Marouane Fellaini | 2013/14 Performances

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TheReligion said:
Anyone who sees Fellaini as an alternative Carrick knows beggar all
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TheReligion said:
I think the difference is he is an improvement to the squad. That's not even up for debate. We have retained all of our players and added to an area of weakness a player who is established in the premier league and internationally. Our squad is stronger with him than without him.

That's why I can't understand the blanket negativity.
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As an isolated signing and ignoring the price and other, better alternatives: Yes he makes our squad stronger, gives us another option and might slightly improve our first XI.

As a signing costing £27 million, and compared to what other targets we evidently looked at/could've looked at during the transfer window, I can see why a lot of people find his signing underwhelming/disappointing.

I'll hope for his success, but that's not to say I have to agree with the decision to bring him in for that price ahead of other options.
 
Cina said:
Mother of fecking God, I can't fathom how you are possibly coming to that conclusion, I said that it's just as bad of people to say he'll definitely make it (NOT be excited/optimistic) as it is to say he won't.
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And I'm saying it's not, not by any stretch of the imagination. Stop trying to reverse out of every single point!

All a bit of a moot point anyway - In reality , it's not really about "definitely writing him off" or "definitely being a success". Only a fool would think they had that prescience. It's about opinions, and mine is that I think he'll be a great success, and it saddens me that people think he'll probably flop (though they are entitled to the opinion).

Cina said:
Read my original post, I haven't detracted from it in any way yet apparently I'm a "sneaky coward" because I'm retracting on things that I never said in the first place. Right.
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No the reason I said you're acting like a coward is because you've got an obvious agenda, as evidenced by the fact that you are entirely arguing against anybody who thinks Fellaini will be a success. Do we need to go back and count the posts ffs?

Nobody's going to kill you if you say you don't think he'll make it... but they may argue against you, if you can handle that.
 
Sir A1ex said:
And I'm saying it's not, not by any stretch of the imagination. Stop trying to reverse out of every single point!

All a bit of a moot point anyway - In reality , it's not really about "definitely writing him off" or "definitely being a success". Only a fool would think they had that prescience. It's about opinions, and mine is that I think he'll be a great success, and it saddens me that people think he'll probably flop (though they are entitled to the opinion).



No the reason I said you're acting like a coward is because you've got an obvious agenda, as evidenced by the fact that you are entirely arguing against anybody who thinks Fellaini will be a success. Do we need to go back and count the posts ffs?

Nobody's going to kill you if you say you don't think he'll make it... but they may argue against you, if you can handle that.
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I'd just like to say, you and Cina have kept me entertained this afternoon, good show lads :lol: Funny how two people can argue a point when they are on the same side :lol:
 
Sir A1ex said:
No I wasn't, show me where I've done that.

You've got a serious problem with understanding the difference between these things (and, it would appear, a very under-developed concept of hypocrisy).
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You basically want him to hold off until "fellaini plays a fecking a match for us", which is completely moronic. Do you have any opinion of fellaini? If so, why the feck?? I mean, he hasn't even played a match for us yet! How. Could. You.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
You basically want him to hold off until "fellaini plays a fecking a match for us", which is completely moronic. Do you have any opinion of fellaini? If so, why the feck?? I mean, he hasn't even played a match for us yet! How. Could. You.
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Ah, I see what you've done there. Tip for next time... when directly and explicitly quoting somebody, check that the quote is actual from the person you say it is.
 
marjen said:
As an isolated signing and ignoring the price and other, better alternatives: Yes he makes our squad stronger, gives us another option and might slightly improve our first XI.

As a signing costing £27 million, and compared to what other targets we evidently looked at/could've looked at during the transfer window, I can see why a lot of people find his signing underwhelming/disappointing.

I'll hope for his success, but that's not to say I have to agree with the decision to bring him in for that price ahead of other options.
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Who else would you have advised then that we didn't look at?
 
Sir A1ex said:
Ah, I see what you've done there. Tip for next time... when directly and explicitly quoting somebody, check that the quote is actual from the person you say it is.
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Well, you spent an awful lot of time defending his post.
 
Sir A1ex said:
And I'm saying it's not, not by any stretch of the imagination. Stop trying to reverse out of every single point!

All a bit of a moot point anyway - In reality , it's not really about "definitely writing him off" or "definitely being a success". Only a fool would think they had that prescience. It's about opinions, and mine is that I think he'll be a great success, and it saddens me that people think he'll probably flop (though they are entitled to the opinion).



No the reason I said you're acting like a coward is because you've got an obvious agenda, as evidenced by the fact that you are entirely arguing against anybody who thinks Fellaini will be a success. Do we need to go back and count the posts ffs?

Nobody's going to kill you if you say you don't think he'll make it... but they may argue against you, if you can handle that.
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My first post wasn't aimed at anyone. You realize it's you and ramshock who started arguing with me?
 
Anyway, moving on from the forum police and returning to whether we think Fellaini's any good...

While he's clearly not going to be the new Robson or Keane (who is?), the "model" I have in mind is closer to Yaya Toure. No, I'm not saying that he's as good as Yaya (though I'm certainly not ruling out the possibility that he could become as good in a top team), but looking back at when Yaya was on the move to City, here are some quotes form this very forum (and not all from United fans either):

£28m? That's absolutely mental.

Man City have an ability sign non world class players at world class prices.

I've never been convinced that he has the all-round mobilty to hack it in the PL in a 2-man CM.

I haven't seen him much but whenever I have, he comes across as lacking in mobility. His passing doesn't seem to be top notch either. He seems to rely on his physicality a fair bit.​

The last one gives a definite sense of de-ja-vu, no? There were plenty of good comments too, but the fact is opinion of his ability was split at best.

Now, Yaya has been a massive, unqualified success, and probably City's most important player - and this is a man who was signed at the same time as talents like Silva. He's given them exactly what we've been missing, and he's done that without being close to being the new Roy Keane, Bryan Robson, or even Patrick Vieira.

Nothing's guaranteed, but I can really see Fellaini doing much the same for us. This is why I don't see him as a fall-back option, a squad player, or an upgrade on Cleverley (who is developing into a fine player and still has a great United career ahead of him, btw). I have a feeling this is why Moyes has been after him, and why he was always going sign him.
 
TheReligion said:
Who else would you have advised then that we didn't look at?
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Well - of the people we DID look at I'd rather have Herrera since Fabregas was always unrealistic, but I'd say someone like Illaramendi would have been worth a look.

Other alternatives could've been McCarthy or Barkley who IMO has got more of an upside than Fellaini. We could've looked at someone like Marchisio if we wanted a more proven, tougher option. Other options could've been Paulinho for a more attacking alternative, or Luiz Gustavo for a foil/alternative for Carrick of more defensive ilk.

There were options, but we've not really wanted to pay the premium for those - other than for Fellaini.
 
Why not wait until he has played a few games for us before we judge whether he is good enough. I've seen it so many times when you drop a player into a better team and they thrive.
 
marjen said:
Well - of the people we DID look at I'd rather have Herrera since Fabregas was always unrealistic, but I'd say someone like Illaramendi would have been worth a look.

Other alternatives could've been McCarthy or Barkley who IMO has got more of an upside than Fellaini. We could've looked at someone like Marchisio if we wanted a more proven, tougher option. Other options could've been Paulinho for a more attacking alternative, or Luiz Gustavo for a foil/alternative for Carrick of more defensive ilk.

There were options, but we've not really wanted to pay the premium for those - other than for Fellaini.
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McCarthy has been hugely overrated on the Caf. He wouldn't make a real impact on our side at the moment and is simply good potential rather than much else.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
As someone said, please wait until he has played a game for us for passing judgement.
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Well the truth is we won't know for years if people do what they did with Carrick and cling to their preconceptions. You can have a view now as to what he'll bring. I can't see why a anyone doesn't think he'll add to the strength of a squad, which is no small thing when that squad are title winners.
 
moses said:
Well the truth is we won't know for years if people do what they did with Carrick and cling to their preconceptions. You can have a view now as to what he'll bring. I can't see why a anyone doesn't think he'll add to the strength of a squad, which is no small thing when that squad are title winners.
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He definitely adds strength to the squad, no doubt, partly because our midfield isn't great, to be fair. That was never my argument here though, to be clear.
 
Cina said:
But there are just as many players who don't make it.

You're basically saying that because Fellaini was very good for Everton and is an international player that he's a guaranteed success here, when in reality it's probably been around 50/50 either way. I'm not sure how you're failing to grasp the logic here.
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Really, you think it's as low as 50/50 that he'll be a success here?
 
moses said:
Ok, so For Fellaini then? What are the odds of success here?
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He's probably more likely to succeed than fail, seeing as he's by default our second best midfielder. He'll never justify his fee but that can be said about most players in the modern market.

I think he'll be a good first team player for us, I don't think he'll be a great one.
 
Cina said:
He's probably more likely to succeed than fail, seeing as he's by default our second best midfielder. He'll never justify his fee but that can be said about most players in the modern market.

I think he'll be a good first team player for us, I don't think he'll be a great one.
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Yeah, pretty much agree, but that is about the market value of a player that will be pretty much nailed on to be a good first team player for the champions.
 
He will be a success AND will prove his fee was worth it. He is a 30 million pound player.
 
moses said:
Yeah, pretty much agree, but that is about the market value of a player that will be pretty much nailed on to be a good first team player for the champions.
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Semantics, but I'd say he probably goes on to become a decent first team player for us - and I disagree about the market value, for that kind of money I'd have liked someone who was significantly better than any of our midfielders, or at least better than Carrick. A main man, so to speak.
 
finneh said:
Inevitably however, as he was signed for around 50% more than most would peg his value and with him being the only signing of the Summer, people will start pegging him as someone who will make a huge difference to our squad and even someone who may "take us to the next level in Europe". In my opinion this just isn't going to be the case. He isn't going to make our squad massively better and he isn't going to make our first XI massively better. I would say there is a reason why no-one came in for him at his £23.5m release clause, because he would be a financial gamble at that price... Obviously even moreso at £27.5m.
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Speculative speaking on behalf of the club by the fans means nothing. Nada, zippity zilch, squat, bupkis. If they think he's not worth the money the club paid then there is nothing else they can do but put up, shut up and support.

finneh said:
I can't ever see him justifying the fee, which will be his biggest problem and a lot of people may say we'd have been better off spending a few more quid and getting a better player who is proven at a higher level. This is backed up by the fact that he was bought so late on when a few other options had failed... At a £4m premium.
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Again, their speculative speak on behalf of the clubs action means nothing. Nada, zippity zilch, squat, bupkis. The guy hasn't even kicked a ball for the club yet and already people are throwing the toys out of the pram having a big old moan about 'price' and 'attributes'. The club made the decision to sign him and I'd say they know a shit of a lot more about squad management and player purchasing than some moany tarts on a football forum.


Lets just be fans for a minute and sit back and watch the impact he has for the club. I personally think it will be positive and we'll see a night/day difference on what Cleverley brought to the side in that deeper role.
 
ghaliboy said:
Speculative speaking on behalf of the club by the fans means nothing. Nada, zippity zilch, squat, bupkis. If they think he's not worth the money the club paid then there is nothing else they can do but put up, shut up and support.

Again, their speculative speak on behalf of the clubs action means nothing. Nada, zippity zilch, squat, bupkis. The guy hasn't even kicked a ball for the club yet and already people are throwing the toys out of the pram having a big old moan about 'price' and 'attributes'. The club made the decision to sign him and I'd say they know a shit of a lot more about squad management and player purchasing than some moany tarts on a football forum.

Lets just be fans for a minute and sit back and watch the impact he has for the club. I personally think it will be positive and we'll see a night/day difference on what Cleverley brought to the side in that deeper role.
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I assume that when Liverpool signed Carroll you were one of the thousands of people stating that "Liverpool made the decision to sign him and I'd say they know a shit of a lot more about squad management and player purchasing than some moany tarts on a football forum." Oh wait every single person realised it was a monumental cockup before he even kicked a ball, despite not being the incredibly learned folk at Liverpool FC.

However the fact is no-one is saying that, no-one is even saying he'll be bad and no-one is writing him off. No-one is even moaning or saying the club have been idiotic (although paying £4m more was a total waste). What people are saying is that he cost a lot of money and that he hasn't done enough in his career thus far (particularly in the position he was purchased for) to justify a £27.5m price tag (which is as close to a fact as an opinion can be).

My only opinion is that if fans judge him as the squad player I believe he is intended to be he'll be a good signing. If people start to think of him as our 5th most expensive signing ever and expect him to step us up a level there is a good chance they'll be disappointed, as I think most would agree he hasn't shown enough in central midfield to suggest that he'll be a World Class player.

But you are of course correct - any quasi-suggestion from a fan that Fellaini isn't a top class player after watching him for 5 years in the Premier League is lunacy because the club signed him for £27.5m and the club knows a shit ton more about player purchasing. The fact that no other top club (who also presumably know a shit ton more than us fans about player purchasing) in several months snapped him up for a £4m lower fee couldn't possibly be because many other managers and clubs agree with some of us ignorant fans that he's a big gamble at a price which assumes he's a first team regular?

Obviously apart from posting opinions on a forum in the mean time we will "be fans for a minute and sit back and watch the impact he has for the club".
 
Sigh.

It's a losing battle, that one Finneh. You're not allowed to question Fellaini. He's obviously nailed on to be a top class midfielder for us for years to come, since someone has bought him.
 
finneh said:
I assume that when Liverpool signed Carroll you were one of the thousands of people stating that "Liverpool made the decision to sign him and I'd say they know a shit of a lot more about squad management and player purchasing than some moany tarts on a football forum." Oh wait every single person realised it was a monumental cockup before he even kicked a ball, despite not being the incredibly learned folk at Liverpool FC.
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Have you seriously just brought up Andy Carroll to Liverpool as an example? you should just stop posting about football altogether if you believe that Fellaini to United is in any way comparable to that.
 
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