of your post suggests, it makes up for a lack of adequate wages to live on. That’s not to say wages shouldn’t be higher.