Luckdane's luck has finally run out. He is a subpar coach and more of a figurehead. All Madrid do is cross and repeat.
Zinedine Zidane | Resigns
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
What's he supposed to do about the finishing this season though? these lads get paid outrageous amounts of money but have made goal scoring look like it's not part of their job descriptions.
So you're saying he's Moyes mk II just without the hair and a different accent?
You guys are underestimating Zidane. He is not a bad manager at all.
He's not, but his style of management doesn't lend itself to getting out of a rut. He makes the players comfortable and enjoying their football, and it works great when they are hungry. Albeit, After a back to back CL and no investment into the squad to keep competition high, it's inevitable that complacency will set in and then you add on top of that injuries, reduced squad depth and loss of form of their biggest player, it's quite clear how this is going to turn out.
He's a very good manager and has enjoyed one hell of a lot of success in a short period at the start of his career. Will be interesting to see how he evolves as a manager. Needs to get a mean streak when it comes to getting rid of players and start constantly reviewing his squad to keep competition fierce and having no room for complacency.
Won as many CL's in 2 years as Fergie won here in 20 odd...
Won as many trophies as Guardiola has in 2 years, as Guardiola did at Barcelona...
Just saying...
Won as many trophies as Guardiola has in 2 years, as Guardiola did at Barcelona...
Just saying...
Having the two best players ever on your respective teams helps I'd say. How often did Sir Alex have the best player in the world playing for him? Only once, in 2008 when we won it.
Could argue Keane and Scholes were the best midfielders in Europe at certain points in their careers. Giggs, Beckham, Stam, Irwin, Cole, RvN, Veron, Giggs, Stam, Schmiechel, Kanchelskis, Ronaldo, Tevez, Rio, Vidic, Rooney...He wasn't exactly working with slim pickings now.
Not taking anything away from Fergie, wouldn't swap him for anyone, nor am I trying to blow smoke up Zidane's arse. My point wasn't really meant to be directed towards anyone here either
My point pretty much was, how come Zidane is not talked about as the 2nd coming, as Guardiola was, when they both had two seasons under their belt in their careers?
Why is Zidane not talked up more? Why is his achievements just given a nod of, "meh yeah whatever" by the same people who think Guardiola is some sort of Messiah?
He wasn't bereft no, but the gap between Ronaldo and Messi and everyone else has been so great for the past 10 years that it's no coincidence Real and Barca (therefore Pep and Zidane) have dominated.
As for your main point, I think the reason Zidane isn't being talked up more is because people want to see how he'll respond to this current challenge. Until Pep started proving himself at City there was always a question mark over his head. "That's all well and good winning with the best squad in the world, let's see you manage Aston Villa."
I think their reputations were pretty similar, pre-City and pre-Madrid form slump. Zidane was getting plenty of credit, as well as the same apprehension Pep got due to managing the best team around.
I don't get why's so reluctant on using Ceballos. Is Vallejo injured?
Eh? Pep's spent nearly £400m on a squad that already had £350m spent on it the precious 3 seasons (and around £500m the years preceding that). How is that proving he can do anything other than coach a squad full of extremely talented players?
Up against Valencia tomorrow. Could be worth a watch.
Talk of Pochettino and Loew so far...think Florentino is hoping it will be Zidane still
Actually over 2 seasons, Zidane won 7 trophies and Pep won 8
Zidane did nothing with the Castilla side while Pep won the 4th division
Never won a treble
Never won 6 trophies over a season, translating to winning every competition they entered
Over 9 Clasicos, RM won only once against Pep - with Zidane over 4 Clasicos, they won only once as well
One created a memorable style of play that defined an era, the other will not & will most certainly be out of a job before year 3 of their tenure
Just saying...
Thanks. Will be interesting to see.
Löw? I can't begin to imagine him as anything else but manager of our national team.
Think he will do it until retirement too, unless:
-we win the next WC
-we fail utterly and horribly at the next WC
I'm not saying I agree with it. But the question marks that surrounded Pep at Barca and Bayern seem to have gone away. People seem to be more sure that his managerial methods work. We know better than anyone that people are all too happy to ignore his spending though.
And if you are honest, it's because he is in the PL. Pep isn't more proven today, he hasn't done anything that he didn't do before.
Which is fair, because City aren't in the sort of two horse race you routinely get in Germany and Spain.
There is nothing fair about it, last year they weren't in a race at all and this season they are in a two horse race like in Germany and Spain. It's not as if the PL had more than two teams performing at the same time.
And 3 clubs are better than 2, I guess. I was a bit of a sceptic before he went to City, but I'm definitely starting to believe that he's among the best around. Even if he does need to spend obscene amounts of money.
I don't think I understand your point tbh. The fact that City weren't in a race last season backs up my point. Barca and Bayern are always in a title race, no matter who's in charge. Almost without fail. Hence the achievements of their managers will tend to be taken with a pinch of salt.
To come to the PL and dominate it like City have done this season is, hence, a more impressive achievement than what he did in Germany. And that's not just because PL fans are biased about the quality of their league.
Not if the 3 clubs are worse than the 2, which is the case for his time in Spain. They had to play at an incredibly high level to outperform Real Madrid.
That too. And not just 3 clubs; 3 different leagues.
Yeah but City being worse than Barca and Bayern is kind of the point isn't it? That he's able to keep winning with a lesser club is what many doubted about him. They'll overlook the fact that he'll just buy world class players if he didn't inherit them, mind. But then what top tier manager doesn't spend?
But he is doing it with a lesser competition and more money available, he isn't doing anything special when you look at his time with Barcelona. What was special with Barcelona was the ability to play at an extremely high level with extreme consistency, La liga isn't easy because you can't have a bad month, if you do your rival is gone. Then he played at an extremely consistent level in CL and that's also extremely hard to do. He didn't do any of these things with City, the direct competition isn't as good as Real Madrid, there is less pressure to lose and he can outspend everyone(which he did) but United, who happens to be in rebuilding mode.
My point is that people are at the same time overrating is current work and underrating his previous work, he isn't doing a better job than Mancini in 2012.
I agree with all of that apart from the bolded really. To say he hasn't got City performing at a high level consistently seems a bit odd when they've taken 65 out of 72 points. It wouldn't really matter if his competition were in rebuilding mode or not because that's such a good record they'd still be out in front anyway. In fact to look at United's points return you wouldn't guess we were in rebuilding mode, we're having the average season of a title challenger. It just so happens they've raised the bar.
It's not odd, you have to judge him on his entire time with City not the 6 months where they are consistent. What would you say if they only match Mancini's 89 points season? I find it odd that anyone would consider that he is the real deal because of the last 6 months, he is the real deal because of his entire career, the last six months aren't better than the rest, the future could though.
I'm judging them based on this season as a whole. Most managers tend to get a pass in their first season anyway. Klopp had it, Jose had it, Pep had it. Year 2 is when you're expected to make stuff happen.
fecking hell. Yes Lord Pep created possession style football. Plenty of teams have played this style and used a press, maybe not so effectively (because they didn't have peak Xavi, Iniesta and Messi) but to say he created it is so far removed from reality it's not even funny. The one thing I will credit him with his getting his teams to accept injecting performance enhancing drugs as the norm.
But that's what I don't get, these 6 months aren't more important than any other 6 months in his career and it's only 6 months too. That's why I'm surprised that they are the reason you became a Guardiolista.
It's a cumulative effect I guess. These periods don't exist in isolation, they build on eachother. And for him to have gotten City playing like they are now and running away with the league, you have to admit there's something there. Even at Bayern I didn't buy it 100%.But that's what I don't get, these 6 months aren't more important than any other 6 months in his career and it's only 6 months too. That's why I'm surprised that they are the reason you became a Guardiolista.
Neither were most Bayern fans. Glad he’s gone. I fully expect City to crash and burn in the second half of the season, just like we did every season under him. He’s resistant to learning from his mistakes and he will make the same mistakes again.
I said years ago the era of barcelona and real madrid dominating will end once messi and ronaldo retire/leave/decline, in my opinion these clubs will have a few years where they aren't really challenging at all in europe, both la liga outfits with a lot of older players, we are beginning to see real madrid post ronaldo. In 2 years perhaps the same shall be happening at barcelona.
Guy hasn’t coached a club for 15 years!For me Guardiola was always the real deal simply because he has the ability to make his players play exactly how he wants them to play, how good they are depends on the individual level of the players but he has the rare ability to teach his vision.
Edit: On topic, that's why I'm skeptical about Zidane, he has shown decent man management but has a coach I haven't seen anything yet.
Ronaldo is in decline, so they need to push him out this summer. Maybe name a stand after him, and then replace him with a player like Kane, Hazard, or whoever. It's the Madrid playbook. They haven't had to make major signings for the last few years because Ronaldo almost singlehandedly was winning them CL titles. Zidane in his early tenure also seemed to be getting the best out of the entire squad, with the emergence of players like Asensio, and Isco coming into superb form.
The problems at Real require minor surgery. They don't need to buy 5 players, what they need is a goalscorer to make up for Ronaldo's decline and maybe a playmaker to add support. A GK is the last piece of the jigsaw for them, hopefully Courtois.They could also use a midfielder like Tielemans/Lemar or Nainggolan (or both) as Modric is getting on in years and Kroos needs a consistent partner besides Casemiro.
The problems at Real require minor surgery. They don't need to buy 5 players, what they need is a goalscorer to make up for Ronaldo's decline and maybe a playmaker to add support. A GK is the last piece of the jigsaw for them, hopefully Courtois.They could also use a midfielder like Tielemans/Lemar or Nainggolan (or both) as Modric is getting on in years and Kroos needs a consistent partner besides Casemiro.
In short, I expect them to spend 300m~ this summer. But on 3 (maybe 4) top players, not 5-6 squad players.