rimaldo
All about the essence
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wheel to wheel is a rather grandiose term for “i’ll just not brake until way too late, forcing you to take evasive action.”
I dont mind who wins - I just hope its won on track by racing (not taking the other one out) and that the points from spa dont decide it as it was joke of a decision to run behind a safety car all gp just enough laps so they dont have to refund fansAbsolutely massive performance by Hamilton last weekend. This is exactly what we wanted towards the end of the Championship. This will be one decided by such small margins in the very last race.
As a Dutchy I obviously hope Max pulls it off, but either way this Championship brings back the excitement which has been gone for so long..
indeed - I think if the stewards had that at the time they would have given him a 5 second penltyThe steering wheel angle says it all, he was lucky to avoid a penalty.
Ugh, I'm geo blocked. There was another driver who missed the apex yet was turning the wheel a lot! So he wasn't trying?
Diplomacy never existed.does look like he could have tried a little harder to keep the car somewhere vaguely close to the apex
Id be surprised if merc don't use this to make a complaint... given that diplomacy has now ended apparently
https://www.planetf1.com/news/toto-wolff-mercedes-diplomacy-ended/
The FIA's handling of this has been as pathetic as the move itself. Max will never be a multiple WC if he has to race fair.The more I watch it, for me the intent is clear. And perhaps, that warrants a stronger penalty than a 5 second penalty.
Thinking back to Silverstone, what is really the difference here? The only reason they crashed at Silverstone but not here is because Hamilton continued to go wide instead of continuing to turn in like Max did at Silverstone. Also Hamilton was miles closer to the apex then Max was.
It’s as if Hamilton is being punished (by Max not being punished) because he avoided the collision (sensible).
It’s truly bizarre.
The FIA's handling of this has been as pathetic as the move itself. Max will never be a multiple WC if he has to race fair.
The steering wheel angle says it all, he was lucky to avoid a penalty.
hard to argue with that... unless your hornerPretty clear what he was up to.
He wanted to run to the very outside of the track and force Lewis to back off, but he outbraked himself and couldn't get the nose in.
Nothing wrong with trying that but get it wrong like he did and its 100% a penalty.
The onboard shows that at the braking point, Verstappen’s front wheels were overlapping with Hamilton’s rear wheels at the moment Verstappen starts to apply steering lock.
The positioning at corner entry is relevant because the penalties issued to Lando Norris and Sergio Perez at the Austrian Grand Prix established the interpretation that if a car is “side by side” – with the implication being this means front wheel to front wheel – then the driver on the inside must give room.
is that the case - I thought Merc could ask for it to be reviewed based on new evidence (I assume the new onboard counts as that given its not artificially created afterwards like the evidence red bull submitted and was dismissed?)Utter stinker by the stewards who are racing drivers? I just have a little bit of sim racing experience but you can see what Max is trying to do, so how these guys can't is stupidity.
Anyway nothing can be done now retrospectively. Masi has to go.
The stewards are the one that made the decisions, not Masi.Utter stinker by the stewards who are racing drivers? I just have a little bit of sim racing experience but you can see what Max is trying to do, so how these guys can't is stupidity.
Anyway nothing can be done now retrospectively. Masi has to go.
is that the case - I thought Merc could ask for it to be reviewed based on new evidence (I assume the new onboard counts as that given its not artificially created afterwards like the evidence red bull submitted and was dismissed?)
Not sure they will do anything about it but i believe there is at least a route for merc to raise a complaint
The stewards are the one that made the decisions, not Masi.
It is new evidence youre right. But Lewis got the overtake done in the end so nothing doing now in my opinion. It was a simple "give the place back" or 5 sec penalty decision for me. A penalty that affects the next race is overstepping the mark.
Which is why I lambasted the stewards, the overhead showed enough evidence with the braking telemetry they would have had to atleast investigate. Masi is running the show though and the job is too big for him looking from the outside.
Right, it's his fault that he couldn't magically produce the footage and also his fault that the he informed the teams of the stewards decision which he literally can't decide on.It is new evidence youre right. But Lewis got the overtake done in the end so nothing doing now in my opinion. It was a simple "give the place back" or 5 sec penalty decision for me. A penalty that affects the next race is overstepping the mark.
Which is why I lambasted the stewards, the overhead showed enough evidence with the braking telemetry they would have had to atleast investigate. Masi is running the show though and the job is too big for him looking from the outside.
This. It’s has the same effect without having to physically steer towards the overtaking car.That was pretty blatant by Max. Should be penalized really. Did not really make any effort to turn until he knew it was too late.
Not saying he did, just interesting to hear the to and fro (and the “matey” chat at some points)The stewards are the one that made the decisions, not Masi.
I am not sure, maybe if Mercedes appeal, who knows.
Is there anything in the rules factually about dealing with an incident already concluded upon in the race based on new evidence? Or is this relatively unknown territory?
Of course there's ways to prove thatThe devil's advocate position is to say that Hamilton wouldn't have made the corner regardless, and there's no way to prove that he would have in hindsight.
It's definitely a penalty though.
Except he made that corner on every other lap and got nowhere near that line.The devil's advocate position is to say that Hamilton wouldn't have made the corner regardless, and there's no way to prove that he would have in hindsight.
It's definitely a penalty though.
I dont think it needs to be provenOf course there's ways to prove that![]()
The onboard shows that at the braking point, Verstappen’s front wheels were overlapping with Hamilton’s rear wheels at the moment Verstappen starts to apply steering lock.
The positioning at corner entry is relevant because the penalties issued to Lando Norris and Sergio Perez at the Austrian Grand Prix established the interpretation that if a car is “side by side” – with the implication being this means front wheel to front wheel – then the driver on the inside must give room.