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Do you think there will be a Deal or No Deal?

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  • Poll closed .
Paul the Wolf said:
Agreed that every bit of legislation will be challenged and have amendments but all I can see is March 29th coming and going and the UK find themselves out of the EU with no deal.
Sleepwalking to disaster.

Imo both May's strategy of kicking the can down the road and Corbyn's silence will backfire on both of them spectacularly. Unless someone comes to their senses in the next 80 days.
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Im not even sure they have 80 days...
How long would it take the EU to agree to extend article 50? - I'm guessing its not a 1 day job?
At this rate i could see us on 28th March having to decide if we annul A50 unilaterally or if we have a hard brexit... and even then if we choose to remain I can see the brexiters sneeking a 2nd class stamp on the letter and it not getting there in time... its a bloody mess and as you say time is running down and as the legal default position is to leave with no deal then each passing day makes that more likely (a delightful and terrifying prospect depending on peoples POV)
 
sun_tzu said:
Im not even sure they have 80 days...
How long would it take the EU to agree to extend article 50? - I'm guessing its not a 1 day job?
At this rate i could see us on 28th March having to decide if we annul A50 unilaterally or if we have a hard brexit... and even then if we choose to remain I can see the brexiters sneeking a 2nd class stamp on the letter and it not getting there in time... its a bloody mess and as you say time is running down and as the legal default position is to leave with no deal then each passing day makes that more likely (a delightful and terrifying prospect depending on peoples POV)
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Yes really minds have to be made up by the end of this month.
The only point of extending A50 is to eventually revoke it so why waste time. Cancelling it on 28th March would not totally surprise me though. However, no deal is still favourite imo but not through intent but through sheer incompetence.
 
Sigma said:
Calls him a bully, as he is part of a large group of people harassing and hounding someone.

Also, the irony of these anti-EU protesters taking inspiration from the French yellow jacket protest.
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It’s not really an irony tbf. The far right in France also got involved in the Gilet Jaune protests. It seems as though there were regular scuffles between right wing protestors and antifa.

 
sun_tzu said:
Im not even sure they have 80 days...
How long would it take the EU to agree to extend article 50? - I'm guessing its not a 1 day job?
At this rate i could see us on 28th March having to decide if we annul A50 unilaterally or if we have a hard brexit... and even then if we choose to remain I can see the brexiters sneeking a 2nd class stamp on the letter and it not getting there in time... its a bloody mess and as you say time is running down and as the legal default position is to leave with no deal then each passing day makes that more likely (a delightful and terrifying prospect depending on peoples POV)
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Does an extension require a formal request to extend the deadline requiring EU approval? Could the UK parliament not pass legislation to revoke the Art 50 notification on the basis that there would be a period of [?] to reconsider the issue, possibly involving referendum 2? In the meantime the UK would continue as an EU member. The ECJ ruling stated that unilateral revocation of Art 50 was possible provided it was not exercised abusively. If the UK was fully transparent and kept the EU 27 informed of its plans in such circumstances, then presumably there would not be abusive behaviour, even if Art 50 was submitted for a second and final time at the end of that process. That still causes a huge mess of course in terms of uncertainty and EU elections but it would reduce the risk of a hard Brexit by accident due to the 27 being unable to reach a unanimous agreement on extension by 29 March.
 
MoskvaRed said:
Does an extension require a formal request to extend the deadline requiring EU approval? Could the UK parliament not pass legislation to revoke the Art 50 notification on the basis that there would be a period of [?] to reconsider the issue, possibly involving referendum 2? In the meantime the UK would continue as an EU member. The ECJ ruling stated that unilateral revocation of Art 50 was possible provided it was not exercised abusively. If the UK was fully transparent and kept the EU 27 informed of its plans in such circumstances, then presumably there would not be abusive behaviour, even if Art 50 was submitted for a second and final time at the end of that process. That still causes a huge mess of course in terms of uncertainty and EU elections but it would reduce the risk of a hard Brexit by accident due to the 27 being unable to reach a unanimous agreement on extension by 29 March.
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To the best of my knowledge based on the recent couet case...
UK can cancel brexit themselves (unilaterally revoke A50)
Extending the exit deadline under A50 requires a formal request and all 27 members to agree. (and yes the EU elections do substantially complicate this )
 
sun_tzu said:
To the best of my knowledge based on the recent couet case...
UK can cancel brexit themselves (unilaterally revoke A50)
Extending the exit deadline under A50 requires a formal request and all 27 members to agree. (and yes the EU elections do substantially complicate this )
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That’s my broad understanding too but maybe revocation could be used as a de facto extension (particularly if there is an expectation that there would be no need to re-submit Art 50, as the most recent polls suggest).
 
Sigma said:
Calls him a bully, as he is part of a large group of people harassing and hounding someone.

Also, the irony of these anti-EU protesters taking inspiration from the French yellow jacket protest.
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Yup, mentioned that previously. In France, you are required to wear one of those high vis jackets if you breakdown. You must carry one in your car for the driver & each passenger.

Hypocritical fecking twats!
 
I'm confused. Are Tommy Robinson supporters calling other people Nazis now?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Nah, not a non-sequitur at all. Brexit is dominating British politics right now and it impact will be felt for generations. People like Corbyn (and Owen Jones) will forever be defined by the side they take on this issue. The same side as those twats in the hi-vis jackets.

Seeing as I'm not a politician, my personal politics really are a non-sequitur in this discussion...
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I wrote a snarky reply* but it's not worth it, since I think and will continue to think that the comparison is laughable and a cheap point and you obviously think and will continue to think there's actual political commonality worth pointing out between Tommy Robinson and Jeremy Corbyn.

All I'll say is that what Owen Jones was doing wasn't journalism, he's a known face going into a rally that hates him with his camera on just to get a reaction like that. So well done, you proved that people who claim to hate you do hate you.


*Combine this post with this other post of yours and then point out that capitalism sets the constraints for politics.
 
berbatrick said:
I wrote a snarky reply* but it's not worth it, since I think and will continue to think that the comparison is laughable and a cheap point and you obviously think and will continue to think there's actual political commonality worth pointing out between Tommy Robinson and Jeremy Corbyn.

All I'll say is that what Owen Jones was doing wasn't journalism, he's a known face going into a rally that hates him with his camera on just to get a reaction like that. So well done, you proved that people who claim to hate you do hate you.


*Combine this post with this other post of yours and then point out that capitalism sets the constraints for politics.
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That Cumberbatch drama created a horrible sense of almost grieving all over again.

Ah well I'm sure the competency of parlaiment will cheer me up over the next few week
 
I rather liked this image. Hardly great political debate (sorry) but there isn't much going on (but not nothing) at the moment.

brexit-cat.jpg
 
berbatrick said:
If there was a Tommy Robinson rally, I am a brown guy sometimes with a beard, I'd use a different road.
I don't blame him or anything, I don't think it's great journalism.
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Point taken but if that rally was on a road where you would normally walk why should you have to take a different one?
 
sullydnl said:
I'm confused. Are Tommy Robinson supporters calling other people Nazis now?
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They've been doing that for a long time. Classic deflection and projection response to getting called out. See also "freedom of speech" "fascist" etc etc

We should bring back National Service (ironically something they would probably support) but those pie munching twats would curl up and cry like small children in a military environment.
 
I don’t really condone the whole punch a Nazi thing but I’d be lying if I said I’d get no satisfaction from seeing the bearded hi vis bloke get a smack in the chops.

In almost every other European capital (and most US cities?) a gathering of right wing bullies like that could expect to run an antifa gauntlet. How come there doesn’t seem to be any counter-protestors outside parliament?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I don’t really condone the whole punch a Nazi thing but I’d be lying if I said I’d get no satisfaction from seeing the bearded hi vis bloke get a smack in the chops.

In almost every other European capital (and most US cities?) a gathering of right wing bullies like that could expect to run an antifa gauntlet. How come there doesn’t seem to be any counter-protestors outside parliament?
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I suspect that whilst they are bullying MPs rather than ethnic minorities antifa are fairly happy to sit on the sidelines and laugh at the stupidity on show, leaving the police to pick up the pieces if it turns nasty. If they were to wade in to try to block these pricks you can pretty much guarantee they would be the ones departing in handcuffs.
 
Bury Red said:
I suspect that whilst they are bullying MPs rather than ethnic minorities antifa are fairly happy to sit on the sidelines and laugh at the stupidity on show, leaving the police to pick up the pieces if it turns nasty. If they were to wade in to try to block these pricks you can pretty much guarantee they would be the ones departing in handcuffs.
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I just think it’s depressing that they’re allowed to behave like that without any kind of counter protest. It doesn’t need to be violent either. I was staying in a hotel in Berlin when Pegida staged a gathering in a city square, spouting xenophobic bollox through a loud hailer. A massive gathering of counter-protestors surrounded them, quietly out-numbering them by about ten to one. No laws were broken but it was a powerful demonstration that wankers like this don’t really represent the people. It’s a shame this doesn’t seem to be happening here.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I just think it’s depressing that they’re allowed to behave like that without any kind of counter protest. It doesn’t need to be violent either. I was staying in a hotel in Berlin when Pegida staged a gathering in a city square, spouting xenophobic bollox through a loud hailer. A massive gathering of counter-protestors surrounded them, quietly out-numbering them by about ten to one. No laws were broken but it was a powerful demonstration that wankers like this don’t really represent the people. It’s a shame this doesn’t seem to be happening here.
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If they were to try to outnumber them outside the Palace of Westminster like that then they would be judged to be the threat and moved on if not arrested.

It's a weird place at the best of times and Brexit has turned it into a circus with both the pro EU and Brexit loons camped out there at all hours of the day and night shouting the odds and waving their placards hoping to get on camera but generally just bemusing tourists and getting in the way of normal people heading to work. Prior to Brexit though it was not much different, just a more diverse crowd of loons with some fairly disturbing displays,anti-abortionists with gigantic posters of aborted foetuses, falun gong supporters with photos of torture and murder victims, anti hunt lobbyists with their grizzly photos etc
 
berbatrick said:
If there was a Tommy Robinson rally, I am a brown guy sometimes with a beard, I'd use a different road.
I don't blame him or anything, I don't think it's great journalism.
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You shouldn't have to change your route because of anybody, least of all due to rascists or facists.
 
Probably an unpopular opinion but i see little wrong (apart from being dimwitted) with those incidents from protesters, they weren't blocking the path of either and being called a nazi is hardly abuse. I certainly reserve the right to call some of the robinson plonkers nazis.

Sometimes i think politicians and journalists expect to be able to live in a bubble, getting their message out whilst not being directly challenged by the plebs.
 
Bury Red said:
If they were to try to outnumber them outside the Palace of Westminster like that then they would be judged to be the threat and moved on if not arrested.

It's a weird place at the best of times and Brexit has turned it into a circus with both the pro EU and Brexit loons camped out there at all hours of the day and night shouting the odds and waving their placards hoping to get on camera but generally just bemusing tourists and getting in the way of normal people heading to work. Prior to Brexit though it was not much different, just a more diverse crowd of loons with some fairly disturbing displays,anti-abortionists with gigantic posters of aborted foetuses, falun gong supporters with photos of torture and murder victims, anti hunt lobbyists with their grizzly photos etc
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Aye, fair point. I guess different rules apply so close to Parliament.
 
Smores said:
Probably an unpopular opinion but i see little wrong (apart from being dimwitted) with those incidents from protesters, they weren't blocking the path of either and being called a nazi is hardly abuse. I certainly reserve the right to call some of the robinson plonkers nazis.

Sometimes i think politicians and journalists expect to be able to live in a bubble, getting their message out whilst not being directly challenged by the plebs.
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It fits any reasonable interpretation of harassment and intimidation. It's aggressive and designed to instill fear and as such the plod should be having a look at it before the inevitable happens and someone gets hurt.

Jo Cox ring any bells?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Shithead with a beard has a name, apparently. He’s James Goddard from the EDL.

Mind you, his real name is probably Emmanuel Fitz-Dalrymple.
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Like that all his social media ask for PayPal donations. Obviously in it as a point of principal and not to make his money like the next Stephen Yaxley-Lennon
 
Oldyella said:
Like that all his social media ask for PayPal donations. Obviously in it as a point of principal and not to make his money like the next Stephen Yaxley-Lennon
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Just seen him described as a "pound shop SYL" Seeing that SYL is pure pound shop himself that's quite the put down.
 
Barca84 said:
It fits any reasonable interpretation of harassment and intimidation. It's aggressive and designed to instill fear and as such the plod should be having a look at it before the inevitable happens and someone gets hurt.

Jo Cox ring any bells?
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That would criminalise a lot of protests, all the protests against Farage and Boris during the referendum for instance. Honestly, you had an issue with any of that?

Jo Cox was murdered, unless you think I'm saying its okay to attack individuals exactly what comparison are you trying to make?

If you crack down on direct protest because you don't like the protesters or their message you also reduce your own ability to protest. Are we saying the public have no right to protest towards politicians/journalists in person unless it's an organised debate event?
 
Smores said:
That would criminalise a lot of protests, all the protests against Farage and Boris during the referendum for instance. Honestly, you had an issue with any of that?

Jo Cox was murdered, unless you think I'm saying its okay to attack individuals exactly what comparison are you trying to make?

If you crack down on direct protest because you don't like the protesters or their message you also reduce your own ability to protest. Are we saying the public have no right to protest towards politicians/journalists in person unless it's an organised debate event?
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I'm saying there's a thin line between legitimate protest and unlawful behaviour and that politicians and journalists, like any member of the public, have the right to not be threatened on the streets of this country. And that is what is happening here.

And yes protest can be organised and lawful (we do have laws for this) and points of views can be expressed without threatening and intimidating behaviour which invariably escalates into violence if left unchecked. That's the link with the murder of Jo Cox - it's the next step from some feckwit like Goddard thinking he can get in the face of an MP or a journalist without some sort of comeback.
 
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Barca84 said:
I'm saying there's a thin line between legitimate protest and unlawful behaviour and that politicians and journalists, like any member of the public, have the right to not be threatened on the streets of this country. And that is what is happening here.

And yes protest can be organised and lawful (we do have laws for this) and points of views can be expressed without threatening and intimidating behaviour which invariably escalates into violence if left unchecked. That's the link with the murder of Jo Cox - it's the next step from some feckwit like Goddard thinking he can get in the face of an MP or a journalist without some sort of comeback.
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Okay maybe i missed it but i didn't here any threats just name calling. If there were threats then i retract my point.
 
Smores said:
That would criminalise a lot of protests, all the protests against Farage and Boris during the referendum for instance. Honestly, you had an issue with any of that?

Jo Cox was murdered, unless you think I'm saying its okay to attack individuals exactly what comparison are you trying to make?

If you crack down on direct protest because you don't like the protesters or their message you also reduce your own ability to protest. Are we saying the public have no right to protest towards politicians/journalists in person unless it's an organised debate event?
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I think there’s an important difference between a protest against a particular ideology or political movement and the targetted intimidation and harassment of individuals, which seems to be what is happening here.
 
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