My first post in this thread was about there being given a bomb involved and I've only mentioned once a suspicion that the shooter would probably be white, so what the feck are you on about?
Mass shooting at Gay night club in Orlando
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
A bullshit straw man would be misrepresenting someone's point completely to try and attack the argument you wish they were making. It looks something like this:
The sad thing is that it is probably too late for America. I have a strong feeling that if the government decided to ban guns and police tried to confiscate them, there would be a blood bath, as many Americans see their right to a gun as higher than another human's right to life.
Someone murders 20 people with a gun and it has nothing to do with guns? Kinell.
People like you are part of the problem. You should hang your head in shame.
People like you are part of the problem. You should hang your head in shame.
I've seen nothing official to say there was a controlled explosion.
I have seen some reports saying he had a 'device'. Not 'armed to the teeth' with explosives, as you have mentioned. What he was armed with is was an assault rifle and handgun.
Sky news have quotes from the police saying they carried out a controlled explosion. CNN have quotes saying he had an explosive device strapped to himself.
Yes, continue to simplify. You are only interested in this because you have a gun control dog in it, and clearly have no intention of opening your eyes to anything about the perpetrator.
Idiots. Only yesterday Christina Grimmie was gunned down signing autographs, life snuffed out by some loony armed to the teeth.
You are right. I'd have been quite happy if he had killed 20 people with a large halibut.
But he didn't. Guns killed 20 people. So strangely enough it seems reasonable to involve guns in the discussion.
But he didn't. Guns killed 20 people. So strangely enough it seems reasonable to involve guns in the discussion.
Your capacity to attack arguments you wish people were making is superb.I disagree with DJ Jeff on the significance of gun laws in incidents like this, but I think he is right to point out the hypocrisy of the media when it comes to focusing on the issue of guns and not the other important underlying issue that will become apparent in this case. 20 people (most of whom will be gay) are now dead because of some backward religion that condones violence against gays in very clear and explicit terms and yet it is impossible to imagine the media attacking the Islamic religion in the same way it will attack gun culture.
The irony is the gun nuts should know better than anyone how hard it is to hit a moving target with a handgun at any sort of distance.
But they'll still use this to babble on about the 2nd amendment... Sad.
But they'll still use this to babble on about the 2nd amendment... Sad.
No. I'm attacking the argument you are making. You are saying that mass gun murder is nothing to do with guns as the murderer may have had other tools of mass murder if the guns had failed. The guns didn't fail and he may not have had other methods anyway. Either way you are making bullshit arguments that disrespect the dead.
I suspect when it's all confirmed that the shooter was a Muslim, you'll see less of "gun nut" & "psychopath" and more "terrorist" and his religion will be more of a focus. Let's be honest the religion of Dylann Roof's was never touched upon, this chap if he is Muslim will be mentioned frequently.
Because Roof's was a hate crime with the explicit intention of sparking a race war, whereas the perp here is aligned with radical Islam which is some of the most homophobic stuff you could lower yourself to reading.
If this is the case only in the US could such an attack occur so easily. You can't easily legislate against insanity but you can legislate against guns. A loon with nail clippers is far better prospect than a loon with automatic weapons.
Obviously Christianity has never been used to promote racism or homophobia ever. I'm not saying his faith was relevant in any case, just stating when it is confirmed that this person is Muslim, there will be much focus placed on his religion unlike any other situation.
His parents were from Afghanistan...
Who the shooter? It would still be an act of domestic terrorism regardless. And he has still grown up in the culture of mass shootings in America.
The gunman has been named. Omar Sadiqi Marten
Donald Trump is waiting to pounce.
Donald Trump is waiting to pounce.
But how much focus will be placed on the actual religion of Islam and what it teaches about homosexuality and violence? We'll hear talk of 'extremism' and 'hate', but who will have the guts to be honest about Islam and apply to it the same standard of objection that we apply to any other political ideology that advocates violence against gay people?
Yeah, but it doesn't apply in the Roof case, his was about race and not religion. This case seems quite undoubtedly to be religiously motivated hence people will focus on that.
The sad answer is no one. People have manipulated "Islam" to be an untouchable race in the media, and not a perfectly questionable ideology like any other that people willingly align themselves with.
Well this was about homophobia which no doubt has been a part of Islam. And likewise in Roof's case, Christianity has been used as a tool of racism.
That won't matter in the court of public opinion. I'm not arguing you're incorrect necessarily.
50+ dead. Jesus Christ...
Simple. You play enough X-Box you will think you can shoot as well as Navy Seal snipers.
You have an extensive training program that prepares soldiers to be ready for combat and yet blue-on-blue situations happen with some level of regularity. Normal civilians think they can shoot their way out of trouble? Movies meet false reality.
Over 50 dead and counting. Local authorities say death toll now 53.
Holy shit.
Aye fact of the matter is since he isn't white, public opinion will see him as a foreign. But he is an American.
Christ, over 50. Just awful.
I know someone who moved to Florida last year and when I saw him at Christmas he said he could not believe how easy it was to get guns there.
Something must surely be done, this is now the biggest gun massacre in the US since the 19th century.
I know someone who moved to Florida last year and when I saw him at Christmas he said he could not believe how easy it was to get guns there.
Something must surely be done, this is now the biggest gun massacre in the US since the 19th century.
Worse than first reported it seems.
Worst mass shooting in US history.
And just one shooter, that confirmed? 50 dead and 50+ more injured? Woah...
This is terrible 
Saturday night in a crowded club, I can see why. It's not like the schools/colleges where the gunman had to go from class to class. Seems like he just walked in and open fired on the crowd, similar to the Bataclan. Shocking stuff.
Honestly I'm not sure. I think there has definitely been more focused place on Islam than before, you obviously don't think enough has been. I suspect the reason why is most still don't know enough about the religion in the mainstream media and the representations you see are distorted from both sides.
Don't they have a smoking ban in Florida?
What the hell kind of weapon did he get ahold of? A full auto attack rifle?
I can understand people being allowed to buy shotguns and hunting rifles, but fecking tools of war?
I can understand people being allowed to buy shotguns and hunting rifles, but fecking tools of war?
50 dead 53 wounded apparently.
Yeah but the court of public opinion is stupid, instantly jumping to conclusions formed on biases and incomplete information and the whims of others. Nothing to see here.