Democracy, they say. I said it previously but some subjects are for specialists, the subjects altered by Brexit are for the most part way too complicated for none specialists, the average jurists would need the support of economists, constitutional/trading law specialists and multiple professionals to give sense and context to a large part of it. And after that you need actual negotiators to build a deal.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Democracy, they say. I said it previously but some subjects are for specialists, the subjects altered by Brexit are for the most part way too complicated for none specialists, the average jurists would need the support of economists, constitutional/trading law specialists and multiple professionals to give sense and context to a large part of it. And after that you need actual negotiators to build a deal.
Thing is young generation only talks the talk when it comes to actual actions for worse or better it is normally elder people that make the difference.
If Airbus was to actually leave then most of their subcontractors would most likely restructure or die, that's a lot more than 14000 jobs and that's just in aeronautics. In reality you have to take into account all the the services that work for the employees, from restaurants to shops. It's like when mines are closed, it has an impact on everything around it.
This post is just as stupid as those who think only stupid people voted for Brexit.
Good luck John!
Why does nobody challenge this twat to show us what Brexit 'done well' actually looks like and means?
Nobody else can show us what done well looks like so he should either put up or shut up.
it's just a notion and a feeling that we're gonna be alright on the Leave side with no factual basis behind it at all isn't it?
This is the problem, no-one challenges anything in the UK media, oh it's a jolly jape , what a laugh - the country's going to the dogs but nobody must make a fuss or call people out or woe betide call someone an idiot. Stiff upper lip and go down with the ship. Absolutely ludicrous.
Because he's a snake and won't own anything anyway. If you manage to get a definitive statement, any criticism would be labelled as a misrepresentation, and then he'll just go back to making empty, generic statements and keeping track of his bank balance.
To be fair, there is no answer and that's the problem. From the beginning the problem is that some people in the UK misjudged the power balance, triggering art.50 was the entire plan, it was supposed to create panic among EU members who would try everything to keep the UK happy. Remember, German car constructors were supposed to force Merkel's hands and Germany, who controls the EU, was supposed to impose a deal beneficial to the UK.
That won't happen because the media is equally accountable since it backed brexit. However things are slowly changing. For example The daily mail editor has resigned. Most will milk till the end of the circus show and then vanish, probably to europe
Yes, agreed.
Here's another example from today:
Fox, speaking on the second anniversary of the Brexit vote, said it was essential the EU believed Britain was serious about the threat to walk away from negotiations. “I think our negotiating partners would not be wise if they believed that the prime minister was bluffing,” Fox told the BBC. “I think it’s essential as we enter the next phase of the negotiations that the European Union understands that and believes it.”
Did anyone from the BBC point out to Fox that it's the UK who are shooting themselves, not in the foot, but in the head.
If that was really the case then the UK would be investing heavily on setting systems in place such as customs, arranging a deal with wto etc.
I wont be surprised if the Eu delays everything only to offer a take it or leave it deal at the end of this year. The Uk will have to choose between a financial meltdown of epic proportions or signing anything that is thrown at it
But the deal is already there, either the UK remain in the CU/SM, pay what they have to or they leave outright in March.
What the negotiable or rather discussion parts are the citizens rights and the Irish border. If that is resolved the future relationship will be discussed and will be based on the choice the UK makes. The UK have the choice to make now or at the very latest in the autumn.
I know it's hard to think that a government could be this incompetent but I do believe that they are , mixed with a group of self-interested leeches who couldn't give a toss what happens to the country.
A 1% shift in unemployment in the UK amounts to around 350k people. In the last recession the rate went up by ~4%. Maybe we avoid a recession somehow but it is safe to say more than 14k jobs are on the line.
This is different to the financial crisis too. This is a country rich with foreign investors, which we rely on, actively encouraging them to leave.
117,000 jobs would be affected. But that's only Airbus. What about all the other companies who would leave? Plus the ripple effect on the rest of the economy as pointed out by @JPRouve.
Someone, somewhere in the UK will wake up soon.
Surprising how few political fecks have been given.
A major employer has warned about the impact on thousands of jobs as a result of Brexit and from watching Newsnight the day the story broke, neither the government nor the opposition were willing to put up anyone to even discuss it.
Very soon people will be losing their jobs and May's going to be talking about a 'Red white and blue, full-on-Britishy-witishy-Brexit' and Corbyn's going to respond by announcing plans to launch a campaign to save sea turtle. It's comic, almost.
Tories are destroying the country through some hard-right ideological agenda that makes no fecking sense and stands up to feck all reasoning or logic, and Labour are desperately trying to disguise the fact they're happy to look the other way with their "We're only the opposition, wtf do you expect us to do - oppose things?" defence.
A major employer has warned about the impact on thousands of jobs as a result of Brexit and from watching Newsnight the day the story broke, neither the government nor the opposition were willing to put up anyone to even discuss it.
Very soon people will be losing their jobs and May's going to be talking about a 'Red white and blue, full-on-Britishy-witishy-Brexit' and Corbyn's going to respond by announcing plans to launch a campaign to save sea turtle. It's comic, almost.
Tories are destroying the country through some hard-right ideological agenda that makes no fecking sense and stands up to feck all reasoning or logic, and Labour are desperately trying to disguise the fact they're happy to look the other way with their "We're only the opposition, wtf do you expect us to do - oppose things?" defence.
The state of this.
Look. You still think everyone who voted leave is an idiot and isn’t as good at critical thinking as you. This is a fact. You subsequently believe you are smarter than 17 million people which is hindering your ability to debate properly. Open your eyes a little. I did 18 months ago and it’s far more rewarding
What about his statement is wrong?
I didn't say anyone who disagrees with me is an idiot
but :
Yes I do believe that everyone who voted Leave is an idiot apart from those who have a vested interest in the UK collapsing economically. I also think people are idiots whether they voted Leave or not who believe that the UK are going to have a wonderful time if they leave with no deal. It's not an opinion - the UK cannot survive economically if they crash out. The 2008 crash will seem like a walk in the park. It's not me who has to open their eyes.
Also if you hadn't noticed the debate about the referendum finished two years ago, the only debate left is whether the UK leave but stay in the CU/SM or whether they crash out. They're leaving, it's just a question of how. The Uk government still think they can cherry pick, they definitely,without question, cannot.
So either they shut up about leaving the CU/SM or leave tomorrow , what are they waiting for, they are going to negotiate what? It is farcical.
I reckon I'm smarter than at least 17 million brits. It's not an outrageous claim.
The point is he thinks everyone who voted to leave is a moron. This is clearly not the case and 1000 posts repeating the same things isn’t going to change it
And being in a Norway style agreement is not “EU in all but name” at all
It’s all changed since you left
It's clear he thinks those who voted against their own interests because they were duped and too lazy to find out the truth are morons.
I'd agree with that.
I left this last Tuesday. What happened in between?
Maybe it’s not all about the immediate cash aftermath.
As pointed out numerous times a "Norway" style agreement is not the solution, there are still borders, ask Airbus, BMW ,Jag, and hundreds/thousands of others.
Ask Northern Ireland/Ireland
The UK is a small island with a large population with very few border crossings - if you go back a few pages all this was debated and pointed out where the problems were for the hundredth time and even before the referendum.
The only possible solution to not crashing out is staying in the CU/SM. Can you sense my frustration?
If people think crashing out will be a short-term minor problem, there's a big surprise coming at the end of March 2019.
I should fecking hope so simce 0-15 year olds number more than that in the UK population
Anyone who thinks their government are acting in their best interests even when its not in the said government actors personal interests are fecking morons and deserve what’s coming to them.
Tell me more
Irrespective of whether or not he's adopting a condescending tone or not, it's remarkable and eye-opening how often Brexiteers resort to talking about stuff like this to deflect away from actual discussion of Brexit itself.
Our two options are to essentially crash out of the CU and SM, which is an impossibility considering the NI issue, or remain in the CU and SM, which allows us to mostly retain our current status but without the benefits of the EU. Neither option is particularly beneficial yet people continue to advocate them all the same. I'm all for remaining polite but I can see why some people despair when this is continually ignored in favour of people being called out for incompatible political stances that don't work in reality.
I can sense your frustration Paul but the problem is you listen to people like Jacob Rees Mogg and lump everyone in the same boat as him. No wonder you are so angry.
For a starter, how does the UK function with no agreements in place for anything. Borders closed, nothing in place to cope with that. How many companies would have left by then. Sterling would collapse again.
Some bright spark will say - so will the EU - before they do - the UK effectively will have cut itself off not only from the EU but the rest of the world. The EU would be cut off from one country - the UK. But yep, the EU need the UK more than the UK needs the EU.
Haven't got the energy to complete a 100 page list of all the problems crashing out will cause.
Let’s have a bit of role play. Challenge yourself to name 5 benefits of leaving the EU via a Norway style EEA/EFTA agreement.
Listen mate yeah, we got our sovereignty back. If you don’t like it then you can feck off somewhere else where you don’t mind foreigners interfering with the shape of your bananas!
I don't listen to JRM or Farage or any of those anymore. I'm listening to normal people, as I've said nobody picks apart any arguments . The Uk is sleepwalking into catastrophe.
I'd be angry if my life was damaged by the Leavers, fortunately I'm well out of it. I'm just bewildered at why people cannot see what is so damned obvious, are they putting something in the water in the UK?
Yes you do Paul. You are always lumping the no deal Brexit loons with everybody else. It’s what makes you so angry. I think a lot of people feel differently to what you think they do and it would go a long way if you started thinking about what happens outside the m25 bubble of shite
Go on then - I can't think of any, probably why the UK struggled in the 1960's as a member of EFTA