Good composure for such a young lad.
Danny Welbeck
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Welbeck definitely has a maturity to his game and awareness that Macheda is lacking at the moment, and his first touch is far more reliable.
Nice to see Welbeck have a good game again and be involved in the first team. He's became somewhat of a forgotten man with the youngsters and has been written off too soon by too many.
I've always liked the kid and been impressed with all the attributes he has to game and he is still very young.
Fergie's plan for Welbeck in my opinion is to try and turn him into an overall forward who can play either central or out wide in a 4-3-3. This is why he has played as often out wide as he has centrally and got games at the expense of someone like Tosic. Long term Fergie thinks he is worth the opportunities.
It's also the best chance we have of both Macheda and Welbeck making the breakthrough into the first team squad properly because there's only really enough space for one of the young strikers to make it.
I still think he will be loaned this year and that he needs regular football and a run of fitness to progress but it's good to see him involved in pre-season.
I've always liked the kid and been impressed with all the attributes he has to game and he is still very young.
Fergie's plan for Welbeck in my opinion is to try and turn him into an overall forward who can play either central or out wide in a 4-3-3. This is why he has played as often out wide as he has centrally and got games at the expense of someone like Tosic. Long term Fergie thinks he is worth the opportunities.
It's also the best chance we have of both Macheda and Welbeck making the breakthrough into the first team squad properly because there's only really enough space for one of the young strikers to make it.
I still think he will be loaned this year and that he needs regular football and a run of fitness to progress but it's good to see him involved in pre-season.
He is a big lad too now, looks more like a man than a skinny kid.
The obvious problem Macheda and Welbeck have is the competition from Rooney, Berbatov and Hernandez (if he's as good as we all hope)
These youngsters need time in the first team, and this season I'd suggest...will they get enough of it?
I do rate them both though. There's a video out there somewhere of when Welbeck played on the right vs Spuds in the FA cup and his touches and speed were sublime.
These youngsters need time in the first team, and this season I'd suggest...will they get enough of it?
I do rate them both though. There's a video out there somewhere of when Welbeck played on the right vs Spuds in the FA cup and his touches and speed were sublime.
My last reply in this thread may have been a little harsh on the poster, but this is why I think its so silly to be looking at a talented player like Welbeck and saying "you know what I don't think he will make it here".
I mean his 19 for god sake, how can anybody be making such a pessimistic prediction given the evidence? As everybody could see yesterday he is quick, he is technically gifted and he can lay on a superb pass he also showed good strength on occasions.
I hope people will begin to see why his been likened to faster version of Kanu as both are very skillful and good users of the ball, I also hope its understood that i'm not saying he will make it here. What i am saying is don't write off an clearly talented player at 19.
I mean his 19 for god sake, how can anybody be making such a pessimistic prediction given the evidence? As everybody could see yesterday he is quick, he is technically gifted and he can lay on a superb pass he also showed good strength on occasions.
I hope people will begin to see why his been likened to faster version of Kanu as both are very skillful and good users of the ball, I also hope its understood that i'm not saying he will make it here. What i am saying is don't write off an clearly talented player at 19.
If anything, I dont understand the hype for Macheda. Yes, he's got important goals, but you have to look at the overall package - Welbeck offers a lot more. Like i've said before, a handball, a deflection (off of him!) and a good strike/fluke whatever you want to call it, shouldnt justify the hype.
To be fair, if a poster thinks a certain player wont make it here, we shouldnt take it so personally. Thats what I dont understand, everybody is entitled to their opinion. Age should be taken into consideration, definitely, but if a poster still believes the player doesnt have enough potential, why criticise them? No need to take it so personally.
He has a good awareness of whats around him that Macheda lacks at the minute. Also his crossing and passing is improving a lot. He looked a little off in terms of sharpness last night and reacting, but i think that's just a bit of rust.
I think of the two of them its Macheda who would most benefit from a loan at this stage. At 18 he is a phenomenal talent but as a goals scorer its not enough to only be in the starting lineup on rare occasions.
He needs to develop the art of consistantly troubling a defence on a weekly basis and he can only do this by playing week in week out at this age. He's not going to do that here, and I still think he is a season off being good enough to start at another prem club reguarly on loan. I think a season on loan to a Championship club would do him a power of good.
He is a good talent and I could see him racking up 15+ goals at that level, he could then come back with the confidence of knowing that he has scored goals consistantly at a higher level than the reserves. I hope he doesn't have another season in the reserves as I can't see what he can possibly learn there.
He needs to develop the art of consistantly troubling a defence on a weekly basis and he can only do this by playing week in week out at this age. He's not going to do that here, and I still think he is a season off being good enough to start at another prem club reguarly on loan. I think a season on loan to a Championship club would do him a power of good.
He is a good talent and I could see him racking up 15+ goals at that level, he could then come back with the confidence of knowing that he has scored goals consistantly at a higher level than the reserves. I hope he doesn't have another season in the reserves as I can't see what he can possibly learn there.
As I said I was quite harsh and if I caused that poster any personal offense I would appologise, however I see too many people queing up to write off youngsters at this club way too early which is why I feel so strongly about it.
It also worth noting that none of the opinions from that poster about the abilities that he thinks the player lacks are correct. I've highlighted that in my previous post.
Honestly, I think both Welbeck and Macheda would benefit hugely from a loan move. Stick in a recall clause in case of injury, but even if we loan out Diouf we'd still have 4 first team strikers (Rooney, Berb, Chicharito & Owen).
Not all young players are suited to going on loan especially to a premiership clubs. Some talents are best nurtured in house.
Would anyone call it inaccurate to say that Welbeck has made more of an impact than any youth team striker since Sparky and Robins? We've had so many bright hopes who've done absolutely nothing in the first team, Campbell, Ebanks-Blake, Healy, Webber and all the rest only ever managed a handful of appearances and at best a goal. Rossi scored a few, but didn't play nearly as much as Danny has, before he decided to leave.
Both of the lads have taken, by the standards of our young strikers, enormous steps into the first team, so it's very hard not to be excited by their potential.
Both of the lads have taken, by the standards of our young strikers, enormous steps into the first team, so it's very hard not to be excited by their potential.
Don't worry, no offence taken. Been on this site far too long to take offence!.
I do think Welbeck have a lot of abilities, but I just don't think that the excels in any of them. This is why I don't think he will make it - nothing makes him special.
His ability at 19 makes him special.
Agreed. As a 19yo he is special.
But I don't think he is special enough to make it at United.
As I said before, he will be a good PL player, but I don't think he is special enough to make it at United. I just don't see what he excels in.
I hope to be proved wrong.
Playing football?
I thought Welbeck was very good last night. Our best player by some distance imo.
I've had, and still do have, my doubts about Welbeck. But last night I thought he showed a great maturity, great touch, compusure and technique.
I was very impressed. Especially considering the amount of players that struggled to make an impact.
Admittedly I have yet to see last nights match. Have it Sky+'ed for watching tonight.
Be interesting to see if he has improved, and maybe he will improve so much that I will change my mind.
But everything I have seen so far does not make me think it is possible.
Thought he looked very good last night, great runs to get into good positions to receive the ball for a shot on goal. Was unlucky with his finishing, but I just put that down to it being pre-season, if it was a few more games into the season he would have netted them.
As a wide forward Welbeck has a good chance of at least earning himself a good shot at establishing himself at this club as either a squad player or even breaking into the first team.
Glimpses from yesterday that even as a support striker, he's still a handy young player but my doubts about him have always been as an out and out forward which I can't see him becoming. Then again I didn't see Rooney as a number 9 in a 4-3-3 so anything is possible.
With regards to the loaning situation, I think if anyone has to go.. its either Macheda or Diouf or possibly both. I think Welbeck and Hernandez are two different type of backup strikers to each other.. whereas Hernandez, Diouf and Macheda are all poachers and it would be detrimental to keep them all and not play them.
Macheda would benefit most from a loan imo, he could go to any lower side and just imagine his link up play, his hold up play having to develop at a rate of knots in order for him to hack it at this level. He could come back a much mature, stronger player and learn how to be effective over 90 minutes rather than just be an impact player who gets fluky goals.
Glimpses from yesterday that even as a support striker, he's still a handy young player but my doubts about him have always been as an out and out forward which I can't see him becoming. Then again I didn't see Rooney as a number 9 in a 4-3-3 so anything is possible.
With regards to the loaning situation, I think if anyone has to go.. its either Macheda or Diouf or possibly both. I think Welbeck and Hernandez are two different type of backup strikers to each other.. whereas Hernandez, Diouf and Macheda are all poachers and it would be detrimental to keep them all and not play them.
Macheda would benefit most from a loan imo, he could go to any lower side and just imagine his link up play, his hold up play having to develop at a rate of knots in order for him to hack it at this level. He could come back a much mature, stronger player and learn how to be effective over 90 minutes rather than just be an impact player who gets fluky goals.
Personally I would send all three out on loan.
We play with Rooney up top on his own a lot, so why do we need more than 4 strikers?. All of them need to prove themselves, and I think that a loan will help them do that.
I'm 100% sure he'll become a solid PL striker at least. The big question is if he'll step up to become a world class striker... the potential is there...
Its far too risky to send all three, especially when Rooney always has a period out with injury, Owen is literally always fecked and Berbatov cannot be relied upon for goals.
That would leave only Welbeck? as a backup striker and in my opinion he's better off coming off the wings and linking up play rather than being relied upon as the lone man up front or a lead the line striker in a 4-4-2.
For me Hernandez has to stay, purely down to the fact it leads our striking options that bit of variety and more importantly penetration because one things for sure, we aren't going to suddenly become that much more amazing than last year based on our performances in the friendlies thus far and any source of goals we can find, we must endeavour to keep them as options for the first team. He's also the closest replacement we have to Owen i.e. a genuine goal threat.
Rooney
Berbatov
Owen
Welbeck
Hernandez
Personally I think that wouldn't be a bad 5 to try to attempt to win the league with.
I agree with that to a certain extent, but I also believe that it is fair — and indeed, essential — to expect people to be able to fully explain their reasons for a particular opinion. A "feeling", for example, deserves no more respect than if someone suggested that they had used tarot cards to decide on a players future, and an opinion based on insufficient evidence, such as sparse and intermittent first team opportunities, is also not something that should be applauded, either, in my opinion.
What is interesting is that most of the people who have followed Danny's career right through the U18's and reserves to the first team believe that there is more than enough evidence to suggest that he could well become a very good player, indeed. Admittedly, most of the evidence for that opinion comes from his time in the U18's and reserves, and it is certainly true that Welbeck will be expected to steadily improve his performances for the first team, but it is in the U18's and reserves where we have seen him in the most natural environment, playing regularly in a settled team.
Obviously, the difference in level (between the reserves and the first team) will always leave question marks about a players ability to bridge that gap, but that's only really true for certain aspects of a players game, such as their ability to translate performances at a lower level on the biggest stage. But that's not really been the most common criticism, as far as I am aware. Most of the criticism has concentrated on his abilities, and that is an area where the U18's and reserves can and should be instructive.
So, the people who weren't regular viewers of the levels below the first team should, at the very least, be very cautious about making such bold pronouncements about players who are still not yet 20 years of age, in my opinion. As I've mentioned numerous times before, most of the players that went on to become first team regulars in the recent past either weren't even afforded (semi-regular) first team opportunities until they were between the ages of 20-22, as was the case with the Beckham, Scholes, and Neville generation, or they didn't really perform to anything like their relative potential until they were at least that age, as in the case of Fletcher, and to a lesser extent, Evans.
That's anywhere between one and three years in advance of Welbeck's current age, and I would suggest that it should be fairly instructive about what it is that we should expect from all players that come from the academy, particularly when they are not afforded regular starts in the first team.
I just get the feeling that the people who've watched Welbeck in the youth and reserve sides as well as his first team games are really excited by his progress, and those that have only seen the first team outings think he won't make it.
I think Danny has a cracking chance of being a top player for this club.
He has great versatility. He can play from either wing, last night showed he has ability in both feet when it came to crossing. He also has a decent shot when cutting in.
He looks to be able to play off a top man, I think he can be used ala Owen and play off the last defender as his pace is blistering. I even think as he matures he will get more powerfull, so he could well be used as a target man as his hold up play is good and he is decent in the air.
I think Danny has more to his game than Macheda, I'd sooner not let him go on loan as I think he can fill in for various roles and does offer something different.
He has great versatility. He can play from either wing, last night showed he has ability in both feet when it came to crossing. He also has a decent shot when cutting in.
He looks to be able to play off a top man, I think he can be used ala Owen and play off the last defender as his pace is blistering. I even think as he matures he will get more powerfull, so he could well be used as a target man as his hold up play is good and he is decent in the air.
I think Danny has more to his game than Macheda, I'd sooner not let him go on loan as I think he can fill in for various roles and does offer something different.
welbeck is well ahead of macheda
Great post there mate.
This will help. He has become stronger in the last six months, his head is up and his touch is back to its best (although some may still try to deny it, he had a couple of passes fired at him or behind him like myopic sniper rounds). He was a bit rusty last night but definitely man of the match for me (and Viv Anderson..) against what proved to be a very competent and fit team, barring the odd defensive lapse. I think he should be loaned to Sunderland, but with a recall clause, until January. I've always thought he'd make it as a first team striker here and still do.
I think Welbeck was out best player. I think he had four attempts on goal and his pass for obertan was quality. He IS a better player then Kiko. He HAS impressed in games, some people just don't want to see it. He was exceptional in one game but got injured and had to go off after half time. However aside from that he's scored goals and yet you get people saying...he should go on loan?
It's nonsense. If you got by one game Welbeck was very good and Kiko wasn't though he is a year older. In all their games, Welbeck has probably shown more in the first team though kikos goal against villa is hard to top as a moment of brilliance
Welbeck is underrated, underappriciated but when he's sharp, when he's got alittle fire in his belly he is a united player. He should have scored last night. The one that was saved, I thought he could have smashed it alittle quicker but again players are looking for sharpness
His general play was good, he showed a good turn of pace, he was always in and around play, he made himself available, he was a threat, he was good on the ball, his technique was very good, he is a very good young player who we should keep at the club and give chances too.
It's nonsense. If you got by one game Welbeck was very good and Kiko wasn't though he is a year older. In all their games, Welbeck has probably shown more in the first team though kikos goal against villa is hard to top as a moment of brilliance
Welbeck is underrated, underappriciated but when he's sharp, when he's got alittle fire in his belly he is a united player. He should have scored last night. The one that was saved, I thought he could have smashed it alittle quicker but again players are looking for sharpness
His general play was good, he showed a good turn of pace, he was always in and around play, he made himself available, he was a threat, he was good on the ball, his technique was very good, he is a very good young player who we should keep at the club and give chances too.
I think that with the acquisition of Hernandez that Welbeck might not get enough, or indeed any, game time before January. That is why I think that a short term loan to Brucie might work well for him. He'll get games and score goals and come back for "the big push" when we will really need him.
I think it's more to do with how much and how quickly he's improved following first team exposure. He's showed the right mentality to make it at this club, he got his chance and he took it. His link up play, his touch and his dribbling even all came on significantly following that first goal, you could see him genuinely improving game by game for the first team.
Everyone knows he's not as naturally gifted as Welbeck but you don't have to be that gifted to be a player for us, you just need to know how to play your role and have the confidence to show it. He's doing that.
I think that's a very good point, I'd thought Sir Alex has been on the lookout for a multi-functional player like that - which is why we were linked with Jovetic, Balotelli etc. Someone who could play up front in a 4-4-2 but happily revert to a wide position in a 4-3-3, maybe he sees Welbeck as that player.
I think it'd be such an asset to have a player who's comfortable in both positions, we've always valued tactical flexibility and versatility of style.
i remember watching quite a few games with welbeck on the wings.
There was one game i have a vague memory on, where he was outstanding on the right.
There was one game i have a vague memory on, where he was outstanding on the right.
Spurs in FA Cup, 08/09 we won 2-1
Small clip, there's a better one of his overall contribution somewhere
Also had a good game against Hull there the last day of the season when Gibson scored a cracker.