David Moyes | West Ham in talks with him for managerial job

TheGame said:
How on earth is saying you need a better team saying you need to replace the whole team? He is saying they need to improve which they do and he is saying that improvements are needed in January which they are to improve the team and make it better. He is clearly stating the squad needs improving and in the same article, Big Sam is saying saying he was concerned at the lack of signings. The article is stating the failure of summer recruitment is affecting their form and Moyes needs to take responsibility for that however he is not stating they need to change the whole squad. The fact he is alluding to they have some good players however not enough clearly reflects this point.
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His modus operandi going back to his Everton days is to downplay the potential of the players at his disposal, thereby lowering expectations and making himself look great by achieving slightly above par. Everyone knows Sunderland are crap and it would be unrealistic to expect Moyes in his first season to achieve much beyond finishing 17th to 14th. However, there is no upside to the club in having the manager publicly talk down prospects -it is all about David Moyes' self-preservation strategy. That is why he rubs people up the wrong way long after he left United - he pushes the image of the honest, hard-working manager but is in fact a clumsy spin doctor for his own myth.
 
TheGame said:
Oh please, 'jumping in to defend poor Dave', this shows your biased opinions.
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You clearly are defending him though can't get around that fact. So we're both biased in that case.

TheGame said:
I was responding to your comments about the slow starts are down to his training methods, pointing out that it is common for other managers to also have slow starts so how is the slow start related to his training sessions exactly?
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His teams historically do start slowly, from Preston, Everton, United, i said maybe it's down to his rigorous training methods. A fair comment in my eye's. To this you responded with:
Sunderland have struggled to win any of their first 7 games in 3 of the last 4 seasons, nothing to do with Moyes in the previous seasons.
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Which for the 3rd and final time had absolutely nothing to do with what i was commenting on. Sunderlands previous starts under different managers have zero connection to the slow starts made in previous seasons by Moyes previous clubs. Which is what i was talking about not Sunderland. Do you follow now?

TheGame said:
I was referring to the fact that players make mistakes on the field and these are not in the control of the manager. If you read my other posts I have clearly stated the ultimate responsibility falls to the manager. There is no narrative to pedal. I have clearly stated in other posts that Moyes wasn't good enough at United. Clearly your hatred for Moyes is affecting your arguments.
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Not at all i've said in this thread many times i believe him to be a good manager i don't hate him dislike him sure but not hate, so thats that theory out the window. I am not saying you are alone are peddling the narrative that it's never his fault many on here do it. As for mistakes on the field not being the responsibility of the manager there i will disagree, if his team are not well drilled and coached to defend well than thats at least in part down to the manager. Sure individual mistakes can be the players fault alone, but when your team is making lots of them, then for me thats down to poor coaching and organization.
 
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TheGame said:
How on earth is saying you need a better team saying you need to replace the whole team? He is saying they need to improve which they do and he is saying that improvements are needed in January which they are to improve the team and make it better. He is clearly stating the squad needs improving and in the same article, Big Sam is saying saying he was concerned at the lack of signings. The article is stating the failure of summer recruitment is affecting their form and Moyes needs to take responsibility for that however he is not stating they need to change the whole squad. The fact he is alluding to they have some good players however not enough clearly reflects this point.
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Well we can both interpret his comments differently and thats fair enough mate, but i think you may have missed the key word in his quote, he says :

“Ultimately you have to have good players on the pitch and, at the moment, we’re not getting enough good players on the pitch. We need to get a better team, it’s as simple as that. We need to get a team which can give us results.”
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Now fair enough maybe he doesn't mean an entire new team, but it could be easily interpreted that way. When someone says they need to get a better team they might mean just that, he may actually not be talking about improving the current players. He's already said he needs several transfer windows to get the side how he wants it, so he may well be planning to change the entire first team.

In any case i'm sure a lot of his current players (the ones whose performances could ultimately lead to him getting sacked) didn't appreciate those comments.
 
prath92 said:
That comment was in relation to what he said in the previous conference.
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Fair enough mate, but i was replying to your comment in general. Lots of footballers, like many people in fact have fragile ego's. I think anything negative said in public by their manager can affect them.
 
fishfingers15 said:
No wonder Keane got fired, the guy hardly knew how to praise anybody bite
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Tell me you didn't just say that :lol:

But seriously you have to open your eyes to the positives to get your conclusion right: -

“You can talk about the things we don't do well but when you think about the things we do well, the honesty of the players, the desire, two goals away from home - it's never an easy thing to do. Against Serbia, who are no mugs, that was good. If we went away to a lesser team, and got battered, then that would be different.

“It is a game of opinions and if people want to say we could have done better in possession then I probably wouldn't disagree with them. I can understand the criticism. But if the DNA is to show fight and heart and grit then that is a nice DNA to have.”

~Roy Keane defends and praises the Republic of Ireland team, 4th Oct 16


“He looks like a really good player, a proper goalscorer. I’ve seen him a few times. Hope to God he comes with us, he’ll be a good addition to the squad.”

~Roy Keane praises Brentford striker Scott Hogan, 4th Oct 16


“They were outstanding, much better from Celtic. It was a really good game, both teams going for it. Celtic had the ideal start scoring early and obviously got the fans right behind them. Dembele was outstanding and to score three goals against Man City is never easy.”

~Roy Keane praises Celtic and Mousa Dembele, 29th Sep 16


“Dundalk are enjoyable to watch, they do well. I take my hat off to them.”

~Roy Keane praises Dundalk, 5th Oct 16


“I can't speak highly enough of Seamus. We're lucky to have him. I know he's at a good club like Everton but Seamus Coleman could play for any of the big teams, he could do that with his eyes shut.

“He's a great lad around the place and he's got a nice way about him. And when he was the captain the other night, you just knew he wouldn't let us down. He leads in a different way, different captains bring different stuff to the party, but he leads by example.”

~Roy Keane praises Seamus Coleman, 24th Jun 16​


And a bit of testimony from his time at Sunderland to tie-in with the thread: -

“Playing under Roy Keane is easy. If you work hard, he praises you. If you don't, you get criticised. He's a fairer man than people give him credit for.”

~Daryl Murphy, Sunderland


“And, much as he [Keane] could really dish it out, he was always very quick to praise you when you did well.”

~Jack Colback, Sunderland


"But credit to the players, they kept persevering and eventually we got our rewards. Barnsley made it hard for us.

"They were excellent goals, great finishes, from Dean Whitehead for the first and it came from good play by Liam Lawrence and Nuggsy (Nosworthy).

~Roy Keane praises Sunderland players​


I have more examples of Keane praising players whilst still at United and more recently praising Ferguson, praising Zlatan... he does it more than the media would lead us to believe. There is no comparison of the positive messages Keane sends out compared to Moyes. Perhaps that is in part why Keane is well regarded by most Sunderland supporters and the reason in the first 7 games Keane's Sunderland had 8 pts whilst Moyes' Sunderland have only 2pts.

Keano!

Well done, you caught a big one! But we can't be having any Keane-Moyes comparison go unchallenged - the two are like chalk and cheese.
 
gav81 said:
Tell me you didn't just say that :lol:

But seriously you have to open your eyes to the positives to get your conclusion right: -

“You can talk about the things we don't do well but when you think about the things we do well, the honesty of the players, the desire, two goals away from home - it's never an easy thing to do. Against Serbia, who are no mugs, that was good. If we went away to a lesser team, and got battered, then that would be different.

“It is a game of opinions and if people want to say we could have done better in possession then I probably wouldn't disagree with them. I can understand the criticism. But if the DNA is to show fight and heart and grit then that is a nice DNA to have.”

~Roy Keane defends and praises the Republic of Ireland team, 4th Oct 16


“He looks like a really good player, a proper goalscorer. I’ve seen him a few times. Hope to God he comes with us, he’ll be a good addition to the squad.”

~Roy Keane praises Brentford striker Scott Hogan, 4th Oct 16


“They were outstanding, much better from Celtic. It was a really good game, both teams going for it. Celtic had the ideal start scoring early and obviously got the fans right behind them. Dembele was outstanding and to score three goals against Man City is never easy.”

~Roy Keane praises Celtic and Mousa Dembele, 29th Sep 16


“Dundalk are enjoyable to watch, they do well. I take my hat off to them.”

~Roy Keane praises Dundalk, 5th Oct 16


“I can't speak highly enough of Seamus. We're lucky to have him. I know he's at a good club like Everton but Seamus Coleman could play for any of the big teams, he could do that with his eyes shut.

“He's a great lad around the place and he's got a nice way about him. And when he was the captain the other night, you just knew he wouldn't let us down. He leads in a different way, different captains bring different stuff to the party, but he leads by example.”

~Roy Keane praises Seamus Coleman, 24th Jun 16​


And a bit of testimony from his time at Sunderland to tie-in with the thread: -

“Playing under Roy Keane is easy. If you work hard, he praises you. If you don't, you get criticised. He's a fairer man than people give him credit for.”

~Daryl Murphy, Sunderland


“And, much as he [Keane] could really dish it out, he was always very quick to praise you when you did well.”

~Jack Colback, Sunderland


"But credit to the players, they kept persevering and eventually we got our rewards. Barnsley made it hard for us.

"They were excellent goals, great finishes, from Dean Whitehead for the first and it came from good play by Liam Lawrence and Nuggsy (Nosworthy).

~Roy Keane praises Sunderland players​


I have more examples of Keane praising players whilst still at United and more recently praising Ferguson, praising Zlatan... he does it more than the media would lead us to believe. There is no comparison of the positive messages Keane sends out compared to Moyes. Perhaps that is in part why Keane is well regarded by most Sunderland supporters and the reason in the first 7 games Keane's Sunderland had 8 pts whilst Moyes' Sunderland have only 2pts.

Keano!

Well done, you caught a big one! But we can't be having any Keane-Moyes comparison go unchallenged - the two are like chalk and cheese.
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:lol:

One guy failed at Man United and Sociedad. The other one failed at Sunderland and Ipswich :devil:
 
"I wish he'd stop posting about me."

~Roy Keane on gav
 
stevoc said:
Fair enough mate, but i was replying to your comment in general. Lots of footballers, like many people in fact have fragile ego's. I think anything negative said in public by their manager can affect them.
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Obviously it also depends on what you say. If you have a conference like rafa did then it is not helpful.

But in this case even the guy who posted the quote agrees the only thing is that comment is a bit unclear. Nothing negative.
 
prath92 said:
Obviously it also depends on what you say. If you have a conference like rafa did then it is not helpful.

But in this case even the guy who posted the quote agrees the only thing is that comment is a bit unclear. Nothing negative.
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Yeah fair enough mate if it's the comment i am thinking about it wasn't negative, just the usual confusing stuff from Moyes. He is a terrible public speaker, i think he may get nervous in front of the camera.

His other comments both at United and recently Sunderland about wanting and needing better players is not exactly inspiring stuff. He often seems to be trying to preemptively deflect blame from himself and protect his own reputation. Without realizing such comments can and most likely do affect his currents players confidence. He needs to realize his current players performances can get him sacked and have in the past.
 
This from Ian Ladyman's ''hot or not'' section in the mail today, Moyes made it to the ''hot'' section.

DAVID MOYES.

''Under pressure and in need of some friends, the Sunderland manager invited the local media to watch a full training session this week.

It's an old maxim but many forget it. Be nice to people and they may just be nice back.''
 
Great, so the media can see exactly where he goes wrong in training.
 
GazTheLegend said:
It's cathartic.

It somehow eases the pain from many years ago, akin to group therapy.

The people that come into these threads and say how tiresome it is should just avoid any thread to do with Moyes, frankly, because Moyes bashing is a fun and easy pasttime and the guy -deserves it-.
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Amen
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
This from Ian Ladyman's ''hot or not'' section in the mail today, Moyes made it to the ''hot'' section.

DAVID MOYES.

''Under pressure and in need of some friends, the Sunderland manager invited the local media to watch a full training session this week.

It's an old maxim but many forget it. Be nice to people and they may just be nice back.''
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Moyes kissing the arses of journalists? Never.
 
I think he might be done as a football manager. The game has moved on and he doesn't look willing nor able to adapt his style. He genuinely looks clueless out there.
 
If he cant take a point of Stoke, i think he can just step down as a PL manager. Getting more or less beaten easily by the second placed team from the bottom.
 
2 points out of a possible 24, a loss to relegation rivals and rock bottom of the table. Not looking good for the chosen one.

Big Sam may be back in work soon enough.
 
bev7s9.jpg
 
It really is a relief to not have that feeling of despair knowing that he's actually our manager whenever a topic about the man crops up. Those were some dark times.
 
Is this where someone comes in and says "anyone would find it tough at Sunderland look at their squad etc.", or is it later in the weekend?
 
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