The worst thing about today's game is, that Arsenal are in no way worse when it comes to individual quality compared to Liverpool. At least that's the way I see it. Liverpool are simply far better coached and the squad is much better assembled.
Arsenal are a shambles
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Exactly. A couple of seasons without competing in the league and we these knee jerk reactions. Wenger needs the chance to bring his players in and to make his mark on the team. This is still a Pat Rice team at the moment.
Wenger should have received a phone call after the 4th goal went in, sacking him on the spot. By some distance the worst manager in the PL. If Arsenal don't sack him with immediate effect, then they may as well just fold as a club, right now.
That is the worst performance in 25 years of PL football.
That is the worst performance in 25 years of PL football.
You're absolutely right about the overreacting in general, but Arsenal's hapless struggles go way beyond this season. The whole club has been steeped in failure for years and doesn't ever seem to have any great desire to change. And the last 2 defeats are so typically Arsenal that they're almost parodic.
The midfield is as big an issue for them as the defence is. There's not a single player in that midfield with Cazorla seemingly permanently injured. They've always been bad at the back but they used to have a midfield that could stop it from being so evident. Players like Xhaka, Coquellin, Ramsey and Elneny are nowhere near good enough.
In part I agree with you but as Gary Neville pointed out their midfield never tracks back, that is down to desire to get the ball. That's basic football to track back, you don't need direction from the manager to do that.
The specialist in failure 
I've said it before but they've got too many players running down contracts who blatantly don't care. Mind boggling that you'd actually start them over new signings, never mind sell them.
I suspect Wenger is going through the motions too in what will be his final season.
I suspect Wenger is going through the motions too in what will be his final season.
hasn't he just signed a two year extension or something?
They should pay whatever it takes to get rid of him.
I think those things tend to come together. When you are playing this well oiled machine of Liverpool where everyone has a clear job and purpose and you are expected to make up a solution on the fly, this happens. It's difficult to give your best when you're so frustrated.
Give those guys a competent coach and they run everywhere. But without a good coach to believe in and without the believe that you can actually achieve anything, there is no reason to put in the extra work.
Tactics and coaching influence the mental aspect of the game a lot. The players have no real incentive, no reason to do extra work. They'll never win anyway. But most of all, there is no reason to play for your coach if your coach doesn't do anything to progress you in your career. Wenger is making nobody better. Klopp makes his guys better. I'd leave my heart on the field for guys like Klopp, Simeone, Mourinho, Pep or even someone like Tuchel or Nagelsmann. But I couldn't be arsed to care about a team coached by Wenger.
I know you love playing Devil's advocate on here but this is stretching it a bit!
Arsenal fans were bragging that Cech would get them the title. That is going well.
Can't believe this is a 54 minute old thread. There probably is a thread from 4 or 5 years ago we could continue to use.
Said it at the end of the last season, their fans will regret the FA cup they won so hard after Wenger renew his contract because of it.
They're a real mess and they won't solve it. Wenger should have gone multiple years ago and they should have started to rebuild the team with a new manager but the board doesn't give a feck about the team.
They're a real mess and they won't solve it. Wenger should have gone multiple years ago and they should have started to rebuild the team with a new manager but the board doesn't give a feck about the team.
Typical caff knee jerk...
They are still settling into their newish stadium
They are still settling into their newish stadium
I was jealous when Arsenal got Ozil. Funny how things are panning out now and i don't have that feeling anymore
That's exactly what i was aiming forIncredibly specific. Like a true poet you paint the world with that description.
I feel sorry for arsenal fans, by the way wenger signed a new 2 year deal last season and their lack of spending. Now they are even selling players before buying which is a joke.
They were right for him to demand to step down. Neville was too much into giving him respect position which was outright wrong.
They were right for him to demand to step down. Neville was too much into giving him respect position which was outright wrong.
You mean like liverpool stretched arsenal's bumhole today?
The signs were all there when Leicester went and put 3 past them on the opening day. They all bring it on themselves, were probably giddy after they beat Chelsea in the Community Shield, now look whats happened
I'd love to hear Mourinho's take on this, privately
From my analysis after today's game, Sanchez and Ozil are not happy.
Depressing for Arsenal fans. Arsenal will pick themselves up, have some excellent games and finish relatively high up the premier league table by the end of the season. But they won't win it again and probably won't finish in top 4 again, they might somehow win the FA cup again somehow and it all looks right as rain.
But this is just groundhog day for them. Wenger is not the right man for the job anymore. Surely he must see the establishment he has built slowly crumbling around him and his ideas are not working at all. He has gone into this season changing from his back 4 to a back 3 thinking its going to revive his teams fortunes, but its the same rubbish as always. On top of that, his best players are running down their contracts, so now you've got players who are not committed to the cause.
Wenger really should have walked away 2 or 3 years ago, saying he's taken the team as far as he can and no one would debate that. I also hope the fans would also celebrate what a fantastic person he has been in our league for the past 20 years.
But this is just groundhog day for them. Wenger is not the right man for the job anymore. Surely he must see the establishment he has built slowly crumbling around him and his ideas are not working at all. He has gone into this season changing from his back 4 to a back 3 thinking its going to revive his teams fortunes, but its the same rubbish as always. On top of that, his best players are running down their contracts, so now you've got players who are not committed to the cause.
Wenger really should have walked away 2 or 3 years ago, saying he's taken the team as far as he can and no one would debate that. I also hope the fans would also celebrate what a fantastic person he has been in our league for the past 20 years.
the records have been bad for 10+ years but the old and conservative manager till stays
5th last season but no improvement in summer
3 best players uncommitted, eager to go
If you were an Arsenal player right now, what would you do?
May be just be in the pitch, somehow play a duty game and the main thing is to collect the salary payment each weekend.
5th last season but no improvement in summer
3 best players uncommitted, eager to go
If you were an Arsenal player right now, what would you do?
May be just be in the pitch, somehow play a duty game and the main thing is to collect the salary payment each weekend.
They've got problems all over the park but holy shit that central midfield pairing. Xhaka was a complete mess and Ramsey out of position for 90 minutes, wanting to burst into the box every time they attacked. Carragher's just said it, a manager who had Petit and Viera bossing it must know this is not good enough but he's done nothing to address the issue and has pacy Liverpool attackers waltzing into the final third to terrorise his back four.
Why not play Lacazete? Ridiculous. What is going on at the club
That's exactly what i was aiming for
Haha, well done mate. I salute for it!
Forget that...
Why the feck not play Kolasinac? Or another defensive midfielder to play with Xhaka?
One of the worst performances from any team ever? Not too far off England v Iceland.
Nothings changed, they're irrelevant unfortunately, they used to be one of our best rivalries.
It'd be an overreaction if this was a one-off, but considering their lack of success over the past - what is it now, 13 years - I don't think it's an overreaction to call it a crisis. Especially because results like this aren't exactly out of the blue with them.
They've had some real stinkers against the big teams down the years, and this is just the latest one. I wouldn't be surprised if this isn't their biggest loss of the season either.
They've had some real stinkers against the big teams down the years, and this is just the latest one. I wouldn't be surprised if this isn't their biggest loss of the season either.
It's not anything we haven't seen before, is it? Get absolutely tonked by a top 4/6 rival, string of poor results, most fans turn on Wenger, fight with the others who still support him, toxic environment surrounding the club, go on a good run and end up being in the top 4 or thereabouts when the season ends. Board reiterates faith in Wenger, fans start supporting him again hoping he will learn from his mistakes, but the new season follows the same pattern.
Wenger to resign during this international break. Heard it here first.
Claude?
Who cares about Ozil? He rarely gives his all these days.