And that includes a good number of Liverpool fans I've met, it has to be said
Evra accuses Suarez of racist remarks | Suarez guilty of racial abuse
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
And that includes a good number of Liverpool fans I've met, it has to be said
oh really so you honestly believe other players will now try to racially abuse a player with a track record of standing up to that and seeing the complaint through?
in other words in your eyes Evras standing up to racism has made him a more obvious target for racial abuse from other players?
What do you mean 'if'?
plus the position is not unalterable...it could all be diffused with a proper apology from the club and Suarez.They were quick to apologise to Adeyemi, what's stopping them from issuing one now?
The answer's simple; it's the complete arrogance of your manager and club officials,a reluctance to accept for a second that you're wrong
From what I’ve seen of the responses, including Suarez’s own statement:
1. He called him ‘negro’ once which in this country translates to black. He admits how it comes across from Spanish to English is not accepted and will avoid in all languages in future.
2. The club has handled this badly in regards to 1. not forcing Suarez to stay schtum (nothing to hide?), 2. yet again hiring cr*p lawyers, 3. T-shirt campaign was extremely ill advised. The support for Suarez after the case however is considered to be ok as the thought is he has been stitched up.
3. The anger is at Evra as he said he was called n166er, negro, black, 5, 7, 10 times. Story was changed often. Therefore the belief is he is being mischievous after mis-hearing Suarez. Evra is stitching up a fellow human and professional. Ferguson, well everyone hates Ferguson don’t they?
All the above are what I’ve been reading in various places, not necessarily my own opinions.
Well just to educate you incase you haven't read the report, which actually answers most of this:
1) He admitted using it once, but changed the context and time he said it multiple times and the context which he said he used it in was not consistent with the video evidence. The sentence he said he said it in his written statement was consistent with Evra's allegation as well as Comolli's (having told him that in Spanish) and Kuyt's (having told him that in Dutch) which was "because you are black". Only for him to change his mind and say he said been misunderstood and he had said "why, black?", to which the interpreter questioned whether that translation made sense in the context.
What Evra said he said was offensive in Uruguay and other parts of Latin America according to the language experts. "I don't speak to blacks" and I kicked you "because you are black" is clearly offensive.
2) Blah blah
3) Evra has always said that the word that Suarez used in Spanish was "negro". Fact. When he translated it into English he used the two words n*gger and black. He says that he tried to avoid using the word n*gger when complaining to the ref but later used it in the changing room explaining to SAF etc. He thought that negro meant n*gger because he speaks Italian and only conversational Spanish. In Italian nero is black and "negro" is n*gger. He then accepted that he was not being called n*gger by Suarez but "black" but still said that what Suarez said was still unacceptable, which was agreed by the independent language experts (I kicked you because you are black, I don't speak to blacks).
He said Suarez said "negro" five times in his written statement and evidence and also told SAF that as overhead by the referee's assistant. The 5 times referred to the goalmouth incident (Because you are black; I don't speak to blacks; Come on black, black, black). The panel concluded that Suarez used the word seven times because he had admitting saying it other times and they took that in addition to the Evra's five claims. I'm not sure when because Suarez changed his testimony from saying that he said it in the goalmouth to when the referee called him away from Evra. Evra has always claimed he only heard negro 5 times. The 10 times thing is a figure of speech in France, as Comolli said in the example of his daughter (but thought Evra should have been more concise). It's understandable however, because he told Canal+ off the record about the Suarez incident, only to be asked about it on the air when he requested they not ask him. So it's likely he said more than ten times because he wasn't willing to talk about it in detail.
What is now your opinion? Do you that Suarez is telling the truth despite him and his witnesses having been caught lying (see Kuyt saying he was certain Evra told the referee that Evra said he was only being booked because he was black yet the referee and Giggs both backing Evra's claims that he said that he was being called black) and changing their testimonies multiple times?
I have to question the seriousness with which someone desires to know the facts of the case when they cannot be bothered to GO & READ THE REPORT.
Surely them not admitting their in the wrong is just a natural self preservation act. It's human nature to want to protect yourself from a complete mental breakdown, which is what they'd experience if they could accept everything they've done wrong. Hence denial in the face of fact.
Which I could accept if we were dealing with one individual. But it's a whole coorporation,institution whatever.That isn't natural,and it's also planned and considered.
It's a tongue in cheek defence to be fair. Although ultimately it's what comes across to me when viewing their collective stance.
Dalglish Statement
from the scousers official site
"This is a worldwide football institution, this is a football club that has supporters of every creed, colour, nationality that you could think of," said Dalglish. "It's been fantastically successful, we've been fortunate that such a really sound, solid base was set up with Shanks in the sixties and seventies, carried on through many people - Bob Paisley, Joe Fagan, administrative staff upstairs, the Chairman John Smith, Peter Robinson, the support has grown and grown and within that support, there's a fantastic cross-section of people. We would never have that support if we were in any way, shape or form prejudiced or discriminatory against any one part of the community.
"Our football club is based on being a football club serving the community, and whoever is in the community we will treat as an equal. It never has been a club that's discriminated and never will be one that discriminates against anyone else. For us, the football club is more important than any one individual, whether that person be a supporter, a player or the owner. It's not about the individual, it's about the football club and we should be very proud of this football club.
"Over the past few weeks there has been a perception that the football club isn't doing what it should be doing, but I don't think the football club would ever go down that road. We will always support the official campaigns related to racism.
"Obviously there was a big issue with Luis. The players showed support for Luis which was fantastic, but then some people interpreted that wrongly as the players saying they're not interested in the fight against racism. That is totally and utterly rubbish. If we can help to eradicate racism or discrimination from any part of the society, with the help of anybody at Liverpool Football Club, then that help will be forthcoming.
"We don't want racism anywhere near football and certainly not anywhere near this football club.
"Then we move on and we had another incident with young Tom Adeyemi for Oldham. All we can say - it's a police matter - is if Tom, the police want any help in any way, shape or form then we'll give it to them. For me, the most important thing is that as a football club we all stick together. We all have a responsibility to act responsibly. The person who shouted whatever he shouted at Tom that upset him, if we can help the police find out who it is and he gets charged, then whatever we can do to make the punishment as severe as it could be will be done.
"For me, it's a couple of days past a year since I was asked to come back. It was an honour and a privilege for me to come back and I can guarantee to the supporters out there that there is no way I would have come back to this football club if I thought it was in any way, shape or form racist or discriminatory. I wouldn't be here.
"I was brought up in Glasgow, I'm very proud to be a Glaswegian. That's had its own undercurrent. In those days back there I was used to it, I was brought up to be respectful to the teachers, to be respectful to policemen, but also to be respectful to people, irrespective of their colour, their creed or their religion and I don't think it stood me in too bad a stead.
"For me, that's the way I'll continue my life. I was told also that if you tell the truth then you won't go too far wrong, so I will always maintain that stance and I think that's the stance that this football club has always maintained.
"If we can help in any way, shape or form with anything the FA put forward regards anti-racism, we'll be first up to the plate."
from the scousers official site
"This is a worldwide football institution, this is a football club that has supporters of every creed, colour, nationality that you could think of," said Dalglish. "It's been fantastically successful, we've been fortunate that such a really sound, solid base was set up with Shanks in the sixties and seventies, carried on through many people - Bob Paisley, Joe Fagan, administrative staff upstairs, the Chairman John Smith, Peter Robinson, the support has grown and grown and within that support, there's a fantastic cross-section of people. We would never have that support if we were in any way, shape or form prejudiced or discriminatory against any one part of the community.
"Our football club is based on being a football club serving the community, and whoever is in the community we will treat as an equal. It never has been a club that's discriminated and never will be one that discriminates against anyone else. For us, the football club is more important than any one individual, whether that person be a supporter, a player or the owner. It's not about the individual, it's about the football club and we should be very proud of this football club.
"Over the past few weeks there has been a perception that the football club isn't doing what it should be doing, but I don't think the football club would ever go down that road. We will always support the official campaigns related to racism.
"Obviously there was a big issue with Luis. The players showed support for Luis which was fantastic, but then some people interpreted that wrongly as the players saying they're not interested in the fight against racism. That is totally and utterly rubbish. If we can help to eradicate racism or discrimination from any part of the society, with the help of anybody at Liverpool Football Club, then that help will be forthcoming.
"We don't want racism anywhere near football and certainly not anywhere near this football club.
"Then we move on and we had another incident with young Tom Adeyemi for Oldham. All we can say - it's a police matter - is if Tom, the police want any help in any way, shape or form then we'll give it to them. For me, the most important thing is that as a football club we all stick together. We all have a responsibility to act responsibly. The person who shouted whatever he shouted at Tom that upset him, if we can help the police find out who it is and he gets charged, then whatever we can do to make the punishment as severe as it could be will be done.
"For me, it's a couple of days past a year since I was asked to come back. It was an honour and a privilege for me to come back and I can guarantee to the supporters out there that there is no way I would have come back to this football club if I thought it was in any way, shape or form racist or discriminatory. I wouldn't be here.
"I was brought up in Glasgow, I'm very proud to be a Glaswegian. That's had its own undercurrent. In those days back there I was used to it, I was brought up to be respectful to the teachers, to be respectful to policemen, but also to be respectful to people, irrespective of their colour, their creed or their religion and I don't think it stood me in too bad a stead.
"For me, that's the way I'll continue my life. I was told also that if you tell the truth then you won't go too far wrong, so I will always maintain that stance and I think that's the stance that this football club has always maintained.
"If we can help in any way, shape or form with anything the FA put forward regards anti-racism, we'll be first up to the plate."
"...we'll be first up to the plate".
Have the RedSox PR department been brought in to sort out the mess or something?
Have the RedSox PR department been brought in to sort out the mess or something?
Dalglish all your poxy club had to do, when all this started, was issue a statement from Suarez stating he was sorry and that he didn't mean in any way to offend Patrice Evra.
That would have killed the whole thing stone dead and it wouldn't have escalated to the heights it's at now.
Cnuts.
That would have killed the whole thing stone dead and it wouldn't have escalated to the heights it's at now.
Cnuts.
"If we can help in any way, shape or form with anything the FA put forward regards anti-racism, we'll be first up to the plate."
They could still sort of put this right a tad by bloody apologising to Evra, it really isn't too much to ask of Suarez and Liverpool.
They could still sort of put this right a tad by bloody apologising to Evra, it really isn't too much to ask of Suarez and Liverpool.
hypocritical much?
How many times can you fit 'football club' into one statement?
no mention of Patrice Evra or any sense of contrition over the offence their player caused. nothing. I simply cannot stand this idiot
Ahh Jesus, that's so poorly worded. It reads worse than the majority of posts here 
.
.There's no way Dalglish thought up that statement. Seems Liverpool have finally employed some PR guy going by their last two statements.
Just when I thought they couldn't get any more a twat than Benitez, up steps Dalglish.
Absolute asshole.
Absolute asshole.
The club wasn't racist when you came back, but because of the Player he bought and the attitude that he has taken over this past month it most certainly is a Racist club now.
Yeah, that's what they should have done in the first place. Those earlier statements were a disaster for Liverpool.
And a disaster in the fight against Racism in Football.
Time to put this to bed now. United and Liverpool are both great clubs and neither are racist institutions. Let's cut them some slack and move on.
their treatment of our player is nothing short of disgusting. how about an apology for a man that did nothing wrong and that they are still trying to harm the reputation of
That too... but also Liverpool since a lot of people are pissed at their position. They might even struggle to sign some players now, think about it, would anybody who has some kind of pride in their image want to be associated with a club that is seen to have that position in the fight against racism
Anyway, it's all been blown up, we should just move on.
Cut them some slack? Erm, no.
What about the Racist abuse this week on twitter of Saha and Colymore. You really think that the timing is coincidental. LFC and KKK have encouraged this with their scummy attitude. I won't let this drop and nor should anyone unless a statement is made with at least something of an apology to Evra.
Kenny, you're as subtle as an A-bomb.
I sincerely hope they struggle to sign players because of this, maybe that's what that statement was about. Trying to quell the collateral damage. As for moving on, I don't think so while they still take this ridiculous stance against our man.
He's a fecking cnut.
that line in particular is the reason this cant be dropped yet. their attack on Evra is still going on. and it should not be tolerated.
Even in a desperate statement like that, he couldn't resist being snide.
You got me there, they should apologize. It's actually unbelievable that they haven't done so already. Their problem is that the club is just as paranoid as their fans, they think everything is a conspiracy against them. They should man up (and grow up), apologize and move forward.
They still haven't properly apologised to Evra. Damage limitation on a massive scale this is. They also make no reference to the antics when they slagged off the enquiry and called it a biased witch hunt. And everything he is saying about punishing the nazi fan hard, he is going against his stance on Suarez
And until that happens there is no chance that it will be dropped from the public conciousness.
The longer it goes on the harder it will be for them to actually apologise and KKK will ruin his legacy (with all non LFC fans) and be forever known as a Racist Apologiser. Suarez is tainted now anyway and won't last very long in the prem with the abuse he'll be getting at every ground he plays at.
Liverpool can apologise on behalf of a fan for racially abusing an opposing player yet find it ever so difficult to do it to Evra.
All this furore is fuelling the fire though, what are you expecting to happen? I don't agree with the way they treated Evra, but it's done now and we should be big enough to put it behind us rather than trying to prolong the drama. The club isnt racist and suggesting it is is just childish, it was a horrible thing that happened and anyone with an ounce of intelligence (scousers included) knows it was but it's in the past now so let's leave it there.
The frequency with which these statements are appearing betrays their sense of guilt. It must be quite painful for their fans who are intelligent enough to see the subtext. It reminds me of Crime & Punishment and Raskolnikov's inability to keep quiet over his crime. What are we on now, Damage Limitation: Take 6? They're getting better, admittedly. First came the OTT rage and defiance, then came the 'some of Suarez's best friends are black' excuses. Neither of which worked, so now we see a broken down old man appealing as the club's figurehead to the public's better nature. Next comes out and out begging.
Anyway, when do we get King Kenny's thoughts on Downing? I hear Downing's mother is a woman, so there's somewhere to start.
Anyway, when do we get King Kenny's thoughts on Downing? I hear Downing's mother is a woman, so there's somewhere to start.
Liverpool were a great club. They aren't anymore, party because they cant create a League winning team, partly because of their boardroom shenanigans and now alot to do with their conduct these past 3 months.
Sorry mate, your intentions are admirable .... but I won't give Liverpool the benefit of doubt you have. I still have not forgotten the piss and shit thrown over our fans in 2006 when Alan smith had that appalling injury, only to be escorted off the pitch to Liverpool fans making the sounds an ambulance, or wrecking our toilets at Old Trafford in a sheer premeditated act of vandalism.
And then during this Suarez/Evra incident, their deliberate and deceitful attempts to sully the reputation of the innocent and offended party with lies, falsities and attempts to take the investigation into unrelated territories with red herring after red herring. And then the sheer insolence/arrogance/disrespect of the rulings of the governing body of English football, a body whom Liverpool FC have signed upto to and abide by their laws.
Manchester United has has its fair share of run ins with the FA over the years, be it Cantona showing off his kung fu skills, Ferdinand showing how dopey he is by missing his urine test, Us being pressured by the British government to miss the FA cup, even SAF truthfully answering questions made mandatory by the FA after a game only to get a ridiculous touchline ban. We may have whinged abit at the time, but we never once showed the childish, churlish, malicious and unwarranted response shown by Liverpool FC these past 3 months and especially the past ten days.
Liverpool FC's behaviour and responses to this incident, led entirely by klan leader Kop King Kenny has been disgraceful. And he has done so crudely and conceitedly purely as a populist play to the galleries to whip up a mass of aggressive hysteria. This will all come home to roost in 3 weeks time when our team arrives at Klanfield.
I personally cant wait .... We will win and comfortably and Evra will score ... and hopefully, Liverpool fans will not be able to resist their true colours and subject him to a brutal torrent of unpalatable abuse. Evra is strong enough a man to take such idiocy in his stride .... but let the world see that this club you call 'great' is not so 'great' anymore .... and belongs to the 20th century.
I hate them with a genuine passion and want them to be dumped into the annals of football history - they have no place whatsoever in the modern game.
Everybody clear now...
Definitely not racist!
Definitely not racist!
Small time bloke in charge of a small time club!!