Why?
England player and another Premier League star set to come out as gay
- Thread starter SilentWitness
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
It's pretty pathetic if grown men feel they have to hide because of some douchebags on the internetz.
I really didn't mean it like that, I was just stating a fact. He txt me about it because this issue means something to him.
Why do gay people need to announce their sexuality at all? Just get on with it, no need for a 'statement '. Not saying it must be a secret, but I see nothing wrong with his teammates and friends knowing, as it is nobody else's business. Each to their own and all that, but I do get tired of the whole victim thing or the 'everyone needs to accept my sexuality ' thing. Nobody cares, live your life.
Being gay or straight must stay in the bedroom because nobody cares actually.
Yeah, it's always boring when a class of people who've been oppressed, persecuted and ridiculed for centuries actually dare to speak up for themselves.
It would but only because people take it the wrong way. Someone like that is an eccentric, gay or not. Anyway, I doubt this player is anything like that or he wouldn't have waited this long, assuming it's not someone like Kane or Vardy who just became a star this couple of years.
People clearly do which is why in many countries gay marriage is still an issue, and being gay itself is an issue. It's not a 'everyone needs to accept my sexuality' thing at all, that's ridiculous. It's a 'I should be able to live as a gay man/woman without being abused or persecuted because of it', thing.
Absolutely. The amount of (what I presume are) straight males here with the "who even gives a shit?" attitude is quite bizarre, and it's practically denying that homophobia exists, when it definitely does.
It's not really about you ('you' meaning the general populous of mostly straight males, not YOU specifically) or what you consider should or shouldn't be news. Gay people give a shit. A lot of gay men and women feel crippled by the possible repercussions of coming out, having to live a secret life, having to hide it from everyone, with the fear of what effect it will have on their career, their relationships, their whole lives. It's a fear that a straight man can't really comprehend, but plenty shrug it off as if they do. Currently, footballers who have come out have done it when retiring, or have retired very shortly afterwards, which is very telling that this situation is a big deal, even if a straight male thinks otherwise. When someone does come out, plenty may just think "ok then...". That's fine, it's not really meant to have an effect on the person they are telling. It's for the empowerment and the freedom of the person who is gay, who has most probably felt oppressed and suffocated by it being a secret.
The media have done a pretty horrible job of covering this. They're parading it like it is some big reveal, like some kind of controversial movie spoiler, but regardless, it is a big deal. A professional footballer coming out, in a profession where they are in the public eye of primal football fans, a culture which definitely is not renowned for it's tolerance and open-mindedness, is an enormous deal and I hope it has an enormously positive effect on the sport and culture surrounding it.
Horrendous attitude.
Sadly the 'internetz' is not actually a separate universe. It is merely a form where thoughts are more easily shared and as such is indicative of many things.
As you know.
People clearly do which is why in many countries gay marriage is still an issue, and being gay itself is an issue. It's not a 'everyone needs to accept my sexuality' thing at all, that's ridiculous. It's a 'I should be able to live as a gay man/woman without being abused or persecuted because of it', thing.
This is not Saudi Arabia. Homosexuals can do as they please here, it is represented openly in all media, it is in every storyline in every soap, men kiss on the streets, in the clubs, I could go on. Men wear dresses on the fecking streets in the UK and a man still feels the need to get on a podium and announce he is gay.
I think the people who say "who cares?" and "I don't give a shit" are saying so in a positive way. They're saying: "it's 2015, why should this be big news? It's a totally natural and unremarkable phenomena". Both sides are right though and both are on the same side. On the one hand this shouldn't be big news, on the other hand it is big news and it's going to effect some people so let's hope it is handled positively.
The sad fact is that if this player comes out, the media will use him. They'll paint him up as a national hero while simultaneously digging as deep as they can for any dirt which will be used for sensationalist headlines in the future. It's what they do.
Hmm...
A part of me is really happy about this because it's such a positive step forward. But another part of me is worried that the reaction from some quarters will destroy my faith in humanity.
A part of me is really happy about this because it's such a positive step forward. But another part of me is worried that the reaction from some quarters will destroy my faith in humanity.
I'm guessing you're hinting at the age old 'being gay = being black' school of thought. As a black man myself, I won't even go there with you, I've done that too many times.
Because couples have lives outside the bedroom too?
Do you really think they have some twisted desire for abuse from homophodes that they're preparing a presentation ceremony to scream it out loud they're gay? The media is the medium that's creating the anticipation. All the gays I know are normal people, and they just want their sexuality to be accepted as normal. This victim concept you speak of comes from having to hide for so long that coming out becomes a big deal for them. Because believe it or not, there are many people in the world who don't think gays should just get on with it. Instead of asking "why do gay people need to announce their sexuality at all?", ever considered why do gay people need to hide their sexuality at all?
You have. I remember the sheep.
But for feck's sake, nobody who's a footballer announced it officially to the world thus nobody knows that there actually are homosexuals between footballers too, until now everybody believes that it's some kind of a phenomenon that is steering clear of football which is played just by testosteron dripping alpha males who feck A1 bitches on daily basis. Somebody famous being open about his homosexuality is like finding water on Mars.
@Natener it's a expression. In 2015 UK nobody cares if you're gay or not. For me it's a media thing, people are actually far more interested in football than X being gay.
Rozay said:
Tbh, I was referencing all persecuted peoples but I see why you thought that.
Rozay said:
There could be any number of reasons why some feel the need to speak up.
Just curious, did you get that tag line since the start of this thread?
But come on Dante, in regards to this issue you must mean your faith in European/western/Thai and a few other outlier nations where homosexuality doesnt bring about imprisonment "humanity". They get thrown off buildings in "some quarters".
Well, I'm not from UK but where I'm from EPL=Football and homosexuality is frowned upon. For me, I feel for the few gay friends I have and news like this which could sway social opinions even in the slightest is something tremendous. I'm starting to get the feel (from u and rozay) this is a non-issue in UK, so just consider my remarks as coming from a global perspective then.
Didn't we have a similar thread a few months ago saying someone was about to come out? What happened then?
They stayed in.
Exactly this. Of course these people are appalled that anyone is persecuted for their sexuality just as they are appalled that anyone is persecuted for their religion, race, nationality etc. I don't care what anyone is as long as they are a decent human being.
Perhaps the said gay footballers would like to be able to go to the shop, or the cinema, or the end of season awards, with their partner without raised eyebrows or intrusive media questioning who and what that person is.
Celebrities, particularly sportspeople working in male-dominated environments, live their lives in the public sphere as a result of their fame.
It's unlikely that these apparent players want anybody to accept anything, they probably just want to live their life as comfortably and as normally as possible, without rumour or suspicion. 'Coming out' will allow them to do that.
No point getting hopes high and thinking it is going to be Mata or Herrera or Shaw. It will be someone like Carlton Cole or Lee Cattermole in the end.
I'm joking, mate.
Do you actually live in the UK? All gay people are not actually living in secret, they are being openly gay everyday. I was served in fecking Westfield, the biggest shopping centre in Europe, the other day by a cross dresser.
It has not been a secret secret for many years, hence the announcements becoming nauseous. And still doesn't explain why I need to know. And for the record, I don't feel the need to know what women Phil Jones sleeps with either. I can understand them talking about it if it was Angelina Jolie, but other than that, so what? This is a big issue because everyone is choosing to make it one.
Premier League footballers do not live their lives in peace and without speculation because they are heterosexual either. Scrutiny comes with the job.
@Rozay You seem very angry for someone that doesn't care.
Yes but scrutiny about their sexuality obviously shouldn't.
This is a big issue because still in the UK when we talk about someone being gay people in threads like these list the footballers they think might be effeminate and say they think it could be them.
THAT is homophobia in action. There's a stigma and a stereotype with being gay, that still exists. Something like a PL footballer coming out would help change this and could be a MASSIVE boost to a young gay person struggling themselves.
Scrutiny because they're gay? It certainly doesn't come with the job.
These footballers don't want your acceptance, you can be sure of that.
I agree with that, but there are some posts in here which certainly don't suggest that.
Whilst it should be totally normal to the extent that not a single person bats an eyelid if a professional footballer is gay, we're still a long way from that being the case. Until we are at that stage, I think people definitely should care, until the barriers are broken down. Currently there are no openly gay footballers in the Premier League, so I personally find it a little odd that it isn't being widely supported with the hope that it has a positive rippling effect through football and football culture. It most probably isn't a big deal at all for the majority of straight males, but supporting it could hopefully lead to the eradication of a disgusting prejudice in the game.
Some here have suggested they think its pathetic that gay people can't just come out and get on with it as if it's no big deal, because it really is. It's the straight male telling a gay male how to feel about a sexuality they have no identification with which I find incredibly crass, and that extends far beyond just this thread.
As you say, I do hope it is handled positively. If it's a 'big name' player who is gay, it could be very positive. Especially for younger people who are currently struggling with the same issue. For instance, if it is a United player who is "revealed" as being gay (a horrible way of phrasing it, but it seems like how it's going to be dealt with by the media), it could act as a source of empowerment and liberation for a young homosexual teenager who supports United. Someone on the world stage who he/she looks up to and idolises. Perhaps he/she currently feels alienated by football and the audience it attracts, and this could potentially have a domino effect which completely changes that.
On the flipside, it could have negative repercussions as you have suggested. Football fans are occasionally associated with racist and sexist chants, chants which make fun of tragedy, so I don't imagine some football fans are going to have the conscience to draw the line at homophobia. But I hope we're both wrong on that.
Do you really not understand the positive effect a gay professional footballer could have on a gay teenager who loves football but hasn't worked up the strength to come out yet? Hell, it could even make him believe that he is going to be more welcome in football as it's not exactly overflowing with gay role models right now is it? You're just looking at it from your own straight male perspective
No, I don't. EPL's following is also not restricted to the UK only and happens to be the biggest sports interest in my country. I get it, there are people like you who don't care about it in the UK but I do not share your perspective and I commend this player for coming out if he does comes out. Because it does make a difference.
'Destroy my faith in humanity' is a widely used phrase. Perhaps English isn't your first language, but it's not something that you'd take it literally.
In any case, part of the faith that I do have is that people who are raised/educated in an open and modern society should be free from the most virulent forms of prejudice. I know deep down that isn't the case, and I'm dreading having it confirmed.
Probably James Vardy or some other hard man like Jon Walters or Distin.