Which three Spanish midfielders are better than him than? You are going to struggle to find even one who has outperformed him this season.
Aaron Ramsey
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Xavi and Iniesta are undoubtedly better midfielders than Fabregas. A run of good form on Fabregas' part does not mean he's suddenly better then those two players. The third, for me, is Xabi Alonso.
good run of form for half a season...
As it stands, Fabregas is the best performed midfielder in the world.
After half a season of Ronaldo's massive season he was being called the best player in the world on here. Rednev's suggestions are hypocrisy at its best.
Xabi Alonso..over Fabregas.. controversial.
A very strong view there, I'd say this season Fabregas has been better than either so why should that not matter? I'd also say last season Fabregas played in a very disjointed team and system last season whereas this season has seen him hit top form again, him playing at this level is no surprise to most so why should his current form not count?
As for Alonso, get the feck out of here.
Pretty sure he's made more outrageous comments regarding Fabregas in the past. You'll learn to take his opinion lightly.
Fabregas is brilliant. I wish he was playing for us.
Anyway back to Ramsay...
I like the fact that both these last two goals have come from his opposite, and both good strikes (especially the first, which was fantastic). A goal scoring midfielder who can run games? Yes please.
But now with Song gone the midfield three will all have to all shoulder much more of the defensive duties, don't know if anyone bar an on-form Diaby would be up to it.
I like the fact that both these last two goals have come from his opposite, and both good strikes (especially the first, which was fantastic). A goal scoring midfielder who can run games? Yes please.
But now with Song gone the midfield three will all have to all shoulder much more of the defensive duties, don't know if anyone bar an on-form Diaby would be up to it.
I blame Gary Neville
going on more than the past six months, I think it's questionable that Fabregas is better than Iniesta or Xavi. It's something to take into account though and on that evidence there's not a lot between the three, though Xavi edges it for me, despite Iniesta being more exciting to watch and Fabregas matching his productivity. He simply does everything right and has end product to boot.
As for Alonso, I'd probably take him in the holding role over any of the three, so in a Spanish midfield three he'd probably get in anyway, but I don't think he's better than any of them overall.
All four are in with a shout for being the best in the world in their respective positions though. Will be exciting to watch Spain in the world cup.
As for Alonso, I'd probably take him in the holding role over any of the three, so in a Spanish midfield three he'd probably get in anyway, but I don't think he's better than any of them overall.
All four are in with a shout for being the best in the world in their respective positions though. Will be exciting to watch Spain in the world cup.
Not to mention Senna!
Torres and Villa must be wetting themselves when international duty comes around.
Torres and Villa must be wetting themselves when international duty comes around.
Not even last year, when he probably had his best year at Liverpool, was Alonso even in the same league as Fabregas at his best.
Ramsey's shown a lot, but I don't think we've seen Ramsey run games yet, and that's a crucial consideration for gooners.
For me the interesting question is not whether he'll end up a great midfielder of some kind; it's clear he will. It's what kind of midfielder he'll end up as -- and whether he's the kind who could run games -- that is, whether he'd be able to replace Cesc when he goes to Barca.
He's able, sometimes at least, to spot the great pass; and he's technically excellent. But it takes a lot more than that to control the tempo of a match or to manage the team's attacking play the way Cesc does. Or Xavi or Scholes, for example.
Ramsey's other good qualities are his strength, his work rate, his ability to make late runs and pop up in goal-scoring positions and then to finish. Thus far he looks to me more like an Gerrard/Ireland-type all-action midfielder than a playmaker.
So the two questions, I guess, are:
1) Will he eventually be able to do the sort of thing Cesc does? (Not necessarily as well, just possessing the same general qualities.)
2) If he's a different kind of midfielder, does that matter? Can he still be the center of a title-winning midfield?
He ran Arsenals champions league game v the Greeks, passing and moving, dictated the tempo as well as playing some great through balls.
I think he could do the Gerrard as well as a deeper playmaking role.
Scholes was a goalscoring midfielder before he become a playmaking one. And tbh, from little what I've seen so far, Ramsay has the intelligence and ability to become that type of player. I'd hate the fact that he'll achieve that at Arsenal though.
Can you define your version of end product?
In half as many games Fabregas only has 10 less goals the Xavi.
Xabi Alonso is no better than our own Michael Carrick. Neither are as good as Fabregas.
Regarding Ramsey - his style of play reminds me of Iniesta. He looks a really exciting prospect. Wish we had signed him.
Fabregas has it all IMO.
Fabregas is behind Xavi,Iniesta and Xabi Alonso imo but Ramsey is fecking hard. Im actually pissed we missed out on him. My bro has seen him live a few times and is always impressed.
The hater I am, I normally look down my nose (and a big nose it is!) at Arsenal players but I can't deny how hard Ramsey is and at 19 he is only going to get better.
The hater I am, I normally look down my nose (and a big nose it is!) at Arsenal players but I can't deny how hard Ramsey is and at 19 he is only going to get better.
Was just thinking recently if Arsenal would sell Ramsey if the price was right? I think next season he will really flourish when Cesc goes to Barca or Real. I know he only signed a new deal at Arse over the summer but if Anderson does not show his promise come the summer and we got around 14 Million for him then would Arsenal sell Ramsey for a similar fee or cash plus highly rated reserve team player like Petrucci in return! I know its just pure fantasy!!
I am sure Fergie probably thought it was a done deal at the time as he was a United fan and Ramsey probably could have earned more at United. I think if he had met Fergie in person and used his smooth talking skills then he would have signed for us.
This and all other opinions to the same effect are pretty laughable to be honest. Iniesta and Xavi have proven on the biggest stage that they are the two best midfielders out there right now. That's huge games in the Euros, in the Champions League and in La Liga. Time and time again they have dominated world class opposition over the last two years.
You're calling Fabregas the better midfielder on the basis on six months (let's not forget Barcelona are still clear at the top of La Liga) where his side are still in third place in the league and have lost or drawn against every big side they've faced. Dominating Bolton and West Ham won't cut it, we're talking best in the world here. When Fabregas dominates Man Utd and Chelsea like Xavi and Iniesta did last season then we can talk about him being at their level, because right now against top opposition he is more often than not anonymous, just like he was on Sunday.
TBH, I haven't seen Barca play all that much this season, but the question is, will del Bosque include Fabregas in the starting XI for Spain? I think not, although I think he is currently at the same level as those two. Not a chance Alonso is anywhere near that bracket though.
You mean halfway through 07/08, after he was in a lot of people's eyes better in 06/07? And even then, right from January 2006 he was excellent.
Not quite the same considering Fabregas last season was at least a level below his best.
How often are national teams picked on current form as opposed to winning formula though? (or in france's case sydnrome arriéré mental directeur) Fabregas coming off the bench worked perfectly for them so i doubt he will start unless their 3rd group match is for shits and giggles.
Fair point. You could argue that Xavi and Fabregas play a similar position, at least more so than Iniesta and Fabregas. Xavi is simply the best midfielder in the world, so Cesc is unlucky that way.
In the spanish team Fabregas plays the number 10 role, which he has been moved towards at Arsenal, where Xavi plays deeper. I would say it's more unlucky that Torres and Villa are around.
From memory,
A.
---Torres--Villa----
Iniesta---------Silva
------Xavi-----------
-------Senna/Alonso-
B.
-------Torres/Villa
----Fabregas
Ineista--------Silva
-----Xavi----------
--------Senna/Alonso
Fabregas really is Spain's plan B at the moment. Not a bad plan B i must say.
agreed
Their is no question about Fabregas's talent and ability.
He has proved himself at such a young age.
He has proved himself at such a young age.
So what is this current form? Because last I checked Fabregas was a bit crap at the weekend whilst Barcelona are still top of their league. Moreover is this current form stretching as far back as the Chelsea game? Cause Fabregas was a bit shit that day as well. Or are you saying Fabregas is the worlds best midfielder between November 29th and January 30th? Although that's quite the accolade I'd point out that during that time you played Villa (x2), Bolton (x2), Portsmouth, West Ham, Hull, Burnley, Liverpool and Stoke. So that's three games against decent teams (of which you won two and drew one) and a lot of games against absolute shite. I'm not really sure that teaching the likes of Bolton and Portsmouth a footballing lesson is really enough to justify this best midfielder in the world on current form.
why the crap is this thread all about fabregas?
I always thought Fabregas did dominate games against us, the only reason they lost a lot of games against big teams is because they have a strikers who has composure of a donkey. How did Fabregas do when Arsenal went to the champions league final?
What a crap argument. First of all, Xavi & Iniesta have each other in the team, not to mention a lil' fella named Messi, a Dani Alves, a Thierry Henry, etc. Fabregas has...Arshavin. And a bunch of also-rans.
My point is that to denigrate Fabregas in relation to Xavi and/or Iniesta based on the relative performances of their teams without regard to the relative strengths of their teams is at best insincere, if not just foolish.
Jimmy Bullard has nothing but poor players playing along side him, does that mean he's top class because he looks alright alongside them? All this is straying from my point anyway, which is that aside from taking apart crap sides (which he has always done) Fabregas has done nothing this season to show that he's stepped up to Xavi and Iniesta's level and if his performances against us and Chelsea are anything to go by he's where he's always been -- a damn good player but not quite at the level of the very best just yet.
I really can't remember (BBC says he was subbed off for Flamini in the 74th minute) but it's that long ago I don't think it would be fair to use it for or against him regardless of how he played.
Not sure why it was a funny claim. It's certainly debatable. Personally i'd have him in the top 3, but in 3rd place. So it's hardly inconceivable that others would have him maybe 4th or 5th.
No, it'd mean he'd look better alongside better players. Either you're being overly argumentative and realised that, or you're a bit dim. I think we both know which one it is.
I can't see how anyone who has 11 goals and 11 assists in just 19 league starts, and has shown he's perfectly capable of dominating games as well as winning them, isn't one of the very best.
Not true in all instances. Some players look shit hot for average teams then struggle to step up when at a top side. I'm not saying that's true in the case of Fabregas, because the lad is fecking outstanding, just pointing out that it's not always the case.