Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

stefan92 said:
Please learn which countries exist in Europe before commenting. I was talking about Slovakia, not Poland. You are of course right that the US send Patriots to Poland, but that wasn't the point of my post.
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And your point was? Do you really think that Germany is helping the defence of Ukraine and Eastern Europe and not the USA?
 
frostbite said:
And your post was? Do you really think that Germany is helping the defence of Ukraine and Eastern Europe and not the USA?
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I posted about the German contribution and that we do at least fulfill some backfill for other countries that send their stock of weapons to Ukraine. You denied any German contribution by claiming it was the US that did it and Germany wasn't involved. I wasn't even talking about the US until you started to lie about German contribution.
 
Rajma said:

Mental gymnastics by Russia.
It was sunk yesterday but cool story bro.
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Yeah, but this time isn't it the Russian MOD saying it?

Or do you mean that it really was sunk yesterday, but the Russians didn't want to to admit it?
 
I think we are entering an important point in this war. Ukraine can win this war. And it is very important for Americans and Europeans to really force Germany help with this. They are still doing very little. They have to do much more and probably they have to be forced to do the right thing. All European countries should tell Germany this. It is crucial!



The High Price of German Hesitancy

https://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/86872

A Russian victory in Ukraine would change the map of Europe. Germany could help prevent this by sending vital military equipment to Kyiv and banning Russian energy imports.
 
Putin getting a sinking feeling that all is not well.
 
nimic said:
I don't think that's supposed to be spin, "it was hit so bad that it sunk while it was being towed" isn't exactly the official story either. Do you have any evidence it actually sunk immediately?
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@GlastonSpur, It was confirmed by our minister of defense via Romanian/Turkish sources in the black sea.

 
stefan92 said:
I posted about the German contribution and that we do at least fulfill some backfill for other countries that send their stock of weapons to Ukraine. You denied any German contribution by claiming it was the US that did it and Germany wasn't involved. I wasn't even talking about the US until you started to lie about German contribution.
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I am afraid Germany is very corrupted by Russian interests. Gerhard Schröder was on Putin's payroll. Do you think that other German officials also made a fortune supporting Putin? Could this be one of the reasons that Germany is not helping Ukraine as much as it could?
 
frostbite said:
I am afraid Germany is very corrupted by Russian interests. Gerhard Schröder was on Putin's payroll. Do you think that other German officials also made a fortune supporting Putin? Could this be one of the reasons that Germany is not helping Ukraine as much as it could?
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I think it's simpler, Germany's economic interests aligned extremely well with the Russian, and getting closer to them was essentially German doctrine since the 70s and proved successful as it was crucial for the German reunification. This wouldn't have been possible without huge concessions of the Soviets, so from a German perspective Russia was much less hostile than it was to other countries like the Baltic states.
 
If this is true, it may really help Ukraine in this war. From Forbes:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelpeck/2022/04/13/ukraine-may-get-us-mq-9-reaper-strike-drones

Ukraine May Get U.S. MQ-9 Reaper Strike Drones

Ukraine is in talks to purchase American-made heavy attack drones that could shift the balance of the Russia-Ukraine war.

Ukrainian officials met in Washington last week with General Atomics, the California-based manufacturer of military drones, including the MQ-9 Reaper, the U.S. Air Force’s primary reconnaissance and strike UAV. Though the U.S. government would have to approve any sale, it is unlikely that such talks between Ukraine and a U.S. defense contractor would have happened without a green light from the Biden administration.
 
stefan92 said:
I think it's simpler, Germany's economic interests aligned extremely well with the Russian, and getting closer to them was essentially German doctrine since the 70s and proved successful as it was crucial for the German reunification. This wouldn't have been possible without huge concessions of the Soviets, so from a German perspective Russia was much less hostile than it was to other countries like the Baltic states.
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Sometimes history depends on a few very crucial people. For example, if Trump was still president today, I am afraid it is quite possible that USA would be bombing and denazifying Ukraine together with brother Vlad!
 
frostbite said:
Sometimes history depends on a few very crucial people. For example, if Trump was still president today, I am afraid it is quite possible that USA would be bombing and denazifying Ukraine together with brother Vlad!
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Come on. Trump was an idiot, but bombing Ukraine? Nah.
 
It really feels now that Zelenski is having his Churchill moment. Fortune favours the brave.

It still so terribly sad that this happens however, Russians or Ukrainians dying just following orders.

Only if the leaders of the countries went on the battlefield first how different it would be.
 
frostbite said:
And your point was? Do you really think that Germany is helping the defence of Ukraine and Eastern Europe and not the USA?
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This is a very weird thing you're consistently doing.

In this case @stefan92 made a very specific claim. You said they were wrong. When it turns out that you're the one who is wrong, you deflect and ask a totally irrelevant question that you cannot possibly have inferred fairly.

I'm saying consistently, because I remember just a couple of days ago you were talking about Russian vs American death tolls in the last 20 years, with you claiming that Russia killed more. You also brought up WW2 (and possibly WW1, hard to tell). You talked about the European debt crisis. Then, on a dime, you turn around and say you're not interested in talking about the past. Of course you are, you just spent hours doing it! What you meant was that you wanted to criticise Germany's and Russia's pasts, and that other things in the past don't matter.
 
VorZakone said:
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The ability of Americans to deliver an absolute feck ton of materiel to a battlefield in a record amount of time is impressive. You have to give it to them. And it is only rivalled by their ability to always find some extra money when it comes to military spending.
 
With the Moskva taken down by just a drone and 2 missiles that had a 100% hit-success rate, China will be quietly scrapping any plans to launch an invasion of Taiwan across 100 miles of open sea.
 
Wonder how many sailors have been rescued. Could be a huge casualty count.
 
GlastonSpur said:
With the Moskva taken down by just a drone and 2 missiles that had a 100% hit-success rate, China will be quietly scrapping any plans to launch an invasion of Taiwan across 100 miles of open sea.
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It is possible that Xi's navy isn't as shit as Putin's.
 
VorZakone said:
Wonder how many sailors have been rescued. Could be a huge casualty count.
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According to the Lithuanian Minister of National Defence, apparently only 54 rescued out of the approx. 500 on board.
 
GlastonSpur said:
With the Moskva taken down by just a drone and 2 missiles that had a 100% hit-success rate, China will be quietly scrapping any plans to launch an invasion of Taiwan across 100 miles of open sea.
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You sure the missiles were delivered by drone? Would think they are land based, but haven’t found a source on it. They weigh nearly a ton each, so not sure a drone could carry them.

In any case, the loss of the cruiser cannot be overstated in tactical or symbolic value. This is something they cannot just replace. It would take years. Probably as costly as the rest of the hardware they have lost on land.

Simply great news!
 
Mike Smalling said:
You sure the missiles were delivered by drone? Would think they are land based, but haven’t found a source on it. They weigh nearly a ton each, so not sure a drone could carry them.

In any case, the loss of the cruiser cannot be overstated in tactical or symbolic value. This is something they cannot just replace. It would take years. Probably as costly as the rest of the hardware they have lost on land.

Simply great news!
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Apparently they used a drone to draw attention on the one side whole hitting the ship with those missiles from the other side
 
TwoSheds said:
It is possible that Xi's navy isn't as shit as Putin's.
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True. But it's also possible that the Taiwanese anti-ship missiles are more sophisticated - and definitely a lot more in number - than those developed by the Ukrainians.
 
Mike Smalling said:
You sure the missiles were delivered by drone? Would think they are land based, but haven’t found a source on it. They weigh nearly a ton each, so not sure a drone could carry them.

In any case, the loss of the cruiser cannot be overstated in tactical or symbolic value. This is something they cannot just replace. It would take years. Probably as costly as the rest of the hardware they have lost on land.

Simply great news!
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Not delivered by drone. The Ukrainian story is that a drone was used to distract the ship's radar orientation and missile defence systems on the starboard side, whilst two Neptune missiles came in and hit on the port side.
 
VorZakone said:
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That's a lot of money but I suppose nothing near what the US spent in Iraq.

Still, these significant contributions from NATO and EU countries makes me wonder if there is some kind of rope-a-dope strategy being played by China and Russia here. Hopefully that's just me being an idiot.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
That's a lot of money but I suppose nothing near what the US spent in Iraq.

Still, these significant contributions from NATO and EU countries makes me wonder if there is some kind of rope-a-dope strategy being played by China and Russia here. Hopefully that's just me being an idiot.
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Huh? How would that work?
 
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