Moyes So Far!

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Its all very early days guys, we all knew it would be a VERY difficult task for somebody to come in straight away and hit the ground running. The fixture list really did not help either, but their will be lighter days ahead.

He definitely does need a positive result tonight though just to keep the wolves off his back, a nice strong home win and a run of decent form will soon shut the haters up.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Yeah, you're right. We're fecked. Just plain fecked and doomed. Out of interest, what do you suggest we do - you know, in order to somehow alleviate this hellish state of affairs, at least a little? Light some candles?
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You're asking the wrong bloke to get any ideas about positivity. He joined in 2009 and has been a persistently miserable cnut, constantly critical of the best manager United have ever had throughout an incredibly succesful spell. What hope does Moyes have?

Best put him on ignore. You won't regret it.
 
Seems pretty clear to me that his comments today and yesterday are designed to capitalise on the dented pride the team must be feeling after the weekend.

He's looking for a reaction and reminding the players they have a responsiblity too. Have to say, bar Fellaini the team has gotten offincredibly lightly with such a gutless performance.
 
ItsEssexRob said:
Of course and it alone cant bring you success, many clubs are examples of that, however if you are going to chop and change managers you need to have money.

And I have always admitted that SAF genius was what made United so successful, if anything it proves the point doesn't it?
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That's so true.

No great surprise that the only clubs to consistently punch above their weight, despite not being able to match the spending of their rivals are those with managers that have been in place for a long time. Wenger and Moyes are the obvious examples but Fergie himself has been doing the same at United in recent years. With Wenger unavailable, you can see the logic in giving Moyes the job but he's obviously been taken on to look after a long-term project.
 
Everything he said is true and pretty much most of what we thought. Only the blinkered/blind think that the squad is good enough to win the title again. Not sure how it will go down in the dressing room. I hope he does the united thing and rotate heavily tonight. Nani, Kagawa, Zaha, Chico for me, have to start tonight - we need to see what the other players have got as the current 1st 11 are doing squat!
 
Adam-Utd said:
Its all very early days guys, we all knew it would be a VERY difficult task for somebody to come in straight away and hit the ground running. The fixture list really did not help either, but their will be lighter days ahead.

He definitely does need a positive result tonight though just to keep the wolves off his back, a nice strong home win and a run of decent form will soon shut the haters up.
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This!

An undefeated run of 11 or 12 games n the league is possible. Plus, getting out the CL group. That should be enough to keep things calm and steady things for Moyes...

However, I still believe he genuinely came into this job thinking it was going to be easy...To be fair, from the outside, anyone would think it was going to be easy...All this does is underline how great SAF was.

One thing that does bother me about the interview...If it's true what he says, then what in God's name was he doing in the summer????
 
I'm not seeing as many glaring weaknesses that others are. I think we need a proper centre midfielder, a quality wide man and some more experience at the back for Jones. If only there was a certain allocated time in the year where we could acquire such players.

I can completely understand Moyes wanting to keep a settled side for the opening games. Ferdinand was excellent last year but why he's started so poorly is anyone's guess. Young should never be near the first 11 and we've had injuries to Rooney, RVP, Jones and our starting full back.

In hindsight, he should've given more time to Evans, Nani and Kagawa. When Van Persie was ruled out of the derby we needed to replaced him with anyone other than the incompetent Young, (possibly Cleverley with Nani on the right) to prevent such a tonking. We ended up with 2 wingers doing nothing of note at either end and couldn't get a grip of the game. A seemingly attacking line-up was made to look lethargic and negative against a much better side on the day. Even Kolarov got an assist for feck sake. Kolarov!

Win tonight, get some players back fit for the CL game and win 3-4 in the bounce in the league and things will look a lot different.
 
soapythecat said:
Everything he said is true and pretty much most of what we thought. Only the blinkered/blind think that the squad is good enough to win the title again.
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I dunno, mate. I reckon this season's looking like the previous one in that there's no truly outstanding team. We could well end up being the best of a rather average bunch again.
 
I would honestly want us to focus on the next game. Everyone realises that it was a poor performance. Now we need to get our act together and right the wrongs. Team selection will be interesting tonight.
 
He needs to be given 2 years, because he needs to be given the chance to build his own team. Either by design, or the colossal feck up of the transfer window, this is still Fergie's team, with one of Moyes's pet pupils brought in. Even a disaster scenario of finishing outside of the top 4 wouldn't change my mind on that, because we'd still need to get a summer > half season of re-building under our belts.

There are a lot of things I'm concerned about so far, and I view the start to his tenure pretty badly (the "consistency" experiment was a monumental failure, and should've been acknowledged as such earlier) but if we're going to try and let him build his own dynasty, we have to at least let him do it with a team that's his.

Obviously if it gets too bad we still need the chance to bail, but a couple of years of disappointment is not going to destroy Manchester United.
 
Mockney said:
He needs to be given 2 years, because he needs to be given the chance to build his own team. Either by design, or the colossal feck up of the transfer window, this is still Fergie's team, with one of Moyes's pet pupils brought in. Even a disaster scenario of finishing outside of the top 4 wouldn't change my mind on that, because we'd still need to get a summer > half season of re-building under our belts.

There are a lot of things I'm concerned about so far, and I view the start to his tenure pretty badly (the "consistency" experiment was a monumental failure, and should've been acknowledged as such earlier) but if we're going to try and let him build his own dynasty, we have to at least let him do it with a team that's his.
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Agree with every word of this.
 
Sure, he's not helped himself on occasion but he's working in a climate in which fans are frothing at the mouth over pre-season games (read: lucrative tour-matches) & a shamelessly bandwagoning press are off the leash. Instant success is the only thing that will silence these critics but life doesn't always work like that...
 
Luckily, I think Galzers would have considered all the factors before deciding on hiring Moyes and won't be firing him just because some fans express their frustration on social media and overreact. Also, we have SAF and Sir Bobby as Directors and don't think they too will succumb to any pressure (unless we end up 6-8th). In long term, I am sure Moyes will prove to be a good choice. At the moment, there is a bit of adjusting for him after such a step-up and that is expected. It is easier to cheer loudly when SAF says, "your job now is to get behind your new manager" but I knew that some fans would in reality not show any patience at all.

I think we will definitely end up in top 3. The two realistic title rivals are just 3 points ahead of us and we have played 2 additional fixtures against top 6 teams as compared to them.

Moyes might be going for 'safety first' approach right now, but I don't see him continuing with likes of Young for long if he continues to disappoint. In 1-2 years, he will have the side as he wants and then it is proper to judge him if he is good choice in long term. God forbid if he gets fired after first year for finishing 4th, that will just be a indication that Manchester United too have become hire and fire club.
 
RedRossi said:
This!

An undefeated run of 11 or 12 games n the league is possible. Plus, getting out the CL group. That should be enough to keep things calm and steady things for Moyes...

However, I still believe he genuinely came into this job thinking it was going to be easy...To be fair, from the outside, anyone would think it was going to be easy...All this does is underline how great SAF was.

One thing that does bother me about the interview...If it's true what he says, then what in God's name was he doing in the summer????
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I don't think he thought anything of the sort, the opposite in fact, what makes you think that?
 
sorry Rossi, that's the most stupid thing I've heard here in weeks. You honestly thought Moyes thought replacing SAF after 27 years would be easy?
You need an award for that kind of thinking.
 
It would've been a lot easier if he'd gone to a club that can spend nearly £90m in a transfer window and no-one makes a fuss about it.
 
Crackers said:
sorry Rossi, that's the most stupid thing I've heard here in weeks. You honestly thought Moyes thought replacing SAF after 27 years would be easy?
You need an award for that kind of thinking.
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Award??? Will there be people there?? Will there be dinner in my honour?? :D

Ah no, what I mean't was, coming from Everton, where he had little resources at his disposal and a limited squad to work with, going to United where he has a vastly bigger squad, a heck of a lot more money and resources at his disposal...That was my way of seeing it
 
RedRossi said:
However, I still believe he genuinely came into this job thinking it was going to be easy...To be fair, from the outside, anyone would think it was going to be easy...
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Crackers said:
sorry Rossi, that's the most stupid thing I've heard here in weeks. You honestly thought Moyes thought replacing SAF after 27 years would be easy?
You need an award for that kind of thinking.
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:lol: DM Made comments only this morning/ last night...

"I don't think it was ever going to be the case this was going to be easy and smooth after Sir Alex," Moyes said.
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I suspect it will be closer to three years before he's absolutely got the team where he wants it. This season will be almost a write off in terms of transfers and he won't want to make sweeping changes anyway, given the upheaval at the club as it is. Next summer I think we'll probably see him try to make some big moves in the market and possibly move a few players on. He'll also have to deal with the likes of Rio and Evra either retiring or possibly being moved on, particularly in light of how we were obviously trying to bring in a left back. So even his second season will have plenty of players settling in and so on. Most players, particularly coming from abroad, take a season or so to find their feet.
 
I would rather have some realism from Moyes than the usual "we won the title so we're excellent" bit. It's sometimes what annoyed me about Fergie because he'd never say what we could all see. Perhaps it won't go down well with the players but I'd hope he took advice from Giggs and Neville who've had experience being in that dressing room, before saying what he did say.

Like I said the only bit I disagree with is criticizing last year's team.
 
I imagine he's just fending off press criticism with comments like that, mate. Brazening it out. Similar to the comments about there being 'no budget' - it stops journos writing stuff like 'United in Crisis: Glazers give feck-all Money to New Bloke!'
 
Brophs said:
I suspect it will be closer to three years before he's absolutely got the team where he wants it. This season will be almost a write off in terms of transfers and he won't want to make sweeping changes anyway, given the upheaval at the club as it is..
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I had said from the start that this season was always going to be tough. Predictions of a smooth transition and continuing to win title after title were wildly optimistic. We lost our manager of 26 years and our long standing Chief Executive. You can't just step in and not expect some upheaval. Plus, Moyes has 0 experience of managing at this level and nothing he's done so far could've prepared him to manage at this club. SAF said it took him 3 years to come to terms with the "bigness" of Man Utd.

Honestly, Moyes will need atleast a season if not two to get a grip of the squad. In the meanwhile hopefully he can win a cup to ease some pressure.
 
Brophs said:
I suspect it will be closer to three years before he's absolutely got the team where he wants it. This season will be almost a write off in terms of transfers and he won't want to make sweeping changes anyway, given the upheaval at the club as it is. Next summer I think we'll probably see him try to make some big moves in the market and possibly move a few players on. He'll also have to deal with the likes of Rio and Evra either retiring or possibly being moved on, particularly in light of how we were obviously trying to bring in a left back. So even his second season will have plenty of players settling in and so on. Most players, particularly coming from abroad, take a season or so to find their feet.
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RVP will be 33 then, and Rooney (if he's still here) 30 - but physically 38 - and Carrick 35, So he's going to need to replace almost everyone essentially, even our best and brightest.
 
RedRossi said:
Award??? Will there be people there?? Will there be dinner in my honour?? :D

Ah no, what I mean't was, coming from Everton, where he had little resources at his disposal and a limited squad to work with, going to United where he has a vastly bigger squad, a heck of a lot more money and resources at his disposal...That was my way of seeing it
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Moyes has himself said that it's not an easy job managing United, specially replacing SAF.
 
Mockney said:
RVP will be 33 then, and Rooney (if he's still here) 30 - but physically 38 - and Carrick 35, So he's going to need to replace even our best and brightest.
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True. I'm also not that convinced that Vidic is going to age that well so he'll have plenty to do.
 
Brophs said:
True. I'm also not that convinced that Vidic is going to age that well so he'll have plenty to do.
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And there's Evra too, I think the backline should be more or less ok between Smalling, Jones and Evans for the CB spots, you can get another guy in there too I suppose. I don't think Baines was/is a long-term option for the LB spot however.
 
Am glad he's come out with that press conference, said all the right things for me.. shows he's understood the problems we face, he does however have to make do with what he's got and try to remain positive in team selection.. yes we get that the team isn't all that and Sir Alex has left the team in not particularly a great state but that doesn't mean you have to pick Valencia and Young when there are clearly better alternatives available, in addition to that the signing of Fellaini is your own judgement call, if that goes on to be a failure.. it again shows a lack of judgement and can we afford to provide the opportunity to rebuild a team with wads of cash to a guy who shows poor judgement?

I think fans can accept blows to come, as long as we can see he's picking the right teams and the players themselves are not upto the job. I.e. if the likes of Nani, Kagawa et al come into the side, are given a long run and we're still shit... Moyes has to be trusted to bring in better quality as it is not his fault.
 
The defense should be alright. Especially if we can get Fabio up to Rafael's standard. But the midfield needs all new wingers bar Nani - who will be 29 then too, which isn't great, but workable if he can follow Robben's path - a whole new raft of CMs, and two new strikers.

Basically a cut and shut of the whole front end of the team.
 
Raees said:
Am glad he's come out with that press conference, said all the right things for me.. shows he's understood the problems we face, he does however have to make do with what he's got and try to remain positive in team selection.. yes we get that the team isn't all that and Sir Alex has left the team in not particularly a great state but that doesn't mean you have to pick Valencia and Young when there are clearly better alternatives available, in addition to that the signing of Fellaini is your own judgement call, if that goes on to be a failure.. it again shows a lack of judgement and can we afford to provide the opportunity to rebuild a team with wads of cash to a guy who shows poor judgement?

I think fans can accept blows to come, as long as we can see he's picking the right teams and the players themselves are not upto the job. I.e. if the likes of Nani, Kagawa et al come into the side, are given a long run and we're still shit... Moyes has to be trusted to bring in better quality as it is not his fault.
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Who was a better alternative then Valencia? He'd just had his best game in ages midweek and scored as well so should have been high on confidence?

Nani is just back from injury so lacking match sharpness and Kagawa wasn't particularly impressive midweek.

Going in 4-4-2 was positive, he could easily have tried to contain them with a 4-5-1 but he didn't. It was just a poor performance all round.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yet there's still an awful lot of people one here saying that failing to make the top four this season is an automatic sackable offence.

Wishful thinking?
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Arsenal never finished outside the top four since Wenger has taken over. Never, not once. And up to this summer their record signing was Arshavin for something like 17m.

Moyes, with greater resources and a title-winning squad at his disposal, has absolutely no excuse to finish behind either Liverpool or Spurs. Or even Arsenal, to be fair. Fifth would be an embarassment. I fail to see why should we lower our expectations so drastically. He inherited a squad with flaws, yes - if we consider the aim to be title challengers and credible contenders in Europe. We have clear deficiencies when it comes to competing on that level (and that is the level we should aspire to, no question). But it's absolutely mental to suggest that it's not among the best four squads in the Premier League.

Some people act as if Moyes had Southampton's squad at his disposal or something. He finished 5th twice with Everton and even 4th once. And yet it's unreasonable to expect him to do better with Manchester United? Anyone who accepts that we might finish 5th basically says that Moyes is not up to the job.
 
It would be a disastrous campaign if we finished outside of a CL spot with the squad at our disposal.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yet there's still an awful lot of people one here saying that failing to make the top four this season is an automatic sackable offence.

Wishful thinking?
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Well he got pretty close on several occasions with a shitter Everton, so in theory it should be a piece of cake to break in the top 4. Depends what the moneymen think I suppose. As a fan I'd give him two years regardless but the Glazers et al care most about the stock price.

We have enough quality players to break down the crap teams which Everton struggled with. Plus Moyes' Everton always got better after November, a bit like Fergie's United. I don't think top 4 should be a huge problem, but we'll see.
 
Depends how highly you rate the likes of Hernandez, Welbeck, Zaha, Januzaj, Kagawa etc etc. He doesn't need to buy a whole new team because we have some good young players at the club
 
Mockney said:
The defense should be alright. Especially if we can get Fabio up to Rafael's standard. But the midfield needs all new wingers bar Nani - who will be 29 then too, which isn't great, but workable if he can follow Robben's path - a whole new raft of CMs, and two new strikers.

Basically a cut and shut of the whole front end of the team.
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To an extent yes, there are a few players who will develop over those years and could put themselves into contention though.
 
I wouldnt want Moyes sacked regardless of where we finish this year but I'd be absolutely shocked if we somehow finished outside the top 4 with the squad we have. A finish outside the top 4 would instantly make his 2nd season here make or break imo. Another finish outside the top 4 and I wouldnt argue if people want him gone.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yet there's still an awful lot of people one here saying that failing to make the top four this season is an automatic sackable offence.

Wishful thinking?
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I'm very much in favour of giving Moyes plenty of time to put his stamp on the job, and I love that we gave him a six year deal. Still, I think finishing outside of the top 4 would cost him his job. I can't see any way that this would happen though, and I'd be very surprised if we didn't finish in the top 2.
 
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