England Discussion | Finish 4th

I understand England speculating and avoiding Brazil. Besides -I do not know if certain or not - the explanation of the physical state can also be valid. I have noticed Germany or Spain were very tired, and France with a certain apathy.
However losing to Belgium is deliberately leaving a good dynamic and showing that there is already a team that can beat you.
About the match, I think England is better. If they impose a high rhythm of play, with that attack so intense, I think they can quickly overwhelm Colombia
 
ivaldo said:
Because we are the better team! Why should Bournemouth beat Norwich, why should Everton beat West Brom? Are you telling me Columbia are favourites? Because even the other posters who are disputing this with me concede we are "narrow favourites".

You mean the team that were minutes from being knocked out to a group containing Japan, after being entirely outplayed by Senegal, a team considered inferior to the Tunisia team this very England side beat? It's funny how performances in this world cup only matter when you're trying to prove your point.

Why? We have a very reasonable chance of going further than the last 16. Why shouldn't we hope for it? How often have you seen England fans proclaim we will smash Columbia, or that we shouldn't take them seriously?
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Tunisia better than Senegal? What? :wenger: Colombia weren't vastly outplayed by Senegal either and the only reason they got in trouble in that group was James having injury problems and the red card in the Japan game.
 
RedSky said:
When Colombia qualified in 2014 for the World Cup it was the first time in 16 years. They've only qualified for the World Cup 6 times afaik. So they aren't exactly a big name nation full of history and experience. The furthest they've got is the quarters twice. They're far more like Everton than they are like Arsenal. I don't think England have ever lost against Colombia?

Don't get me wrong, we aren't going to destroy them. But i'd be surprised if bookies consider them the favourites.
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Of course we'll be faves but I'm not judging this Colombia team on their history but on their relative ability in comparison with ours. Maybe I'm being harsh on us but imho a back 3 with a RB playing CB, Stones and McGuire doesn't fill me with confidence. I also think we're weak in actual midfield with Henderson in there alone for the best part while his 2 partners (Alli and Lingard) are practically no.10's.

This is the most entertaining England side in years and the draw has been great I don't mean to come across negative but I'd say this game could well be a kind of 55-45 kind of thing. I think both teams will score and it's who can score the most.
 
Seriously England have played well for about 30 minutes. It's all a bit ridiculous.

Even in England's group, Belgium have won all three games comfortably, scored more, conceded less, created FAR more chances.

England have won one game comfortably, slogged out another with an injury time winner, and lost a game. They've also passed the ball sideways between their centre backs for a majority of these games instead of creating chances. They've scored 2 goals from open play, and one was a ridiculous deflection.
 
padr81 said:
Of course we'll be faves but I'm not judging this Colombia team on their history but on their relative ability in comparison with ours. Maybe I'm being harsh on us but imho a back 3 with a RB playing CB, Stones and McGuire doesn't fill me with confidence. I also think we're weak in actual midfield with Henderson in there alone for the best part while his 2 partners (Alli and Lingard) are practically no.10's.

This is the most entertaining England side in years and the draw has been great I don't mean to come across negative but I'd say this game could well be a kind of 55-45 kind of thing. I think both teams will score and it's who can score the most.
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I'm fairly certain England will lose unless they put an extra man in midfield, in which case I think they will have a decent chance.

The problem is even when they were on top against Tunisia the formation left them too open and cost them the lead. It was seconds away from costing them the game. All three centre backs take too long and take silly risks on the ball, and are poor positionally...and with no midfield in front of them it's just plain obvious what's going to happen against any team able to press them effectively.

Columbia don't have to be the better team to win because if they can press effectively England will beat themselves in moments. You can't play a broken system and beat good teams.

Beating Panama 6-1 doesn't count for anything when you aren't playing Panama. He needs to keep Loftus Cheek in there and drop him back alongside Henderson imo. Or play delph/dier. I don't think Southgate really understands though. In the Tunisia game he was just swapping players instead of changing the system. Tonight he had Rashford in defence for the last 15 minutes because he didn't want to change his system. You can maybe get away with this if you simply have far better players than everyone else. If not you have to adjust to the opponent.
 
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Prometheus said:
England might get humbled with all this cockiness!
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England haven't played a significant match of worth. Their relatively easy group phase was done before Belgium.

However they choose to play Colombia over Japan and everyone knows why.
It was the right decision in my opinion as England have a great chance to make the semi final.

If Colombia give England a beating then it would still be the right decision.
 
MadMike said:
What did everyone make of Danny Rose tonight? Everyone is talking about RLC, Rashford, Dier or Jones or whatever but Rose has flown a bit under the radar.

Better than Young for LWB or worse? I must say I felt he fecked up against Januzaj for the goal, it was obvious he wanted to shift it on his good left foot.
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Wasn't a great game from him. He had a hard time with januzaj most of the match and didn't offer much going forward.
 
I don't get how people are totally negative about this England side. There have been clear signs of improvement since Southgate came in and we're having an exciting world cup, whilst not having any real tests yet.

Get behind the team and be positive, you'd think some of you assess football with zero emotion the way you go on.
 
People are seriously overestimating Colombia. England aside, and it pains me to say, but this Colombian side are full of holes and frankly if England cannot beat them they definitely do not deserve to be in any semi final conversation.

England should win. Their starting 11 is superior.
 
RedSky said:
We have a great chance to reach the final tbh.

Croatia vs Spain is the likely quarter final and that will be a very tough game which will hopefully leave the winner somewhat fatigued ready for the semi final clash. We have to beat Colombia followed by one of Switzerland/Sweden. These are teams that we should really be beating without any hardship (yes we are England and we have the ability to feck up a simple task). But we should really comfortably reach the Semis and have a fairly decent chance at reaching the final and at that point its a coin flip.
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England haven't won a knockout game since 2006 for a reason.

Losing last time against Iceland. England aren't comfortably anything.

The Colombia game is a coin toss at this point.
 
Fridge chutney said:
People are seriously overestimating Colombia. England aside, and it pains me to say, but this Colombian side are full of holes and frankly if England cannot beat them they definitely do not deserve to be in any semi final conversation.

England should win. Their starting 11 is superior.
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This Colombia side aren't great.

But neither is England to be honest. That's the point a lot of people are seemingly ignoring.

I really don't know why this sudden overconfidence has come from.
 
K2K said:
This Colombia side aren't great.

But neither is England to be honest. That's the point a lot of people are seemingly ignoring.

I really don't know why this sudden overconfidence has come from.
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England is stronger than Colombia. It doesn't take much confidence to make such a claim.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Players, form, starting 11. I watched every Colombian qualifier and I know the team well. I also watch the Colombian league and attend games annually.
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I thought Colombia played well against Japan first half and also against Poland. Missed the majority of the Senegal game though.
 
haram said:
I thought Colombia played well against Japan first half and also against Poland. Missed the majority of the Senegal game though.
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They played well against Poland, but Poland were rubbish this tournament. I didn't think they played well enough vs. Japan. Losing against the Japanese sort of highlighted one of Colombia's typical and recurring weaknesses: their mentality (much like England, frustratingly). Colombia can crumble under pressure or simply perform well below their standard for no apparent reason. They did well to beat Senegal (barely) but they will be much more heavily tested vs. England's front 4. Should be an interesting and open match. As another poster said, if England start well Colombia may be overwhelmed early. They'll need to contain and push into England's half, where England are less comfortable on the ball. They can't allow England too much of the ball in the final third.
 
Fridge chutney said:
I didn't think they played well enough vs. Japan. Losing against the Japanese sort of highlighted one of Colombia's typical and recurring weaknesses: their mentality (much like England, frustratingly). Colombia can crumble under pressure or simply perform well below their standard for no apparent reason.
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They played with 10 men for 87 minutes. It was a single guy who lost them the game. That's just such a massive disadvantage.
 
Schneckerl said:
They played with 10 men for 87 minutes. It was a single guy who lost them the game. That's just such a massive disadvantage.
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I agree, but never underestimate la seleccion's ability to shoot itself in the foot, regardless of how it happens.
 
Fridge chutney said:
I didn't think they played well enough vs. Japan. Losing against the Japanese sort of highlighted one of Colombia's typical and recurring weaknesses: their mentality (much like England, frustratingly).
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It appears it slipped your mind that they were playing with 10 here?
 
RW2 said:
England haven't played a significant match of worth. Their relatively easy group phase was done before Belgium.

However they choose to play Colombia over Japan and everyone knows why.
It was the right decision in my opinion as England have a great chance to make the semi final.

If Colombia give England a beating then it would still be the right decision.
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Indeed. They had one good game against probably the worst the team in the world cup and now everyone is talking of semifinals when some of the players in the squad are too young to perhaps even have a memory of England winning a knockout match in the world cup!
 
ShadesOfTomato said:
Rather be miserable than some absolute plum who sits in their living room screaming 'send her victorious' in their 'it's coming home' socks.
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So instead you sit in your living room screaming 'you'll never walk alone' in your full Stevie G kit, shinpads included.
 
Peyroteo said:
Tunisia better than Senegal? What? :wenger: Colombia weren't vastly outplayed by Senegal either and the only reason they got in trouble in that group was James having injury problems and the red card in the Japan game.
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Per rankings they are. Senegal has been Tunisia once in the last 11 games.

I take it you didn't watch the Senegal game. Columbia were outplayed. Senegal were far the more dangerous team in the first half and for the last 20 minutes were camped in Columbia's box. They didn't register a single touch in Senegal's box in the first half, and only 4 in the second. If this side was as good you're trying to claim they were, they wouldn't be completely listless after losing one player in Rodriguez, nor would they have been 15 minutes was going out from going out. Complete revisionism here.
 
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RW2 said:
England haven't played a significant match of worth. Their relatively easy group phase was done before Belgium.

However they choose to play Colombia over Japan and everyone knows why.
It was the right decision in my opinion as England have a great chance to make the semi final.

If Colombia give England a beating then it would still be the right decision.
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They didn't choose to play Columbia they were beaten by a better team in Belgium
 
This Colombian side is really devoid of any creativity without James.

They have a side of a lot of workmen type players, their playmaker is Quintero who has had a very shaky career and Falcao is terrible far away from the goal. I think England have to press them high for that reason, also make Mina and Sanchez have to defend 1v1 on through balls.

Honestly England should win but I can also see a very bad draw or 1-0. This bracket is a historical chance for England to be back at a relevant stage in a world cup.
 
England definitely played NOT to win. They played the ball with no urgency and went for standard set pieces with a B team.
Expect them to play their best 11 against COL and show some tricky set pieces.

Will that be enough though?
 
RW2 said:
England haven't played a significant match of worth. Their relatively easy group phase was done before Belgium.

However they choose to play Colombia over Japan and everyone knows why.
It was the right decision in my opinion as England have a great chance to make the semi final.

If Colombia give England a beating then it would still be the right decision.
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No they didn't :lol:
 
Resounding victories over the mighty Tunisia and Panama, and the nation believes. It's time, 30 years of hurting, which has now turned into 50+ years. The country believes, the momentum is with these brave young lions. It's the best football that has been produced since, Euro 96. England are finally going to do it and win the World Cup a second time. Then the alarm clock rings, and I wake up, look at the result and realize that normal service has resumed and England are still s*ite.
 
lsd said:
They didn't choose to play Columbia they were beaten by a better team in Belgium
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Its Colombia. England won't have it easy against them. Its cowardly for any team to play not to win no matter the circumstances. Germany did it in 82 against Austria and justice was done when Italy outclassed them in the final. No world champion has played these shenanigans and even though England are probably just aiming for a semifinal its still cowardly.
 
I'd be hilarious if England get knocked out by Columbia!
 
Fridge chutney said:
Players, form, starting 11. I watched every Colombian qualifier and I know the team well. I also watch the Colombian league and attend games annually.
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And I've watched England at major tournaments for years.


There's a reason they haven't won a knockout game in 12 years. They would be well warned to take this Colombian threat seriously.
 
noodlehair said:
Seriously England have played well for about 30 minutes. It's all a bit ridiculous.

Even in England's group, Belgium have won all three games comfortably, scored more, conceded less, created FAR more chances.

England have won one game comfortably, slogged out another with an injury time winner, and lost a game. They've also passed the ball sideways between their centre backs for a majority of these games instead of creating chances. They've scored 2 goals from open play, and one was a ridiculous deflection.
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If you watched the game against Panama Belgium looked pretty shit.
 
Schneckerl said:
FIFA Rankings are really terrible though. Senegal are ahead in elo which seems more accurate.
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I don't think there's a lot between the two sides really.
 
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SpyLuke10 said:
If you watched the game against Panama Belgium looked pretty shit.
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How so? They were wasteful before they took the lead and Hazard was greedy as hell but the result was never in doubt and they had Panama on the ropes throughout.
 
Loublaze said:
How so? They were wasteful before they took the lead and Hazard was greedy as hell but the result was never in doubt and they had Panama on the ropes throughout.
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They were terrible in the first half.
 
P-Nut0712 said:
I don't get how people are totally negative about this England side. There have been clear signs of improvement since Southgate came in and we're having an exciting world cup, whilst not having any real tests yet.

Get behind the team and be positive, you'd think some of you assess football with zero emotion the way you go on.
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70% of the posters in this thread are not England fans, rather the opposite. They come out of the woodwork at any opportunity to slate England.
 
I think England will lose, but hoping they'll advance.
 
A lot depends on James fitness for me, England should really put them away in case he would be missing the game.

However, England will need to be strong mentally with added pressure of them plotting things. It’s undoubtedly easier route but only if team is can handle the mental aspect, which I’m not sure of when it comes to England.
 
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