I wouldn't exactly call Matt Jarvis a premier league star.
England player and another Premier League star set to come out as gay
- Thread starter SilentWitness
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I think the player would suffer significant, audible abuse from rival crowds. But it would probably backfire very quickly for the club and not last long.
I hope it's the Ox.
Why? Do you want him?
Is it bad that I don't want it to be Shaw? Obviously I couldn't care less what he does in his spare time. But I don't want him receiving a high level of abuse and don't want his football to be affected.
I don't think the reaction would be as bad as people think, simply because the media's approach is different now - even the likes of The Sun are wary of publishing the crass headlines they've been associated with in the past. Nowadays, the press - which influences people's thinking so much - react to stories like this in the PC guise of John Thomson's ironic comic character Bernard Righton: "There's a lesbian, a bisexual and a homosexual in a wine bar....they had a great night."
I'm surprised so many are saying that they do not care and that it isn't newsworthy. In the footballing world it very much is, which, yes is difficult to grasp given the time we are in and that something like this should be accepted but it isn't by many nations in the world and in the football world - male level, it most definitely is still a problem given the terms which are regularly hurled at Chelsea fans or just general abuse that is hurled at rival fans or players.
The fact that a lot of people in here are also 'guessing' who it is that is gay by stereotypes also highlights that is an issue still. Something like racism isn't gone in football despite the efforts to stamp it out and that is with high profile players of differing ethnicities calling for change, so homophobia will still be a major issue unless a high profile figure in the footballing world comes out, and becomes a 'poster boy' so to speak.
The fact that a lot of people in here are also 'guessing' who it is that is gay by stereotypes also highlights that is an issue still. Something like racism isn't gone in football despite the efforts to stamp it out and that is with high profile players of differing ethnicities calling for change, so homophobia will still be a major issue unless a high profile figure in the footballing world comes out, and becomes a 'poster boy' so to speak.
Agree with everything you've said.
I hope it's not one of my man crushes. It'll give the whole thing an uncomfortable new dynamic for me.
Luke Shaw looks like he belongs on the front of a Smiths album. Make of that what you will...
Was anybody chanting vile chants about Wenger being a paedophile awarded with points deduction?
Was anybody chanting chants about Munich or Hillsborough ever awarded with something like it?
The way Sterling runs, it's probably him. The 7 kids he has is just a cover.
Guessing who it is because some players seem a bit gay really is just enforcing stereotypes. Who would have guessed Gareth Thomas was gay?
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This and I consider jokes about those far more severe than jokes about a gay person.
The guy with his knob up his arse?
Not that I know of, but in all cases it should have happened.
Not that I'm implying it's right or something, mind, but we would be going overboard. You'd have professional athletes paying price for their fans being utter morons and just like in any society, you'll always have utter morons, whether they're simply scum, homophobic or racist.
Then you would as well probably have rival fans pretending to be fans of team X, going to matches giving all kinds of abuse to the players in order to get the points reduction for team X as it would be simply worth it.
Disagree. With CCTV these days it's quite easy to identify groups of people who engage in whatever chants. Teams should have to pay if their supporters are overtly racist/homophobic/or whatever -- that's not a new concept, and it's one that should be enforced.
The second scenario also seems highly unlikely to me.
Agreed, his shirt should have "chase me" instead of his name!Well if the CCTV is so well developed then it surely shouldn't be a need to punish the teams themselves but just 'fish out' those who engage in those chants and punish them instead?
I find it hilarious that loads of people assume that as soon as someone goes public with being gay he'd like to be shafted HARD from all directions by anyone.
Think you mean Gareth Thomas
The type of fans that make up the majority of Premier League crowds these days I don't think it would be a massive issue, if anything I think the player would recieve a pretty good reception at most grounds. There will always be several morons in the crowd who make a lot of noise, ones that if the player wasn't gay would find another reason to yell abuse probably, as the years go by those type of fan will get fewer and fewer though.
That would be my preference too. It would depend on how widespread it is, though. If you have 1000 people chanting racist nonsense, then it's impractical to process each person under the law -- too many for the authorities to get through. The option I'd advocate in these circumstances is a penalty imposed upon whichever team the supporters are affiliated with.
It's easy to underestimate the stupidity of some people though I suppose. Wasn't Graham Le Saux labelled gay simply because he read a broadsheet newspaper on the team bus?
Would be incredibly unfair for my liking, mass responsibility is a bad thing because you end up punishing people who have not committed a crime.
Both scenarios though are very unlikely to happen (as in CCTV doing miracles AND collective responsibility) on such scale though so we can as well call it.
Newspapers have the habit of exaggerating the profile of the player in these issues. Iys to ably a player with one England cap as far back as 2006.
Mass responsibility is fine in the context of football, imo. It's the fans who support the club, therefore, if those fans are actively racist/homophobic, then I have no problem with the club being docked points. It sets a precedent -- keep doing what you do and watch your team get punished. It would soon be stamped out.
Smalling? Mata?
I don't really care anyway, but those two popped to mind straight away...
I don't really care anyway, but those two popped to mind straight away...
Because of the spotlight it will have. Sponsorship etc depends on things not being judgmental. That being said, I don't think racism is as prevalent in BPL as in BBVA or Serie A? Or am I wrong?
Will there be harsher punishment for fans chanting homophobic remarks if a couple top level players come out?
It must be Darren Bent!
Seriously though it's bad that this kind of thing makes the news. People should be able to live the way they choose in privacy
Seriously though it's bad that this kind of thing makes the news. People should be able to live the way they choose in privacy
Will be interesting if a player that comes out dives at away grounds or feigns injury. That will be the real test.
It will be a courageous step, in it's own way. But you are all labouring under a stereotype of your own: that of the stereotype of the "perfectly balanced gentleman gay sportsman" who in recent years has laudably graced the sports and supplement sections of Saturday and Sunday broadsheets. I mean the articulate, regularly dressed, progressive and intelligent young man, cautious in his statements but sanely rounded in his thoughtful and measured manner with friends, family, journalists, and fellow sports people and fans. This guy might not be like that at all. What if he comes on like Liberace or talks about fisting in his come-out interview or instagrams himself wearing purple hair curlers in bed or marries someone ostentatiously Brazilian. In that case, wouldn't he set back his cause centuries?
... but they are the 'my skywizard is better than your skywizard' religious clowns.
I have gay friends, gay work colleagues, and a cousin who is gay, but the only time I think about anyone being gay is when the media decide to serialize it like this. It's something that we shouldn't have to think about, sadly that's not the case.
I realise that you're rarely serious, but it's kind of depressing that these are, it seems, the only two options:*Conform ("Be like us.")
or...
*Be entertaining ("Amuse us.")
Similar to how black people have been obliged to act in order to gain acceptance.
This won't happen. This thread is a good explanation as to why.