How do you come to that conclusion? You HAVE to have a sliding scale otherwise you end up in situation where you hand out identical punishment for two disproportionate crimes. In normal life you have this, in football you need to have it to some extent as well.
Celtic Appoint Ronny Deila As New Manager
- Thread starter Zebs
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I'm not sure. I have no idea. But it seems to me that there is a high chance that one of these things might be true:
1) There is a badly translated section which caused the confusion which led to the player being improperly registered.
2) The CAS will rule that, as Legia intended to comply with the rules (the player did not play the relevant games) and did not know the rules were being broken, the punishment does not fit the crime. This is why it is different to that Swiss team ignoring UEFA's rules and playing illegible players for half a season. Legia tried to comply with the rules.
3) The player's participation did not affect the result in any way. He came on with a few minutes to go, with Celtic having little to no hope of entertaining a come back. The punishment therefore doesn't fit the crime.
4) The player was punished. The club not using him for the relevant matches was punishment, regardless of his name being down on the squad sheet.
Basically, I can't think of a situation where the punishment would stand. The only one of relative equality might be Milan failing to put a player in the "B squad" and instead putting him in their "A squad" for the Champions League last year. Because they did that, another player was denied the chance to join the A squad (who couldn't join the B squad), and participate in the Champions League.
West Ham with Tevez and Mascherano? Completely different. But remember this:
So, even with Tevez and Mascherano, even though West Ham clearly broke the rules.. they weren't simply handed 3-0 losses for every time the two players played. They weren't simply relegated next season. And again, that wasn't an Admin error. That was a very serious breach of the rules.
What about all those transfers that go past the deadline? How often has FIFA/UEFA allowed them because they "tried to submit the paperwork in time but the fax machine was broken".
The player WAS punished. Using the player didnt affect the result. It was a simple admin error. The club intended to comply. "Not knowing the rules is no excuse," but attempting to comply with them usually does get you some leeway.
Alright I should not have said that, my point is that the rules are the rules at the start. If the punishment is stated in the rulebook at the start of the competition for fielding an illegible player there is not much that can be done when that rule is breached other than hand down the set punishment. You cannot set that punishment aside because it was only a slight breach of the rule. If they set this aside this time for what is admittedly an innocuous breach then it would set a precedent for other clubs to challange the rule for what might be more serious breaches. Then who how do you decide where the line for serious and not so serious errors and the severity of the punishments dished out for them should be determined? Much better to have a very clear rule, any breach for whatever reason and this is the punishment so get your ducks in a row folks. This is professional sport involving millions not tiddly winks.
I don't think we earned our progress. I bring the away goal up all the time because that's what puts us through and Legia out. It wasn't the punishment from UEFA which put Legia out.
Ah, interesting. I was wrong. Sounds like its still ongoing though. This would have been the first time I'd have heard of CAS doing anything quickly
C'mon Maribor!
I find it funny how everybody in Europe will now presumably cheer against Celtic in every match they play simply for having the the audacity to do... well, nothing, really.
Ah, wait, now I get it. You all want us to pull out of Europe and "let football win", which, of course, would give Maribor a bye into the group stages. That would make an awful lot of sense and would of course be justice for Legia Warsaw, a team who cruelly suffered the same fate that every team before them has done. A team who were so wronged by the application of the rules that football's been tainted forever now.
Go Maribor! A team with a part of it's stadium shut because of racist fans, go you!
Ah, wait, now I get it. You all want us to pull out of Europe and "let football win", which, of course, would give Maribor a bye into the group stages. That would make an awful lot of sense and would of course be justice for Legia Warsaw, a team who cruelly suffered the same fate that every team before them has done. A team who were so wronged by the application of the rules that football's been tainted forever now.
Go Maribor! A team with a part of it's stadium shut because of racist fans, go you!
If Celtic had done that wouldn't they have been sued by the shareholders anyway? Corporate governance laws and all that.
I find it funny you expect the reaction to be anything else. You were thrashed, went through on a technicality and you expect support?!
You keep bring up racist fans as if that somehow makes Celtic sliming into the CL more palatable - they're completely different issues.
Aye Celtic were trashed but why are they even being blamed for an error by Legia? Legia stuffed it up and Celtic had nothing to do with it but flukely progress on away goals because of it.
I'm not sure Celtic fans can ever moral high ground over any other set of fans.
Eh? Moral high ground isn't a bloody verb. What does that even mean?
I don't expect support. I just don't understand the complete opposite and actively cheering against us now when in the past people would've looked at Maribor v Celtic and not bothered their arse. Shouldn't people's issue and anger be directed at UEFA and their rulebook rather than Celtic who did absolutely nothing wrong?
I bring up racist fans in this instance because I find it alarming that people would rather see a team in trouble for racism win than a team who benefited from UEFA's rulebook.
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Obviously meant take the moral high ground. Pink moon keeps mentioning racist fans from both legia and Maribor for some reason when it's obviously a minority in the same way a minority of Celtic fans behave similarly.
I'm not claiming the moral high ground.
I'm fed up with posts like that though. That's the kind of thing that every non Celtic or Rangers supporter north of the border brings up when discussing fans in Scotland. They act like everybody is well behaved and the Old Firm fans shame everyone. Funny though that it was a Hearts fan from Edinburgh who attacked a manager on the touchline. There's one set of fans who'll go to Ibrox and sing about the Ibrox Disaster. It isn't Celtic fans.
They might be a minority within Maribor and Legia, doesn't change the fact that it's absurd to be taking sides in a match you have no connection to and choosing to side with the club who come into the match with a racism charge hanging over their head rather than the club who come into it benefiting from UEFA's application of their rules.
Well then no set of fans can take the moral high ground over any other set of fans as we all have a minority of idiots. I thought you meant they couldn't take the moral high ground due to UEFA penalising Legia in which case I'd ask what moral high ground they were occupying as the issue is between UEFA and Legia and Celtic just benefited from it.
It's just odd to use a minority of a teams fan base as a reason against them.
It's isn't that absurd to support a team that you have no connections to in a case like this. Many, rightly or wrongly, feel Legia were harshly punished and think Celtic don't deserve to be there therefore want Maribor to Win.
On a side note, how do you think you'll get on tonight? Refuse to believe youse will be anywhere near as bad as against Legia but think Maribor won't be pushovers.
What connections are you talking about? I don't have one with Liverpool, should I stay neutral when they visit Bolton?
Legia broke the rules and were punished accordingly. It's unfortunate for them, they deserved to go through and all, but rules are rules. Celtic did nothing wrong.
As dirty as I feel agreeing with a Celtic fan, it does get on my tits the way some of the fans of the others clubs in Scotland pretend their supports are some sort of bastion of impeccable morality. Whereas we all have our share of prejudiced and distasteful cnuts, like any support in any country.
They're Manchester United's rivals. There's your connection.
Hard to tell. Depends which Celtic turn up really. Legia away was the worst Celtic performance I've ever seen. Dundee United at home was probably the best (at least football wise) I've seen us play in at least 4 or 5 years. It's Celtic away in Europe though, there's sure to be a few defensive calamities at some point. I'd be surprised if we won tonight though.
To me, they're a club I really do not like.
On a smaller scale (much smaller), it's the same thing tonight. There's always some connection.
Back to Mr Deila!!!!!!!
Something I have done since I can remember.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/aug/21/legia-warsaw-to-sack-official-champions-league-error
Heads rolling at Legia now, never nice to see someone lose their job for one mistake but it did have massive implications I suppose.
Heads rolling at Legia now, never nice to see someone lose their job for one mistake but it did have massive implications I suppose.
Wonder if they can find a way in despite this.
Christ this new Celtic manager is Moyes in disguise......The Celtic gig would actually be the perfect job for Moyes once they've sacked Delia....Celtic is Moyes level as a manager and he would do well there
Peter Lawell and co will be going through the team sheets and small details with a fine tooth comb just now
Ta ra Celtic.
Terrible performance from Celtic, and Maribor weren't much better. Players like Mulgrew, Stokes, Ambrose, Berget, etc play at a level that suits lower league football. Ambrose is a terrible defender; Mulgrew is cumbersome, slow of thought, one-footed, lacks stamina, but on top of all of those faults believes that he's a good footballer, while guys like Johansen, Stokes, Berget are limited footballers that shouldn't be involved in CL qualifiers.
Despite giving the ball away on a number of occasions and showing poor decision making at times I was impressed by the energy and workrate of Callum McGregor. His confidence and forward runs were the only positive for Celtic this evening. I think he'll thrive under Gordon Strachan and possibly develop into an important player for the Scottish national team (he's just been called up for the senior team). He needs to develop the technical side of his game, and in order to do that he might be better off seeking a move abroad, perhaps to Germany, Belgium or Holland.
Despite giving the ball away on a number of occasions and showing poor decision making at times I was impressed by the energy and workrate of Callum McGregor. His confidence and forward runs were the only positive for Celtic this evening. I think he'll thrive under Gordon Strachan and possibly develop into an important player for the Scottish national team (he's just been called up for the senior team). He needs to develop the technical side of his game, and in order to do that he might be better off seeking a move abroad, perhaps to Germany, Belgium or Holland.
Spot on.
The board should be sacked for this. Sell guys like Ki, Wanyama, Hooper and Forster and replace them with absolute nobodies because you're too tight to spend any of the money you're rolling in. Unacceptable way to run a football club.
Deila is out of his depth at a club this size. Tactically clueless tonight and not for the first time have I had to say that.
I can only imagine Mulgrew has dirt on someone high up at Celtic. Two managers (admittedly shit managers) have shoehorned him into the team and into midfield at that. The guy's a defender and it's painfully obvious when he plays. Like you say, thinks he's better than he is! He tries to play like he's some kind of Pirlo or Gerrard deep lying midfielder when in reality he's just awful. Ambrose is genuinely the worst defender I've ever seen at this club. Like Mulgrew he seems to be undroppable. It's soul destroying.
Ambrose, Mulgrew, Stokes, Johansen, Berget, Commons, Griffiths, Balde, Pukki, Boerrigter, Ronny Deila & Peter Lawwell. There's more I could add, believe me. I'd genuinely celebrate if they were never associated with Celtic again. Especially the last one. How he can survive this with his job intact astounds me.
Serves them right.You don't give up on a €10m you get for qualifying for group stages etc.
Out of reflex I went to post "Well I hope we get Maribor in the group stages"
Imagine when DM wins the CL next year
Can we arrange a series of matches against celtic throughout the season, on ECL nights?
It will boost the fans' morale to see us win a match every few weeks.
It will boost the fans' morale to see us win a match every few weeks.