Cina
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I think Bale would be amazing here. We have a tendency to bring wingers in and make them into class players and the same would probably happen with him, we just don't really "need" him.
I think Bale would be amazing here. We have a tendency to bring wingers in and make them into class players and the same would probably happen with him, we just don't really "need" him.
No, we dont. But being a winger, itd be foolhardy to bet against us signing him at some point. Id be delighted tbh.
Er .... Bale is not a striker, so why would you expect him to score 25+ goals?
However, last season he did score 12 goals and get 14 assists in all competitions (tho' stats fail to reveal his wider impact on games) ... which is not too shabby for a winger.
And where did I say I expect him to score 25+ goals? You haven't really answered my question, how is Bale's return last season make him a closer to world class player than Wayne Rooney? Rooney had 35 goals in total last season, he helped his team finish joint top last season only missing out on the title by goal difference. How exactly are Bale's achievements last season as a winger any better than a striker scoring 35 goals? Which is what you are insinuating by your "he's closer to world class as a LW than Rooney is as a striker" comment.
...
But the point is this: Rooney would certainly not feature in the world's best XI, and in the world's 2nd XI Bale would be more likely to feature than Rooney.
I'll be watching Bale with even more scrutiny thanks to you. We'll see if he's as "devastating" as you summarize him to be.
You certainly implied that Rooney's goal tally was his "world class" measure in comparison to Bale.
But the point is this: Rooney would certainly not feature in the world's best XI, and in the world's 2nd XI Bale would be morely likely to feature than Rooney.
You can argue if you like that this is due to a dearth of quality LWs as compared to strikers, but if "world class" has any meaning then it only has meaning in relation to specific player positions.
You certainly implied that Rooney's goal tally was his "world class" measure in comparison to Bale.
But the point is this: Rooney would certainly not feature in the world's best XI, and in the world's 2nd XI Bale would be morely likely to feature than Rooney.
You can argue if you like that this is due to a dearth of quality LWs as compared to strikers, but if "world class" has any meaning then it only has meaning in relation to specific player positions.
You certainly implied that Rooney's goal tally was his "world class" measure in comparison to Bale.
But the point is this: Rooney would certainly not feature in the world's best XI, and in the world's 2nd XI Bale would be morely likely to feature than Rooney.
You can argue if you like that this is due to a dearth of quality LWs as compared to strikers, but if "world class" has any meaning then it only has meaning in relation to specific player positions.
That's great, good for you....I see you are also speaking on behalf of the caf now...that's nice.
You obviously take exception to my choice of adjective, hence the little speech marks you nicely place either side of the offending word. If you have seen Bale in full flow over the last two years, there are quite a number of occasions this freak of nature has proved devastating to the opposing team. There was one the other night that kicked off this whole little discussion.
If it's the word that you don't like there are many others I could replace it with. Perhaps you would be good enough to offer me assistance?
No I was replying to your post about Bale is more closer to being world class as a LW than Rooney is to being a striker. A player who has scored 25+ league goals twice in the past 3 seasons I think has a better chance of being branded world class than Bale.
As for the world XI comments, what relevance has that with this discussion? As far as I'm concerned world class is down to the quality of the player not how high he would rank if we prepared a list of players in his position. Rooney is up against Messi & C.Ronaldo so he is never going to top that list yet if we think of left wing players I can't exactly say we have a lot of world class players around in that position. There will less players competing for a left or right wing position than as a striker so that doesn't mean anything as far as I'm concerned.
You have still to prove me that Bale's performances on the left wing have been better than Rooney's as a striker. Nani (12 goals, 13 assists) & Walcott (9 goals & 11 assists) all have similar stats and I wouldn't class either of them world class or close to Rooney but I'm sure you'll argue Bale's game goes behind stats like this....
Poor assumption. I speak on behalf of those who aren't as convinced as you are.
I just don't understand why such words as you've said before and "freak of nature" are necessary. It's not a big deal but honestly, I take your point less seriously because it just adds more bias to your argument. He's performed well on certain occasions. Does that not suffice? I think if the discussion was more casual I would probably care much less but based on the number of responses recently, I think it's actually a pretty serious discussion. So as a result, I think word choice does matter. You can still show you're a big fan of Bale and have a balanced argument.
You say: "A player who has scored 25+ league goals twice in the past 3 seasons I think has a better chance of being branded world class than Bale."
So if goals are your prime measure, does that mean we can rule out any midfielder or defender being properly described as world class?
You say that world class has nothing to do with how a "high [a player] would rank if we prepared a list of players in his position"
Frankly, that's ridiculous. It would mean that a player can be called world class in your view, even though there might be (for example) 20 players better than him in his position.
You say that neither Bale nor Nani are world class (let's forget Walcott, because he's obviously not a contender), which leads me to wonder if all LWs are precluded from being world class in your view ... simply because they don't score as many goals as Rooney.
It wasn't an assumption....I was taking the piss....lighten up. If it's not a big deal why make something out of it? You take my point less seriously because I use certain descriptive adjectives to reference a player's attributes? Thats a tad small-minded, it's trivial really. I included the "freak of nature" description to highlight this and you nicely tucked into the bait...well done.
As for bias, why would there be? I'm not connected to Bale in any way, shape or form....I rate him, but I recognise his limitations. I certainly don't have an agenda unlike certain posters I've observed recently.
Bale has "performed well on certain occasions," doesn't work for me because in my eyes he has performed more than just well on a number of occasions over the past 2 years. You say you want a balanced argument but people are not writing essays here? Perhaps you need to spend less time setting out little parameters that you expect others to adhere to when they post? Personally I'm not bothered in the slightest if you believe my opinion is flawed....your perogative.
Shit can get serious on here, most of the time it is just casual musings....to get petty about word choices just seems pointless....it's not a forum designed to adhere to the concept of Socratic thinking. You are his pupil though aren't you?
It has to do with your judgment of players being crap.
But the point is this: Rooney would certainly not feature in the world's best XI, and in the world's 2nd XI Bale would be morely likely to feature than Rooney.
Arsenal haven't played with a winger since Brian Marwood played in the 1989 league-winning side.Maybe. I think Bale would walk into Arsenal's side though, being a winger with a bit of end product - I wonder if you agree?
Arsenal haven't played with a winger since Brian Marwood played in the 1989 league-winning side.
Looks like Glaston made a big boo boo
http://www.fifa.com/ballondor/world11/index.html
voted for by 50000 professional footballers.
Thats quite a bit old, tbf.
Looks like Glaston made a big boo boo
http://www.fifa.com/ballondor/world11/index.html
voted for by 50000 professional footballers.
That world XI was named in January 2012, for performances of 2011. So yeah it is outdated, even if its the latest one.
I dont disagree with that at all. Glaston is an utter idiot and that is indisputable.Glaston's argument was that Bale is more likely to get voted into the world's second X1!?!? than Rooney. A stupid point when Rooney is in the reigning X1 and had one of his best seasons last time round, in terms of scoring anyway.
Incidentally do City and Chelsea become outdated champions in February?
I dont disagree with that at all. Glaston is an utter idiot and that is indisputable.
What a strange thing to say?![]()
Well if the world X1 one gets outdated after 10 months of it 12 months reign, then why not the Champions of Europe and England?
Seriously now...a world 11 is always matter of subjective opinion. If the same 50k people who voted for the best of 2011 were asked to vote again now, I bet we get a different 11. How you can equate that, to winning a league title which wasn't won based on the subjective opinion of 50k people is beyond me.
Looks like Glaston made a big boo boo
http://www.fifa.com/ballondor/world11/index.html
voted for by 50000 professional footballers.