GOAT
Cristiano Ronaldo - performances 2017/18
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
if Rooney was ever one of the most technically gifted around, he wouldn't have been done as a top player around 27
By far Euro 2000 was our best NT, at least from the ones I watched, can't speak for the 66 team.
Even young Rooney would fumble a bit with the ball, but his power and determination saw him through more often than not.
Never said he was not gifted. I said probably not the greatest as I see that as in Messi even for this generation who is hardly lacking any mental power himself.
And, yes I think his sheer willpower to become the best even over the likes of Messi is very unique. Especially, considering how long he has been doing/pushing it.
I always knew Ronaldo was on a different level. Always felt Rooney was overrated though. I didn't think he was technically near the very best players in the world. Ronaldos top level even at 18 was way higher. Rooney more consistently able to fit into team play and do his job effectively. Rooney ended up booting Ronaldo playing for Everton because he couldn't live with him.
Yup I remember this.
I know Rooney had a good Euros 2004, but so did Ronaldo. I think Ronaldo's performance might have been overlooked a bit because the key player for the Portugal team back then was still Figo and Rui Costa, so his performance flew under the radar a bit
Yup I remember this.
I know Rooney had a good Euros 2004, but so did Ronaldo. I think Ronaldo's performance might have been overlooked a bit because the key player for the Portugal team back then was still Figo and Rui Costa, so his performance flew under the radar a bit
I think the Rooney hype was primarily an English thing. "Ronaldo's performance might have been overlooked a bit" sounds pretty weird to me, in all honesty. At least in Germany, Ronaldo was more or less the shooting star of the Euros 2004. I was fourteen at the time and so many team mates of mine started copying his style (skills, hair, clothing etc), the media were all over the place about him and so on. Rooney on the other hand was recognized as a great talent but got nowhere near the attention Cristiano received. All this stuff of him being an era defining talent or the "white Pele" never really crossed British borders and I only heard about it almost a decade later when I started reading Redcafe. I remember I found it very strange that anyone used to be of the opinion Rooney was the better talent of the two.
Yes, I have a similar understanding too.
I've said it in another thread. The mainstream characterisation of Ronnie's early career in Utd was that he was inconsistent, which is fair. Somehow, some people would lazily characterise that period as Ronnie being nothing but a show phony, which is incredibly unfair. It should be remembered that Ronnie ended his first season with Utd as the star performer for Utd in a FA cup final (Sven gave M.O.M to Ruud, but everyone questioned the decision, including Ruud himself.)
As for the overlooked part, the EPL has a huge following in my country and many people actually supports England. Hence there was a bit of the same hyping of the English team in our media as well.
Don't compare him to Lebron.
Ronaldo rises up when the chips are against him, he's undoubtedly the GOAT.
So glad to be living in this era.
Ronaldo rises up when the chips are against him, he's undoubtedly the GOAT.
So glad to be living in this era.
Its this summer or never if he wants to come back to Utd, I know we've been here many times before but maybe just maybe this time it actually happens!
Yup I remember this.
I know Rooney had a good Euros 2004, but so did Ronaldo. I think Ronaldo's performance might have been overlooked a bit because the key player for the Portugal team back then was still Figo and Rui Costa, so his performance flew under the radar a bit
Absolutely his performance went under the radar in England. He was outstanding for a 19 year old in that tournament
That's interesting to hear. Despite being English, I never got the whole white pele stuff. Obviously Rooney was an excellent player throughout his career but talent wise, I always thought Scholes was way ahead of him, and he wasn't Pele level either.
As does LeBron.
3-6.
He'll be the best player in all of them and will instantly turn them into clear favourites.Those teams would probably win without him. You make it sound like he would win it for them.
They conceeded 3 goals yet are supremely organized? Their CBs add up to 69 years old...
Ippo Makunouchi of footballers.
Bull in a china shop springs to mind.
He was so explosive that he was unplayable as a kid.
It was after the metatarsals and the cards racking up that he calmed down and we lost the real Wayne Rooney.
He had flaws in his game and was inconsistent but playing wide in a 4-4-2 with Van Nistelrooy upfront was a big part of that. From 2004 to 2006 he was playing consistently better for Portugal than he was for United and in 2006-07 it wasn't a crazy jump in ability that led to him performing better but rather playing closer to goal and Van Nistelrooy going to Madrid. He actually played striker/second striker often for Sporting's youth teams, either that or wide in a 4-3-3. When Ferguson put him wide in a 4-4-2 it did not get the best out of him. It was a coin flip, he could turn a game on its head or he could be inconsequential.
Even so, there was never any doubt he'd become one of the best in the world and back in 2004 people were already expecting him to become clearly better than Figo. Maybe it was because United didn't go through a great period in those years but people here underrate how good he was between 2003 and 2006. When he was on a good day he was up there with anyone in the world.
I'm not even a fan of his, but you've got to consider circumstances. His only real failure was 2011. Aside of that, it's great enough that he has even reached the Finals that often. Ronaldo has failed more than enough himself.
He really hasn't. And Lebron plays in the East...the weakest conference and gets a cakewalk to the finals every year.
If you say his only failure is 2011, I can make excuses as to why he won those other 2 times. Ronaldo > LeBron in terms of mental strength and jaw dropping moments as an athlete.
Both 2015 and 2017 were failures as well as was 2014. Yeah Love and Irving got injured in 15 but he was playing against an inexperienced warriors team that were not as good as the current superteam. Not to mention he has a huge hand in picking his teams. Reaching the finals in the east ea a joke since last few years .
This is about mental strength in key situations. LeBron has proven that with massive performances in high pressure situations and a very good record in elimination games time and time again.
How many times has Real Madrid, with Ronaldo, failed in the CL alone, despite having a strong roster every year?
I'd say failure and success are both present for James and Ronaldo. The latter has, relatively speaking, had the stronger team for longer stretches. Overall, they've both performed well in high pressure moments, but also had their times of failure.
Is this a joke? It wasn't until Kyrie left that he'd even take the last shot. In the biggest games LeBron would always make the pass, Ronaldo was/is always there to take the penalty, and/or do whatever to make sure ALL the pressure is on him. He is the most "clutch" sportsman I have ever seen. He relishes pressure. These days in club football the Champions League final is the biggest game of the year - Ronaldo is 5-1 in those finals. LeBron after being the poster child for putting super teams together is 3-6 in his biggest games. Don't get me wrong, LeBron is one of the best basketball players I've ever seen but to compare him to Ronaldo when it comes to mental strength is laughable.
The difference between Ronaldo and James is that Ronaldo can be an absolute ghost in the semi finals and finals of CL and his team can still win the tournament.
If LeBron James merely has an “average” game his team gets blown out.
It’s not even a contest, Ronaldo is amazing, but LeBron can impact the game in so many more ways than Ronaldo can in his.
If LeBron James merely has an “average” game his team gets blown out.
It’s not even a contest, Ronaldo is amazing, but LeBron can impact the game in so many more ways than Ronaldo can in his.
This is nothing to do with ability although I'd put Ronaldo up against anybody. This has to do with mental fortitude. Ronaldo always puts himself in the middle of everything in the biggest games and more importantly at the "crisis" points in said events - penalties, free kicks, etc... LeBron is a fantastic player but until very recently has deferred at those big moments. Even now I think he only takes the last shot by default with this latest Cavs team because he is loathe to pass to his team mates.
Mental fortitude? My bad, then yes Ronaldo is obviously great with that. And this is coming from a Messi homer.
LeBron mostly makes the right basketball play, not some foolish hero play the average fan prefers to see but which is less effective. Nonetheless, he's hit plenty of big shots in pressure situations.
In most finals, Ronaldo has been on the superior team, which has not been the case for LeBron a lot of the time. Thus, comparing those records is foolish, especially while ignoring that Ronaldo has been on superior teams that lost to inferior or at the very least equal teams in pressure situations.
Of course they are. Ronaldo is the only player who plays regularly for a big European club. Next best are probably Bernardo Silva - a bench warmer at City - and Moutinho, a good midfielder playing for Monaco, a player that a big club never got seriously interested on.
After that you have players playing in Portugal clubs (which we all know sell their best players), China, Turkey etc.
Cavs second best player in 2015 was Matthew Dellavadova, for crying out load. How on Earth he was supposed to win that?
And in 2017, he had the bad luck of playing not only arguably the most impressive team in the history of playoffs, but also against a possessed Kevin Durant. Now you can blame him for not being better than KD in those finals considering that he is a better player, but KD has the best series in playoff ever in the finals. Not an excuse, more of a fact.
Anyway, I don't think that Ronaldo-James comparisons are out of top. Both are supreme athletes, one of the GOATs in their sport, and while supremely talented, there have been more talented players who haven't had as a good career as them, mostly because these two guys have been so hardworking.
Ronaldo has a stronger mentality though, pretty much Jordan-esque in that aspect, that he relishes the pressure and essentially lives for those moments, while James likes to make the 'best sporting decision' even if it means someone else gets the last shot. Can someone imagine Ronaldo leaving some penalty in the last minute to some other player?
Great to see that the discussion has gone away from comparisons with Messi and other footballing greats to NBA GOATs.
Wish we had him back to win another set of CL and EPL titles.
Wish we had him back to win another set of CL and EPL titles.
The basketball comparisons above don't really make sense. They're completely different sports and in football it's much easier to stop one specific player than in basketball.
If you're talking just about their mindsets Ronaldo is definitely more like Kobe or Jordan than LeBron though.
If you're talking just about their mindsets Ronaldo is definitely more like Kobe or Jordan than LeBron though.
This is probably not the place for this but I've seen this rubbish spouted on more than one occasion. Dellavedova was an undrafted 2nd year player. The Cavs had Tristan Thompson the 4th pick in the 2011 draft, Iman Schumpert the 17th pick in the 2011 draft, and then JR Smith and James Jones who were both drafted in the first two rounds. Dellavedova was not even close to being their 2nd best player. I will say he did have a good finals that year but that's it.
Since this is a Cristiano Ronaldo thread I will just mention that he is really, really good.
I was and yes.
Was really talking about their mental toughness. Both great players. Sometimes however, the "right" basketball play is not the "best" basketball play. That is why so many great players take the last shot even though they are double teamed. It's what great players generally do.
The Right play is always the best play because the right play includes passing it to the best possible option, which means a best look in relation to the respective shooter's abilities. The ability to spot such a pass and execute it well in a pressure situation is just as much a sign of mental strength.
All of that aside, he has hit plenty of very important shots and made very important plays in the playoffs:
WTF is going on here?
Any talk of basketball should be taken elsewhere. It's bad enough when the thread is hijacked by talk of Messi but this is something else.
Any talk of basketball should be taken elsewhere. It's bad enough when the thread is hijacked by talk of Messi but this is something else.
I am currently well aboard this ronaldo train
It's his WC to lose. People talking about who's going to be the next breakthrough star, they'll do well to match what this mad man is doing.