Sergio Ramos | Signs new 5 year contract
- Thread starter FC Ronaldo
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
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Are you insane? You are trying to make a point by naming some quality signings for good prices (although RvP does not fall under this) and then name Valencia, Young and Hernandez lmao.
Generally you do have to accept a bit of a trade off with ball playing centre backs.
Ideally I'd have varane as well but I'd imagine Madrid consider him the much bigger asset too given his age and potential.
did we not sign RVP on a free?
No!
and who exactly should we have replaced Ronaldo with??? i'm not comparing Valencia to Ronaldo. I'm saying Valencia was a great bit of business. This idea we are naive in the market is just nonsense.
29 million on the last year of his contract.
how much did we pay for him? whatever it was it was worth it, he won no 20.
Or that. I was talking about their immediate options this summer really, but the worst that will happen is they wait 12 months. Those calling on Woody to play hard ball probably aren't being realistic. The situation is pretty bleak for us, Madrid have basically already won.
that is a lot. but it was still worth it!
£24m
I do not know this Jonny Evans you are talking about.
I simply dont get why you want "one world class CB" and keep the average. Why do you want Jones/Smalling to get another few years of "chances".
Lets be honest here, Smalling and Jones can be a great defenders one day but he will never be world class.
worth it. my core point stands. this stuff about naivety is way off.
How is Valencia a great bit of business? He had one decent season and the rest were a nightmare. We spend 18 mil on a workhorse who cannot score, beat an opponent build up or anything.
Instead of wasting money on him and bebe...know who was sold that summer for a transfer fee lower of them 2 combined and happened to be a right winger also?
ARJAN ROBBEN. Thats was a great bit of business.
Well, it would have been impossible to replace him like for like, and you're right, Valencia wasn't the worst purchase, but losing the world's best player (and Tevez) and replacing him with Valencia, Obertan and Owen was distinctly underwhelming. We could have invested that £80m into a world class player or two. It was the same season that Barca bought Zlatan and Madrid bought Alonso, Ronaldo and Kaka.
Also marked the beginning of the "no value in the market" mantra that saw our squad turn to mediocrity.
Arjen Robben, Real Madrid -> 24 mil (2009)
No. That was an obvious bit of business.
Paying 50 mill for Andy Carroll. Thats naive.
Paying 18 mill for Valencia most definitely wasn't.
What most people forget is that Jonny Evans played more games along side Vidic than Ferdiand in 2008/09 with the 14 clean sheets in a row ...
Because you NEED squad players. We were spoilt with Vidic/Ferdinand and it's rare to see something on the level of Carvalho/Terry or Nesta/Maldini. Kompany before his slump made average CBs look way better than they were.
If you want another world class CB, scout a young talent and slowly get him to that lvl. But you can't buy 11 world class players. That's why having a good player like Smalling and squad player like Jones/Rojo should suffice for now.
No it wasn't. It wasn't just naive to buy a 18 mil winger thinking he can replace a 90mil one, it was plain stupid not to scout proper wingers like robben for 24 mil coming from the club you sold Ronaldo to in the same year.
Don't think i need to remind you of what happend in the following year as well with Robben.
A world class CB definitely improves his partner.
You dont NEED squad players. Thats a bs excuse when you cannot sign better because of no funds/proper scouting.
The only reason Evans hold 14 clean sheets in 2008/2009 is because we had the second best team on the planet surrounding him.
This is the most blatent case of a player using us to get a better contract ever.
Yep, he's doing a Cristiano on it.
Tbh Alves > all
I'd forgotten that Alves signed a new contract at Barca. He played that really well, so well that I thought he'd actually left.
Of course you do.
You absolutely need squad players.
right so the sum total of all of your cases that we are 'naive' in the transfer market boils down to how we replaced Ronaldo. ok.
We're pretty crap at selling players, tbf. Veron is the only one where I can remember thinking "We did well there".
You need squad players on the bench that can fill in when needed without dropping to much quality.
What you absolutely do not need is a "squad player" as a standard player in the XI. Thats absolute bullshit and its a sad excuse for our transfer/scouting policy of the last decade.
You're using Kaka and Zlatan as examples of good buys? in summer 2006, Chelsea had won two titles and bought Schevchenko to make an attack that already had Drogba even stronger. We sold RvN, had lost Keane and replaced him with Michael Carrick, we then went on to win the title. In 2007, we won the league and we invested in Hargo, Tevez, Nani and Anderson, we then went on to win the double. What I am trying to say is success comes at the back of very different circumstances. You need to take so many factors in considerations and most of them are simply invisible to the average fan like you or me. Sometimes you need to spend and on other occasions you need to be quiet. This idea that it's all a straight up formula like a video game is truly the most absurd thing on these pages.
That's the point isn't it? You don't need 11 world class players in their positions, you need the right balance. No team in the world has 11 individual top quality players, a lot of them seem that way though because they have the balance right. If Rakitic was here, you can bet your mortgage that our pundits and fans will be going on about how "yea but would he get into the Barcelona side for example?".
When people say squad players they actually mean rotation players, right? Players that often are versatile and can fill in when needed.
No i base that opinion on the average quality we buy believing that its better to buy average and "develop" them over buying top quality for a higher price as a further development point.
Do you think its a coincidence that Man United's highest transfer fee (sold) after ronaldo and beckham is around 15 mil? Thats a good reflection of the quality we buy and sell.
We buy average and turn average into acceptable or shit.
The attitude that man united didn't need to spend big and sign stars was naive. And thats why we are in a world of shit right now having to spend 150 mil per season trying to fix it.
RVP was hardly a great deal. Its never wise to spend so much money on an injury prone player at the wrong end of his career. However SAF needed a quality goal poacher to end his career on high and I respect that. Whether Valencia and Smalling were great deals is open to debate. However that's not my point
Every club has its set of bad transfers which is normal considering that transfers are usually an educated guess. However I cant think of many top clubs who would sign a player few weeks after its minimum clause had expired or went on spending 6m on an amateur player. Also I cant think of many top clubs who allows their best player to reach his final year of contract or sell the most marketable player in the world for 25m.
Also bear in mind that my criticism is not addressed to the manager but the entire structure as a whole (ie the decision makers). I understand the advantages of giving the manager full power on the football side of things. However that power need to be restricted when it goes beyond common sense (like the transfers I mentioned before)
Even Ronaldo at 80m was a joke when you look at what Suarez and Bale went for.(in different times of course but still..) I'd have been asking Real Madrid for at least 100m or over for his services.
No hes talking about "not everyone needs to be class". Valencia cannot be called a squad player if that was his definition of it. Hes talking about average to fill up the spots.
We didn't sell Beckham for 15 million. Buying average? Madrid wanted Ruud. Plenty of clubs would have wanted Veron. The only thing you could say is maybe our scouts could have done better. A lot of the game is played in the head. Sir Alex did well with most of these players and were cheated by Madrid in his final season. Moyes completely broke the spirit and LVG was unlucky that when he joined we lost Vidic and Patrice, had constant injuries and we were forced into playing 3 at the back for a period that completely unbalanced us.
Of course it's way off. One shIte year and another average one has insanely messed up with our fans. Suddenly we're the worst at everything and we can't do anything right. Everything we do is naive and could have been done been better if it were not for something so simple the average Caf fan could have told you. You can argue all day but some fans cannot simply accept that like pretty much every other team in history, we are simply going through a rough 2 maybe 3 years.
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