Evra accuses Suarez of racist remarks | Suarez guilty of racial abuse

Rumour is there are going to be shirts with the tagline Let's Kick Racism (and Liverpool) Out of Football.

And there will be versions with Terry, Chelsea and Suarez in the tagline as well.
 
Apparently Stan Collymore was getting so much stick from the 'pool fans that he didnt want to bother talking about it much tonight.
 
VanNistelrater said:
But hasn't he admitted it? Hence all this guff about it being culturally acceptable to be massive racist in Uraguay. If not, I doubt they'd have given an 8 match ban without evidence from a third party of some sort, since it's open to appeal and everything...
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Errrrmmm... you are not getting it. Most "civilised" countries seem to have a chip on their shoulder about race. Let me put it this way: slavery was brought by Europeans, it was abolished in Uruguay in 1815, heroes from our Wars of Independence were black people (no idea how I'm supposed to call them "people of African origin"? feck that), black people could vote here waaay before they could in "civilised nations" and waaay before these went into massive wars over race (among other things), most of the population is mixed race to some extent...

Calling someone black here is not an issue. Calling them negrito is purely referring to something distinct about them in an affectionate way. I call a lot of friends "negrito" and it's a total non-issue. Recoba was called "the Chinese guy" based on his slit eyes, I have a cousin I call Chino on the same basis, feck all meaning behind that. Indio is another popular nickname. For the most part, among the mix of races in someone when one prevails more that person gets nicknamed along those lines. Ginger people are called Colo (colorado = red). Likewise, fat people are called fat, and thin people are called skinny. Not a single person gives a shit about it, it's a way of identifying people, no more than that.

I know, many read the above and think it is outrageously racist but do for one minute consider what's the big deal if the terms are not "charged" in a negative way at all. It is not being a massive racist to say that in Uruguay. There is simply nowt wrong about it. Nobody cares.

That said, Suarez is playing the culture card here when obviously he has been in Europe long enough to realise it's not on to use certain terms and he surely didn't say it to Evra affectionately. That I don't buy at all.
 
I don't know if it's just my experience but the radio and tv seem to have given the FA their backing on their verdict but the print media are full of "Liverpool outrage" despite the slimy little fecker being found guilty of a serious charge. That feckin weasel whatsisname in the Guardian is actually turning the negative focus onto Evra - but that hardly surprises me with that awful rag who's only readership are teachers or similarly blinkered.
 
Denis' cuff said:
That feckin weasel whatsisname in the Guardian is actually turning the negative focus onto Evra - but that hardly surprises me with that awful rag who's only readership are teachers or similarly blinkered.
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:lol: You what?...Yeah those fecking teachers...oooh I hate them.

Incidentally, do you mean this article? Vindication does not come without a downside for Patrice Evra | Football | The Guardian

The one that actually highlights Liverpool's witch hunting of Evra and points out that all the "previous accusations" are rubbish...That one?

But Evra never cited racism in the Chelsea case, contrary to what you may have read elsewhere. Liverpool's extraordinary statement referred to Evra having no credibility and used as an example his "prior unfounded accusations". Except it was Mike Phelan, United's assistant manager, and Richard Hartis, the goalkeeping coach, who purported to hear the word "immigrant" used at Stamford Bridge. The story that it was Evra has gathered so much momentum now that even the usually reliable Press Association presented it as fact. Liverpool, they said, were referring to "racism allegations Evra made against Chelsea groundsman Sam Bethell, which were not proven".

The truth is something completely different. Likewise, Evra kept his distance when two deaf United fans complained they had lip‑read Steve Finnan making a racist remark to him during a Liverpool-United game in 2006. The simple truth is that Evra has complained of being racially abused only once before, and that was the 1-1 draw at Anfield on 15 October.

If this were politics, it would be described as a smear campaign. Perhaps, if this were not United versus Liverpool and two such high-profile players, Evra might even be congratulated for having the courage to stand up to what Paul Goulding QC and his colleagues have now identified as racism, subject to a possible appeal.
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Tell me, have you ever read the Guardian?...I know the Daily Mail has much nicer pictures of dogs, but it's articles aren't nearly as good.
 
Mockney said:
:lol: You what?...Yeah those fecking teachers...oooh I hate them.

Incidentally, do you mean this article? Vindication does not come without a downside for Patrice Evra | Football | The Guardian

The one that actually highlights Liverpool's witch hunting of Evra and points out that all the "previous accusations" are rubbish...That one?



Tell me, have you ever read the Guardian?...I know the Daily Mail has much nicer pictures of dogs, but it's articles aren't nearly as good.
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I used to feckin print it mate and I'm less concvinced than you re: the bold bit

having said that, no, I didn't read the piece and admittedly am responding to the headline, which, of course is fatal. I do try to avoid the rag and saw the heading on newsnow but you're probably being a bit selective nonetheless.
 
Back when it was the Grauniad and based in Manc? Before my time I'm afraid so I can't comment on it then but I read it now and think it's got the best editorial writers in the country. It's left leaning of course but that's my bent.

Different strokes I suppose.
 
antohan said:
Errrrmmm... you are not getting it. Most "civilised" countries seem to have a chip on their shoulder about race. Let me put it this way: slavery was brought by Europeans, it was abolished in Uruguay in 1815, heroes from our Wars of Independence were black people (no idea how I'm supposed to call them "people of African origin"? feck that), black people could vote here waaay before they could in "civilised nations" and waaay before these went into massive wars over race (among other things), most of the population is mixed race to some extent...

Calling someone black here is not an issue. Calling them negrito is purely referring to something distinct about them in an affectionate way. I call a lot of friends "negrito" and it's a total non-issue. Recoba was called "the Chinese guy" based on his slit eyes, I have a cousin I call Chino on the same basis, feck all meaning behind that. Indio is another popular nickname. For the most part, among the mix of races in someone when one prevails more that person gets nicknamed along those lines. Ginger people are called Colo (colorado = red). Likewise, fat people are called fat, and thin people are called skinny. Not a single person gives a shit about it, it's a way of identifying people, no more than that.

I know, many read the above and think it is outrageously racist but do for one minute consider what's the big deal if the terms are not "charged" in a negative way at all. It is not being a massive racist to say that in Uruguay. There is simply nowt wrong about it. Nobody cares.

That said, Suarez is playing the culture card here when obviously he has been in Europe long enough to realise it's not on to use certain terms and he surely didn't say it to Evra affectionately. That I don't buy at all.
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If what Suarez said is acceptable in Uruguay and unacceptable in England, why do the Uruguayans have a problem with that, and the consequences for Suarez? I ask because they seem to be defensive over the verdict, just like Liverpool.
 
Mockney said:
Back when it was the Grauniad and based in Manc? Before my time I'm afraid so I can't comment on it then but I read it now and think it's got the best editorial writers in the country. It's left leaning of course but that's my bent.

Different strokes I suppose.
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that was even before my time but along with most other nationals it was still printed here when I worked there. Originally exclusively Manc, then became national and now feck all is done in Manc. Three main centres were London, M/c, Glasgow. Then they closed Glasgow and we got flooded with Jocks then along came Eddie Shah and Rupie closed us down too.
 
surf said:
If what Suarez said is acceptable in Uruguay and unacceptable in England, why do the Uruguayans have a problem with that, and the consequences for Suarez? I ask because they seem to be defensive over the verdict, just like Liverpool.
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It would be easy to say you've answered your question (i.e. it is acceptable in Uruguay so Suarez is seen to be victimised). Most people here have not been much beyond borders and simply cannot see what is the issue with calling black black and so on.

There's a bit more to it in that we obviously have a soft spot for him, people were happy that he was doing well and even before the whole Evra thing came about the media here were pointing at Suarez being subjected to a witch hunt (over diving).

The view here is not that he is a cheat, but that, admittedly, he is a nightmare for defenders and very good at drawing fouls (which pisses people off, but is legal).

In fairness to Suarez, over a month ago he did say in an interview here exactly what he had said, and mentioned some other United players referred to Paddy in the same way affectionately (I'm still baffled at this claim) so he saw nowt wrong with it.

However, I have seen a lot of people in the media here pointing out he needs to channel his temper in a positive way, etc. (much the way Roo is usually singled out) and pointing out to prior incidents like the ear-biting. No one condones the middle finger and there's all-round consensus that in the middle of the racism investigation it was idiotic.
 
surf said:
If what Suarez said is acceptable in Uruguay and unacceptable in England, why do the Uruguayans have a problem with that, and the consequences for Suarez? I ask because they seem to be defensive over the verdict, just like Liverpool.
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good point. their defense is 'in Uruguay'. Suarez isn't in Uruguay you idiots. Why are people so thick? I'm tired of people making something that it's not. He stepped out of line and he's getting punished. End of. Get over it.

It really shows that the argument that people dont care until the problem is in their own back yard is so prevalent. In their case, a fellow countryman
 
antohan said:
Errrrmmm... you are not getting it. Most "civilised" countries seem to have a chip on their shoulder about race. Let me put it this way: slavery was brought by Europeans, it was abolished in Uruguay in 1815, heroes from our Wars of Independence were black people (no idea how I'm supposed to call them "people of African origin"? feck that), black people could vote here waaay before they could in "civilised nations" and waaay before these went into massive wars over race (among other things), most of the population is mixed race to some extent...

Calling someone black here is not an issue. Calling them negrito is purely referring to something distinct about them in an affectionate way. I call a lot of friends "negrito" and it's a total non-issue. Recoba was called "the Chinese guy" based on his slit eyes, I have a cousin I call Chino on the same basis, feck all meaning behind that. Indio is another popular nickname. For the most part, among the mix of races in someone when one prevails more that person gets nicknamed along those lines. Ginger people are called Colo (colorado = red). Likewise, fat people are called fat, and thin people are called skinny. Not a single person gives a shit about it, it's a way of identifying people, no more than that.

I know, many read the above and think it is outrageously racist but do for one minute consider what's the big deal if the terms are not "charged" in a negative way at all. It is not being a massive racist to say that in Uruguay. There is simply nowt wrong about it. Nobody cares.

That said, Suarez is playing the culture card here when obviously he has been in Europe long enough to realise it's not on to use certain terms and he surely didn't say it to Evra affectionately. That I don't buy at all.
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That sounds about right. Suarez wasn't found guilty because the panel didn't believe that the term negrito (although it sounds like he used the term negro rather than negrito) can be used in his home country in a non-racist way. He was found guilty because he was found guilty of abusing and winding Evra up using language that was designed to be insulting based on race. It is that simple.
 
antohan said:
It would be easy to say you've answered your question (i.e. it is acceptable in Uruguay so Suarez is seen to be victimised). Most people here have not been much beyond borders and simply cannot see what is the issue with calling black black and so on.

There's a bit more to it in that we obviously have a soft spot for him, people were happy that he was doing well and even before the whole Evra thing came about the media here were pointing at Suarez being subjected to a witch hunt (over diving).

The view here is not that he is a cheat, but that, admittedly, he is a nightmare for defenders and very good at drawing fouls (which pisses people off, but is legal).

In fairness to Suarez, over a month ago he did say in an interview here exactly what he had said, and mentioned some other United players referred to Paddy in the same way affectionately (I'm still baffled at this claim) so he saw nowt wrong with it.

However, I have seen a lot of people in the media here pointing out he needs to channel his temper in a positive way, etc. (much the way Roo is usually singled out) and pointing out to prior incidents like the ear-biting. No one condones the middle finger and there's all-round consensus that in the middle of the racism investigation it was idiotic.
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Good response. Maybe you can be the spokesman for Uruguay in future, instead of Poyet.
 
I read about the t-shirts today but I thought it was just some fans on the internet talking about how it would be a great idea to wear them tonight. Then I was sitting in the bar and actually saw them wearing them... holy feck. A club full of spastics. I wonder how many players desperately didn't want to have to wear one of those cringeworthy tshirts tonight? I seriously cannot believe how fecking embarrassing Liverpool Football Club is. Imagine supporting those twats. Kenny Dalglish you utter, utter cnut.

Some hilarious posts in this thread tonight, especially from Olly. And MUFCgal pointing out how much of an absolute gimp Dalglish looks :lol: so true..

Good result for Liverpool tonight aswell...
 
antohan said:
Errrrmmm... you are not getting it. Most "civilised" countries seem to have a chip on their shoulder about race. Let me put it this way: slavery was brought by Europeans, it was abolished in Uruguay in 1815, heroes from our Wars of Independence were black people (no idea how I'm supposed to call them "people of African origin"? feck that), black people could vote here waaay before they could in "civilised nations" and waaay before these went into massive wars over race (among other things), most of the population is mixed race to some extent...

Calling someone black here is not an issue. Calling them negrito is purely referring to something distinct about them in an affectionate way. I call a lot of friends "negrito" and it's a total non-issue. Recoba was called "the Chinese guy" based on his slit eyes, I have a cousin I call Chino on the same basis, feck all meaning behind that. Indio is another popular nickname. For the most part, among the mix of races in someone when one prevails more that person gets nicknamed along those lines. Ginger people are called Colo (colorado = red). Likewise, fat people are called fat, and thin people are called skinny. Not a single person gives a shit about it, it's a way of identifying people, no more than that.

I know, many read the above and think it is outrageously racist but do for one minute consider what's the big deal if the terms are not "charged" in a negative way at all. It is not being a massive racist to say that in Uruguay. There is simply nowt wrong about it. Nobody cares.

That said, Suarez is playing the culture card here when obviously he has been in Europe long enough to realise it's not on to use certain terms and he surely didn't say it to Evra affectionately. That I don't buy at all.
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You're seriously suggesting there's no racism in Uruguay?

Everyone understands that 'negro' [and even negrito though that's apparently not what was said] can be used without it being racist.
 
Wibble said:
That sounds about right. Suarez wasn't found guilty because the panel didn't believe that the term negrito (although it sounds like he used the term negro rather than negrito) can be used in his home country in a non-racist way. He was found guilty because he was found guilty of abusing and winding Evra up using language that was designed to be insulting based on race. It is that simple.
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Get this man a gold star.
 
Liverpool actually posted a video from a documentary of Suarez in Africa on their official twitter feed.

Think about it. This is how low they've sunk. Do they even have a PR team? :lol:




I dare Suarez to go to Africa and call any one of those people a "ne***" to their face and then say it's OK to use it in his country. I dare him.
 
Ole's_toe_poke said:
Liverpool actually posted a video from a documentary of Suarez in Africa on their official twitter feed.

Think about it. This is how low they've sunk. Do they even have a PR team? :lol:




I dare Suarez to go to Africa and call any one of those people a "ne***" to their face and then say it's OK to use it in his country. I dare him.
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That sounds like a fair test of the case to me. Let's have Suarez go around England and call black people 'negro' and see what happens. If he's fine, he's off the charges.

He can recoup his legal fees from the proceeds of the reality tv show it could result in.
 
Raoul said:
Apparently Suarez and the dippers are going to appeal and the process could drag on long enough for him to be available for the Man City game on the 3rd of Jan.
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Jeez, they set up a special panel with people agreed upon by both sides, where do you appeal from that? Will they take it to FIFA and that sports tribunal?

Suarez could play out the whole season without sitting if the sporting legal process is anything like the real thing.
 
Wibble said:
That sounds about right. Suarez wasn't found guilty because the panel didn't believe that the term negrito (although it sounds like he used the term negro rather than negrito) can be used in his home country in a non-racist way. He was found guilty because he was found guilty of abusing and winding Evra up using language that was designed to be insulting based on race. It is that simple.
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Precisely
 
surf said:
Good response. Maybe you can be the spokesman for Uruguay in future, instead of Poyet.
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And here I was wondering who all these Uruguayans Edmeiste refers to were.

Poyet, fecking hell, he hasn't lived in Uruguay for about 20 years yet what he says is what "the uruguayans" say.
 
gooDevil said:
You're seriously suggesting there's no racism in Uruguay?

Everyone understands that 'negro' [and even negrito though that's apparently not what was said] can be used without it being racist.
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I don't mean there is no racism per se, although I would say it is usually more associated with foreigners/nationalities than skin colours.

My point is the PC-brigade would have a hard time here. People are not offended by accurate descriptive words, we don't attach a derogatory meaning to them. Negro just means black and feck all else. If you want to offend a black guy you call him negro puto, for example, but it is not the negro that offends him, it's the puto.
 
antohan said:
There's a bit more to it in that we obviously have a soft spot for him, people were happy that he was doing well and even before the whole Evra thing came about the media here were pointing at Suarez being subjected to a witch hunt (over diving).

The view here is not that he is a cheat, but that, admittedly, he is a nightmare for defenders and very good at drawing fouls (which pisses people off, but is legal).
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He's a diver. Plain and simple. If you can't see that, you're not watching the game.

antohan said:
In fairness to Suarez, over a month ago he did say in an interview here exactly what he had said, and mentioned some other United players referred to Paddy in the same way affectionately (I'm still baffled at this claim) so he saw nowt wrong with it.

However, I have seen a lot of people in the media here pointing out he needs to channel his temper in a positive way, etc. (much the way Roo is usually singled out) and pointing out to prior incidents like the ear-biting. No one condones the middle finger and there's all-round consensus that in the middle of the racism investigation it was idiotic.
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Like fighting with a team mate at half time because he took a free kick or biting another man on the shoulder?

Honestly, you're making his point. The people of your country are not acting much differently than LFC followers.

Understandable but try not to make a pile of shit smell like a rose. He's a talented football player but trash as far as a human being.
 
Olly said:
YC97g.jpg
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has to be on every page of this thread several times :lol::lol:
 
antohan said:
I don't mean there is no racism per se, although I would say it is usually more associated with foreigners/nationalities than skin colours.

My point is the PC-brigade would have a hard time here. People are not offended by accurate descriptive words, we don't attach a derogatory meaning to them. Negro just means black and feck all else. If you want to offend a black guy you call him negro puto, for example, but it is not the negro that offends him, it's the puto.
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That's not what I've read and I really can't believe that. I'm sure it's used in a pleasant way, but I can't believe it isn't used in a negative way as well.
 
Seems like their players responded well yesterday and the siege mentality tactic seem to have worked.

Oh wait...
 
I have been avoiding posting in this thread - i do not know the grounds on which the decision has been made. But... i want to believe the the comity had strong body of evidence to defend their verdict. I hope they will make known to the general public.

On Suarez- i don't know if he is a racist. I don't think he is, but that's not the case. Suarez proved that he is an big caliber idiot. I know that footballers give each other stick during a game, kicking, insulting etc is common but he should have been wiser with his choice of words.

To sum up - is he a racist? I don't know. Is he an idiot? yes, full stop.
 
Luis Suarez set to appeal against eight-match race ban

Liverpool striker Luis Suarez will appeal against his Football Association punishment for racially abusing Patrice Evra, according to his lawyer.

Alejandro Balbi, who is also Suarez's agent, said his player was "convinced" the punishment would be reversed.

Suarez was handed an eight-game ban and £40,000 fine after he used "insulting words in reference to Manchester United defender Evra's colour".

"It seems to us absolutely out of proportion," Balbi said.


"It's one of the hardest sanctions handed down in English football.

"He [Suarez] is firmly convinced this hard sanction can be reversed."

Speaking at a news conference in Uruguay capital Montevideo, Balbi said that it would be Liverpool's lawyers who made the appeal to the FA.

Suarez, who denied the allegations, has 14 days to launch his appeal against the decision. Should he do so, there is a possibility length of the ban could be increased.

The FA handed the sanctions to Suarez after a six-day hearing found he racially abused Evra in the 1-1 draw at Anfield on 15 October.

The Liverpool players warmed up for Wednesday night's game at Wigan wearing t-shirts in support of Suarez and also released a statement declaring their backing for the 24-year-old.

The Uruguayan Football Association has also offered Suarez and Liverpool whatever backing they need for an appeal, and Suarez has received support from Uruguay captain Diego Lugano.
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SELECTED FOOTBALL BANS
Continue reading the main story
1964: David Layne, Peter Swan and Tony Kay (life bans for betting on their team to lose, later reduced to 7 years)
1988: Paul Davis (9 matches for punching opponent)
1995: Eric Cantona (9 months for attacking supporter)
1998: Paolo di Canio (11 matches for pushing referee)
2003: Mark Bosnich (9 months for failed drugs test)
2003: Rio Ferdinand (8 months for failing to take drugs test)
2005: David Prutton (10 matches for pushing referee)
 
Sunny Jim said:
I have been avoiding posting in this thread - i do not know the grounds on which the decision has been made. But... i want to believe the the comity had strong body of evidence to defend their verdict. I hope they will make known to the general public.

On Suarez- i don't know if he is a racist. I don't think he is, but that's not the case. Suarez proved that he is an big caliber idiot. I know that footballers give each other stick during a game, kicking, insulting etc is common but he should have been wiser with his choice of words.

To sum up - is he a racist? I don't know. Is he an idiot? yes, full stop.
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What Liverpool don't get is that he hasn't been accused, charged our found guilty of being a racist. There is no such offence, in football or in law. You are allowed to be a racist.

What you are not allowed to do is say racist things, whatever your motivation.
 
Mario Ballotelli: 'The FA are willing to ban someone based on one persons claim, with no video evidence? In that case, the whole Man Utd squad racially abused me

Knees Up Mother Brown - West Ham United FC Online: Forum; topic - Luis Suarez found guilty, John Terry charged
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:lol::lol:

There is very sensible and reasoned debate from pretty much every other football club in the PL. The thread from the West Ham site (above), a club with some proper football fans, is a credit to themselves, given the fans had a history steeped in racism during the 1970s/early 1980s.
 
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