Perhaps not, but he really isn't the sort of player that I would call good. Do you think he would have got in Gordons side last night?
Mourinho's real task at Utd - An overpaid, over-hyped squad that needs fixing
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Perhaps not, but he really isn't the sort of player that I would call good. Do you think he would have got in Gordons side last night?
Hold on who are we taking about? Zlatan Bailley Mikytarin or Pogba?? As I think Rojo is honking!
This is not the press though. When you look at him statistically against the top 6, he has not been great. He only had one good game where he was passing for fun and that was against Chelsea, but with the system they were playing, it was normal we would see more possession.
He has a 5 year deal you are talking about 3-4 games! This big game nonsense is thrown about to much against every top player! (Messi doesn't score against English teams) well he has his last dozen games! Plus flat track bully is another one but truth being we don't play the top 6 or 5 every week. The question is do you think Pogba improves us? The answer is a resounding yes!
Are you serious? Moving Manchester United out of Manchester would probably be the stupidest thing we could do and a complete disservice to the loyal fans of Manchester.
I do not think he was
Indeed I am, but at the moment he is looking well short of his level and appears to be a flat-track bully. Of course, I am not going to give up on him, but he needs to up his level a great deal and realise that he doesn't have as much time on the ball in the Premier league as he did in the Italian league. Just for information purposes, the total number of passes completed against Manchester City (twice), Liverpool and against Chelsea equal 185 passes with a 79.5% passing accuracy. He managed 188 passes against Hull and Burnley alone and his passing accuracy was 87.75%. Statistically speaking, and the maths do not lie; is that he is more involved against cannon fodder like Hull, Burnley (who we should have won at least 8-0), than he is against the top 6. So, with that being said, we will just have to wait and see, to see how he does against Arsenal.
Players are generally going to play better against bad teams than they are against good teams. Plus Mourinho does not prioritize possession in big matches.
A big problem is that Utd have spent circa 1/2 billion since Ferguson left and have gone backwards. A period of backwards was inevitable but not this long. One FA cup to show for an investment that large borders on criminal. Given the outlay since 2013 I don't know how much more there is in the kitty for Mourinho to spend. If he tries to raise funds by clearing out the deadwood what can he realistically expect to raise. Is he prepared to/expected to maximise the playing squad at his disposal before more spending will be sanctioned. Managers fall or rise based on their signings and since 2013 Utd's record at signing players is patchy.
Looking at all the top 5 over the last 5 years and spending and trophy haul. Do you think we are way out??
Yes I do to be honest. City and Chelsea have both won the league since 2013. Liverpool look like seriously challenging for the title this season. Utd look a mess at the moment despite the lavish spending. I just don't see how from the season to season since Fergie retired a plan to evolve your first 11. In fairness to Mourinho he has kind of hit the pause button on players leaving and has brought in a minimal amount of players. Taking stock if you will.
I think outside Arsenal and City (EPL) we have a collection of individuals to match anybody. With DDG Martial Shaw Bailley and Pogba would all start for any EPL team in my opinion. We just have not gelled and lacking in key areas with our other players. Herrera, Smalling, Zlatan, Mata, Rashford and Valencia are all top players. Carrick and Bastian are in their twighlights and need replaced. Myktarin and Depay have not matched expectations to date. The rest do not pull up trees and this is where the problem lies in my opinion.
Just searched for other headlines other than the Daily Mail and it is shocking to say the least if it is true. As the highest paid footballers in world football, we should be at least doing something positive. Take away Rooneys salary and we would have been 2nd place. Oh well, at least we are first in something and it cannot be taken away. Furthermore, it is going to get worse, since any big name player who wants to come and play here would want equal pay or more to other top stars.
long-time lurker here when it comes to anything united. i just wanne leave my impression here: well, how do i say it. my mom would have spent those 500 millions-since-fergie on a much better, much more levelled and indeed well-functioning, competitive squad. year after year i sometimes glance at the current united squad and i don't know what to say really. under-performing is phrasing it politely. plus the way united are being run as a club, without a director of footballing who has a vision beyond whatever manager's contractual spell, is mind-boggling really. you guys have been burning so much money for literally and figuratively nothing, it's almost cringe-worthy, to be honest. please note that i do not mean to offend or insult. it's just a dortmund supporter's opinion, and i am anything but hostile to united's cause...
Ever heard of hard returns or capital letters?
There's nothing shocking or surprising about it. I think everyone in world football knows we're the highest payers and are not getting our money's worth.
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Why do you think Jose is demanding that these highest paid footballers in the World put more effort into playing?
We have overpaid staff, not prepared to play through the pain.
Jose must be doing his nut in, when he sees this 'will to not win'.
Hopefully, we can off-load a few of the players who are paid big bucks and deliver nothing on the pitch. Jose needs to send out a message that finishing 4th, 5th & 7th place is not acceptable.
Some fans argue that Jose should not call out players in public. I would argue that he is not doing enough. He needs to tell the media that in January, several players are going to be leaving (even if he does not mean it) - this will definitely force some players to play harder, as if their career depends on it.
The high end earners at our club will be escalating our wage bill. The problem with this is that Zlatan, Rooney and BFS are not in their prime, the are on the way to being over the hill. We are overpaying older players when their wages should be decreasing, then if our younger players start really producing they will feel entitled to top dollar as well.
Annoying to see how much dross survived last summer. We let kids go, but the average to crap players on big money have stuck around. On those wages, quite a task kicking them out.
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First of all, José is a good manager, that is never in dispute however, what is clear is that they have lost that air of being a "family", from when Sir Alex Ferguson was here. He created a family and he treated every single one (not just players but everyone associated with Manchester United i.e. tea ladies, secretaries, coach drivers etc) as his family. His vision was to create a unit that represented Manchester United on the highest level. It is a bit like going on a school trip, you wear your school uniform, and you are representing your school wherever you go. Individually, you are not being criticised or being shown up for one person messing up; in fact the whole school you represent is being shown up.
If he is doing his nut in, then it is not working and never has. He just doesn't have those range of emotions as the gaffer did. If he wants to get rid of the players, he should do it instead of making it public. That is how Sir Alex Ferguson did it with regards to those who succumbed to the drinking culture at the club. I have to agree with you in the bolded part, in that yes, he should get rid of those who think they are entitled to earn big money and do next to nothing. If that was the case, Wayne Rooneys name has to be first on the list. As for the bolded part, no he doesn't, he just needs the balls to just do it there and then. It is upto him to prove that he is bigger than the players. If he cannot do that, then he is not the right man for the job. This has been seen during his tenures at Chelsea and Real Madrid, where player power was significant compared to his own. What he should be aiming for is to be number 1, and if he is asking them, or indeed telling them to play for 4th, 5th or 7th place, then he is simply not the right manager.
As Bill Beswick once said in his interview with Sir Alex:
No. I wasn't. However, if I were a top European player looking for a move to the Prem, I would only go to a London club, or City at a push.
There's more to life than just the footy and Manchester is not somewhere many people would choose to even visit. No offence to any proud Mancunians intended.
Even Morrissey moved to LA!
The two bolded parts totally contradict what you are saying. Either you think Manchester is not a good enough city for the world class players or you don't. I am a proud Mancunian and I prefer Manchester to London by a long way. In fact, if someone gave me the money to make a choice between London and Manchester, I would move to Manchester.
Further to that, how can you explain Eric Cantonas love of Manchester, when he comes from parts where it is sunny nearly all year around and makes a London summer feel cold by comparison?
As a top player I would possibly consider Manchester if it meant playing Champs League under Pep alongside Aguero, Silva, de Bruyne, etc.
Otherwise I would rather play for even a dump team in London like Spurs. Young Fancy Dan players want the London/Paris/Barca lifestyle with the clubs and the top fanny.
You then brought China into the equation earlier on, which I am not sure to take seriously or not. Anyways, this whole argument doesn't make sense and the goalposts are moving from one side to the other.
We had 3 managers who signed different players who they thought were good. Only few players are good enough for United. Woodward should be blamed for that, he went behind Galacticos and superstars instead of trying players who were available.
Tradition is a powerful thing
Ive been watching Utd from the 70s and as a rule we have always been around paying some of the highest wages, and transfers for players. It goes with the territory. The richest clubs in the world all do it, thats why they are or were successful. Liverpool where perhaps the best payers for 2 decades and won loads of trophies. Utd then took over that mantle in the late 80's early 90's, and with the fluke of having half a dozen top class kids all break through roughly the same time 95/96 we had a bit of a breather. Arsenal took over the mantle late 90s and they started winning, then Chelsea, then City etc. There is a meandering pattern between highest wages/transfers and success. Its more leveled out now as City Chelsea, now Arsenal and Liverpool again as well as us being the highest paying teams. Leicester apart, which was an anomaly, you will always get a team win the league who pay some of the top wages/transfer fees.
So you were wumming. My apoligies
Great post. Some of those wage comparisons are mind boggling. Depay on more than Coutinho!
For every Cantona there are far more players who look down their nose at Manchester it seems. I am from Manchester myself and love the city, but if you've got the choice between Manchester and Paris/Barcelona/Rome/London most people will choose the latter.
We've started to pay big wages recently but unless the players really want to come here, we'll just get mercenaries. Maybe that's why fergie hardly ever spent big on anyone from outside Northern Europe.
Personally I would move the training headquarters to the south of England and fly the players up to Manchester with matches. The lure of living in London might make us more competitive and enable us to get top-quality players without paying obscene amounts.
Can't disagree with that, it's how I view United currently, too much money spent on too many average players. It's shocking how much we've spent and the teams we put out weekly.
Here are the highest earners at the other clubs in the top 5 compared to the highest earners at United:
Real: Ronnie and Bale make around 300k per week and the next highest earners they have are Ramos, Modric and Benzema at ~160k;
Barca: Messi @ 260k, Neymar @ 250, Suarez @ 200. Next highest player after that is Iniesta @ 160k;
City: Toure (1 year left) & Aguero @ 220k , Silva/KDB @ 160k; and
Chelsea: Hazard is the only player on 200k a week, with Costa just a bit behind at 185k.
United: Rooney @ 250-300k (3 years left), Pogba @ 300k, Zlatan @ 200k, Schweinsteiger @ 200k (2 years left) and DDG @ 200k.
I have no problem with us paying the highest wages. The difference between United and the other top 5 clubs on that list are the types of players United pays the highest wages to, and the thought process that goes into giving out these contracts. You could easily make the case that there's a direct relationship between those clubs' highest paid players and their most important players. It's also not difficult to understand why those players were given those contracts. Even in the case of Toure, he was extended after his incredible 2013 season where he put City on his back. You compare that to our highest earners, and you have to wonder what we were thinking with some of these contracts. Ignoring the Rooney contract, we made Schweinsteiger the highest paid midfielder in Europe (not including Toure) at the age of 31, and gave him a 3 year contract. Pogba earns between 130-160k per week more than the likes of Iniesta, Modric, Verratti, and Kroos.
I know the standard response to one of these posts is "not my money, can't be arsed" but this club doesn't operate with a bottomless budget. At some point, spending money foolishly without an end product to show for it will catch up to this club.
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How many big name players went to Paris before they were took over by the Qataris? The most successful clubs at that time were Marseille and Lyon. Of course, Paris have good players now simply because of the wealth that is promised. As for paying big wages, I think Rooney has clearly profited well in spite of saying this at the time, when he signed a contract with Everton for £13k per week:
However, with regards to the training headquarters, what would that really change? So they can go out and have fun, they can do that in Manchester. As for the bolded part, I am sorry, but that is nonsense. If London didn't inspire the Chelsea team to do well for José Mourinho last season, then I don't know what will. If you think going to London would make them "more competitive", then Sir Alex Ferguson has been wrong all the time. Damn the man!!!! Someone should have told him a lot sooner.
Exactly!!! Even Verratti himself (whom I would love at Manchester United if there was a chance stated that not even he himself is worth £90 million so why should anyone else. Earning extreme amounts of money per week more than players who are of higher quality stinks of desperation from the club to do what it can to get a player, outpricing the competition and in the end, having a wagebill second only to f'ing Microsoft.
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For information:
Iniesta has won 8 La Liga titles
4 champions leagues, 3 European SuperCups, 3 World club cup championships
1 world cup and 2 European championships
Yet Pogba earns more........there is clearly something wrong.
Nonsense? Ok then, tell me how many world-class non-British players have moved to Manchester (United or City) at the peak of their careers.
Thanks for the contextomy @JohnnyKills . If you are going to quote mine me, then please quote me where I said the "nonsense", part. Here is what I was referring to:
This is what I referred to as "nonsense." So, again, I am going to ask you, as to why we were so successful under Sir Alex Ferguson, in spite of NOT having any training facilities there? How come we were so successful in getting players to come to dreary old Manchester when the only time it doesn't rain, it snows instead.
You haven't answered my question, but never mind. Here's my take:
Ferguson was a genius and was able to win trophies without signing elite players from overseas. His success was largely based on homegrown kids, Premier league signings and recruits from Holland and Norway.
It was brilliant while it lasted but it seems we have to compete on a more global scale now. Hence things like location are more important.
I agree. Some players we pay top dollar for are either past it or nowhere near deserving of their wages.In fact if it was me running Utd I would give a max 4 year contract and anyone 28 or over a 2 year contract, perhaps with a years extention on the clubs side if everything ok. Rooney had a 5 1/2 year contract I believe with either side able to add an extra year. That was crazy, especially as he was in decline.