Gareth Bale is...The most expensive player ever?!

Raees said:
Said it before and I'll say it again, thing that separates him from the likes of Valencia.. is attitude pure and simple. Bale might be deluded in his quest to be the best player in the world and does alot of daft shit, but the kid is ambitious.. he's dedicated to improving, that can only ever be a good thing.
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There are several things that separate him from Valencia. One example being that Bale has worked on improving his right foot and is now comfortable in using it to cross or finish with it when the chance arises, Valencia just refuses to even contemplate improving his left foot.
 
Yes totally agree.. but what has led to that development in his game? attitude.. he has that desire to improve and become a more complete player.
 
If he is "copying" Ronaldo how is that a bad thing? Ronaldo is an absolute model professional. Obviously he is not in the same class as him, and I don't believe he ever will be, but he is approaching a world class player in my eyes and could certainly play for Real Madrid and be a success, I don't see Di Maria as a far superior player to Bale at all. Maybe defensively Di Maria contributes more, and pressing from the front of which he is an expert at, but I think Bale would contribute just as much in an attacking sense.
 
I don't understand when people decide to use stats as a form of argument to say Bale is a good player, even though he has little assists. Then belittle someone like Downing who doesn't have assists yet puts crosses in which is something Bale is doing.

Not saying Bale is as bad as Downing as i rate him. But assisting is something he needs to add to his game. No doubt.
 
Raees said:
Said it before and I'll say it again, thing that separates him from the likes of Valencia.. is attitude pure and simple. Bale might be deluded in his quest to be the best player in the world and does alot of daft shit, but the kid is ambitious.. he's dedicated to improving, that can only ever be a good thing.
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Attitude maybe, but ability is the main difference, simply Bale is a better footballer than Valencia.

His goal return this season equals Valencia's total United career to date. Comparing the two is like comparing Leon Osman to Modric.
 
I don't understand the big debate, he is a very good player is who is one of the better wingers in the country and still improving, is he near Ronaldo level? No, but not many are.

Many here seem reluctant to give him his due, and his ability as a football player is pretty damn high, up there with the top bracket of wingers currently when he is on form
 
JonMotsonsFur said:
If you watched the game today he pinged in cross after cross, only for a midget and a giant to buckle it every time. He does his fair share of assisting.
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Assists are a nonsense way of judging players and always have been. You could beat 5 players from the halfway line, round the keeper and put the ball on a plate for your striker who then misses an open net from 5 yards. You get nothing for that.
 
Sixpence said:
Assists are a nonsense way of judging players and always have been. You could beat 5 players from the halfway line, round the keeper and put the ball on a plate for your striker who then misses an open net from 5 yards. You get nothing for that.
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It's the same with goals, you could beat 5 players have a 100MPH shot from 5 yards directly at the top corner where the goalkeeper makes a miracle save and you get nothing for that, but nobody suggests disregarding goals as a way of judging players. If one players' consistently getting more assists than another it suggests he's better at creating chances, much like a player scoring more goals than another suggests he's a better goalscorer.
 
SilentWitness said:
I don't understand when people decide to use stats as a form of argument to say Bale is a good player, even though he has little assists. Then belittle someone like Downing who doesn't have assists yet puts crosses in which is something Bale is doing.

Not saying Bale is as bad as Downing as i rate him. But assisting is something he needs to add to his game. No doubt.
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I've always thought assists are a bit of a ridiculous way to judge a player, says just as much about the team the player plays for as it does the player himself. Chances created are a much fairer way of comparing creative players' productivity.
 
SilentWitness said:
I don't understand when people decide to use stats as a form of argument to say Bale is a good player, even though he has little assists. Then belittle someone like Downing who doesn't have assists yet puts crosses in which is something Bale is doing.

Not saying Bale is as bad as Downing as i rate him. But assisting is something he needs to add to his game. No doubt.
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Not really down to Bale though. I have seen him put in some tremendous crosses which have not been converted. That may affect his assist count, but not through his own doing. If Spurs had more than Defoe up front, i would suggest his assist stats would be far higher.

At Utd we have far superior strikers, both in quality and variety, and we could surely expect a far higher percentage of chances converted. I think Bale is top drawer, and if we were to sign him, i have little doubt that he would improve us significantly. RVP would have a field day with the amount of chances and the space Bale would create.

We sorely lack a player who can power through defences and midfields the way Bale can. Anderson is probably the only player we have who regularly drives past opponents into advanced areas, which is why we lack penetration through the middle when he is out.
 
Whatever way you look at it, he'd be a great buy, we've lacked a top left footed winger for quite a while.

But as Ash said in another thread, him and Valencia both starting would make us incredibly one dimensional.
 
Yeah bale would be good but I don't see the point of him and also have Valencia as a first teamer. One of our problems is that we don't get enough variety from the front four. Also not sure if its true or not as I don't watch that much of spurs but when I do see them I sort f get the feeling that bale is being allowed a lot more lisence to go where he likes in a similar fashio to how ronaldo started to for us. I'm not sure we could give him that freedom as although he's a great prospect we have other better attacking players in Rooney and rvp.

Also I think spurs would make us break the bank for him, he's a very talented player but is he worth splashing out 30+mil when we already have very good wingers albeit if they're out of form atm. Swap deal plus cash for Valencia/young would be cool though.
 
Cina said:
Whatever way you look at it, he'd be a great buy, we've lacked a top left footed winger for quite a while.

But as Ash said in another thread, him and Valencia both starting would make us incredibly one dimensional.
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Not necessarily. Bale is not as one dimensional as Valencia for a start. He can drive through the middle and score just as he did against us. A far more competent goalscorer than Valencia. Bale would be a great winger, or a great wide forward. Valencia is simply a provider, which is why when his crossing is below par he doesn't offer much else in an attacking sense.

Bale is now contributing and causing problems for opponents in more than one area of the pitch. His pace and power is impressive, his goal threat and ability to strike a ball is becoming just as impressive.
 
Ash_G said:
Yeah bale would be good but I don't see the point of him and also have Valencia as a first teamer. One of our problems is that we don't get enough variety from the front four. Also not sure if its true or not as I don't watch that much of spurs but when I do see them I sort f get the feeling that bale is being allowed a lot more lisence to go where he likes in a similar fashio to how ronaldo started to for us. I'm not sure we could give him that freedom as although he's a great prospect we have other better attacking players in Rooney and rvp.

Also I think spurs would make us break the bank for him, he's a very talented player but is he worth splashing out 30+mil when we already have very good wingers albeit if they're out of form atm. Swap deal plus cash for Valencia/young would be cool though.
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You're over thinking it, Bale is better than Ashley Young in every way so how would we be more one dimensional than we already are?
 
Well young doesn't always start, bale strikers me very much as a guy who wants to be the main man. Also whilst bale is unquestionably better than young, young is better at coming inside from the left, which complements having a strictly wide player in Valencia on the other side. Like I said if we got bale, than if we kept Valencia in the first team I think it would be more 1 dimensional than we are now with young/nani on the other flank.

If we could bring bale in at the expense of young/Valencia than fair enough but adding to our wingers or replacing nani wouldn't be ideal for me. Even then though I wouldn't break the bank for bale unless we could get a decent deal for those players, he's not that much better and as I said seems to enjoy a freedom at spurs than our wingers don't here.
 
apotheosis said:
Not necessarily. Bale is not as one dimensional as Valencia for a start. He can drive through the middle and score just as he did against us. A far more competent goalscorer than Valencia. Bale would be a great winger, or a great wide forward. Valencia is simply a provider, which is why when his crossing is below par he doesn't offer much else in an attacking sense.

Bale is now contributing and causing problems for opponents in more than one area of the pitch. His pace and power is impressive, his goal threat and ability to strike a ball is becoming just as impressive.
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He has played behind the striker at times last season for Spurs and looked just as effective. He is a bit one dimensional and similar to AV in the fact he doesn't use tricks to beat his man just sheer running. But Bale's dribbling is tighter, he hardly ever wastes a ball and when he's running he seems to go through the gears and you can visible see it when he goes into that very top gear that nobody else can live with where he just blisters through defences with nobody anywhere near him.

I'm biased because I watch him for Wales and of course he is in another stratosphere compared to the other players there, but I'd love to see him here. May not be his next move, which I am convinced will be Real Madrid.
 
Ash_G said:
Well young doesn't always start, bale strikers me very much as a guy who wants to be the main man. Also whilst bale is unquestionably better than young, young is better at coming inside from the left, which complements having a strictly wide player in Valencia on the other side. Like I said if we got bale, than if we kept Valencia in the first team I think it would be more 1 dimensional than we are now with young/nani on the other flank.

If we could bring bale in at the expense of young/Valencia than fair enough but adding to our wingers or replacing nani wouldn't be ideal for me. Even then though I wouldn't break the bank for bale unless we could get a decent deal for those players, he's not that much better and as I said seems to enjoy a freedom at spurs than our wingers don't here.
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Young isn't better than Bale at coming inside from the left. To be fair you said you haven't watched much of Spurs and that's shining through in your comments.

Despite being right footed I'd say Young is a more traditional left winger than Bale.Just look at Bale's goals this season, neither Valencia or Young would find themselves in those positions.
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His performance yesterday reminded me of Ronaldo a bit when he was starting to really shine.

You just never felt he was ever going to miss. the way he is progressing Bale is going to be rampant next season. I would fancy him to not be far off 20 goals.

Who cares about the comparisons to Young & Valencia above, he would inmprove our squad for sure and that can only be a good thing.
 
Rooney24 said:
His performance yesterday reminded me of Ronaldo a bit when he was starting to really shine.

You just never felt he was ever going to miss. the way he is progressing Bale is going to be rampant next season. I would fancy him to not be far off 20 goals.
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This has been said for the past 2 seasons too. But he's yet to make the step up to the "world class" level.
 
MrMojo said:
Young isn't better than Bale at coming inside from the left. To be fair you said you haven't watched much of Spurs and that's shining through in your comments.

Despite being right footed I'd say Young is a more traditional left winger than Bale.Just look at Bale's goals this season, neither Valencia or Young would find themselves in those positions.
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Like I said i've only seen limited amounts of Bale this season and last but from what I've seen he seems to have been given a license to roam, similarly to what we gave Ronaldo when we played a 442-esque formation. Certainly he seems to have more freedom to move than our wingers have. From my understanding one of the frustrations with Nani is that he doesn't stick to his flank enough, and yet he probably roams less than Bale does these days.

Also Bale seems to be getting joy coming in from the right/ approaching from central on to his left, not cutting in from the left on to his right. That's my point when comparing to Young. Like I said pair him with Valencia who's less able to swap wings than Lennon and to me it looks more 1 dimensional. Young isn't a traditional winger so probs wouldn't enjoy being on the right much.

If Valencia was to move on (personally don't see how we could keep the wingers we have and add Bale), than fair enough, same with Young. But unless we could get a decent deal for them then I don't see why Bale would be a necessity, is he better? Yes. But is he that much better to justify it? That's what's questionable.

I'd much rather we spend whatever cash we'd need for bale on a midfielder and if we did by bale I don't think he'd be an ideal replacement for Nani.
 
Ash_G said:
Like I said i've only seen limited amounts of Bale this season and last but from what I've seen he seems to have been given a license to roam, similarly to what we gave Ronaldo when we played a 442-esque formation. Certainly he seems to have more freedom to move than our wingers have. From my understanding one of the frustrations with Nani is that he doesn't stick to his flank enough, and yet he probably roams less than Bale does these days.

Also Bale seems to be getting joy coming in from the right/ approaching from central on to his left, not cutting in from the left on to his right. That's my point when comparing to Young. Like I said pair him with Valencia who's less able to swap wings than Lennon and to me it looks more 1 dimensional. Young isn't a traditional winger so probs wouldn't enjoy being on the right much.

If Valencia was to move on (personally don't see how we could keep the wingers we have and add Bale), than fair enough, same with Young. But unless we could get a decent deal for them then I don't see why Bale would be a necessity, is he better? Yes. But is he that much better to justify it? That's what's questionable.

I'd much rather we spend whatever cash we'd need for bale on a midfielder and if we did by bale I don't think he'd be an ideal replacement for Nani.
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That all seems pretty confused to me. You say Bale would make us more one dimensional but then go on to confirm that he does in fact roam around the pitch,adopting various positions and therefore influencing things in differing areas compared to an out and out winger. Seems like a contradiction.
 
Sixpence said:
Assists are a nonsense way of judging players and always have been. You could beat 5 players from the halfway line, round the keeper and put the ball on a plate for your striker who then misses an open net from 5 yards. You get nothing for that.
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Don't tell this to Di Maria.

Bollox argument.
 
MrMojo said:
That all seems pretty confused to me. You say Bale would make us more one dimensional but then go on to confirm that he does in fact roam around the pitch,adopting various positions and therefore influencing things in differing areas compared to an out and out winger. Seems like a contradiction.
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But that's because Spurs seem to give him a freedom our wingers don't enjoy. Do you not think that Nani wouldn't love to be able to roam in the way Bale seems to? That's my point. At this moment in time we seem to want our wingers to stay wide, occasionally Young will be allowed to drift in, but mostly he sticks to his wing. How many times do the wingers swap sides etc, or come centrally? Not often.

Bale with Nani could work very well, Bale with Valencia for me would lead to us being quite 1 dimensional imo and like I said if we were going to bring in a winger as a nani replacement than I don't think Bale would be an ideal choice.
 
I recognise he's a very good player - but for whatever reason the idea of us signing him does nothing for me.

I'd be more interested if he went to one of the Spanish sides and see how he gets on there.
 
His attempts to recreate ronaldos movements, his stance at free licks is embarrassing. Be your own man. He probably trains in a Madrid cr7 shirt the gorp
 
Ash_G said:
But that's because Spurs seem to give him a freedom our wingers don't enjoy. Do you not think that Nani wouldn't love to be able to roam in the way Bale seems to? That's my point. At this moment in time we seem to want our wingers to stay wide, occasionally Young will be allowed to drift in, but mostly he sticks to his wing. How many times do the wingers swap sides etc, or come centrally? Not often.

Bale with Nani could work very well, Bale with Valencia for me would lead to us being quite 1 dimensional imo and like I said if we were going to bring in a winger as a nani replacement than I don't think Bale would be an ideal choice.
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How much freedom our wingers get is dictated by how good they are. We gave Ronaldo as much freedom as he wanted, Nani likewise. Valencia plays how he does because that's all he's capable of.

Do you really think a manager as good as SAF would buy a player who can dominate games in all areas of the pitch and then tell him to cut that out and stick to getting chalk on his boots?
 
MrMojo said:
How much freedom our wingers get is dictated by how good they are. We gave Ronaldo as much freedom as he wanted, Nani likewise. Valencia plays how he does because that's all he's capable of.

Do you really think a manager as good as SAF would buy a player who can dominate games in all areas of the pitch and then tell him to cut that out and stick to getting chalk on his boots?
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Well firstly I think Nani would do just as well in a free role as Bale does but more so Bale is no Ronaldo. Asking their players to sacrifice part of their games for Ronaldo is one thing, for Bale is another. I'm not sure Bale is quite that good to get that sort of role. And as for Fergie trying to transform a player, it wouldn't be a new concept. Also it's not much of a transformation, he started as exactly that sort of winger.

Like I said I've got nothing against Bale, if we could bring him in at the expense of Valencia/Young and could get a good deal for him then it would be a good move. But I wouldn't break the bank for him when we don't particularly need him.
 
Ash_G said:
Well firstly I think Nani would do just as well in a free role as Bale does but more so Bale is no Ronaldo. Asking their players to sacrifice part of their games for Ronaldo is one thing, for Bale is another. I'm not sure Bale is quite that good to get that sort of role. And as for Fergie trying to transform a player, it wouldn't be a new concept. Also it's not much of a transformation, he started as exactly that sort of winger.

Like I said I've got nothing against Bale, if we could bring him in at the expense of Valencia/Young and could get a good deal for him then it would be a good move. But I wouldn't break the bank for him when we don't particularly need him.
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it wouldn't be Fergie transforming a player, it would be him asking Bale to regress, to cut out the variety he's added to hs game over the last two years. It just wouldn't happen.

Not wanting him is your entitled opinion, I just think you're reasoning is confused and based on unusually bad management from SAF.
 
He is inconsistent in his form which is his problem. Days like yesterday when it fell for him he looks a world beater, but on days when tottenham arent performing as a team and on the back foot he is nowhere to be found.

He certainly has the level of a top player and has the ability to win a game by himself, but he needs to be playing consistently at the top level.
 
MrMojo said:
it wouldn't be Fergie transforming a player, it would be him asking Bale to regress, to cut out the variety he's added to hs game over the last two years. It just wouldn't happen.

Not wanting him is your entitled opinion, I just think you're reasoning is confused and based on unusually bad management from SAF.
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Well that's part of my point, at spurs at club with less attacking ability than us, he is the star man, they can allow him to have that freedom. At united we have better attacking players than him, he wouldn't come and be the star player in the way Ronaldo did. So why would Fergie ask other players to sacrifice their game to allow that?

Also Ferge buying him an asking him to play a more restrained role, which isn't that unlikely, look at Kagawa, once Rooney came back he was moved to areas which aren't ideal for him and demand more dicipline, it's yet to be seen where he will play, but the odds of him playing a/m whilst rooney and rvp are here seem limited.

And if he did that to Bale and asked him to stick to his flank more, exactly the way he uses the wngers we have, even the ones who could roam, than with Valencia/Young on the other side I don't think it would be ideal. Again Bale with Nani could be great though still then I wouldn't break the bank for Bale unless we could get a decent deal for Valencia/Young.
 
Ash_G said:
Well that's part of my point, at spurs at club with less attacking ability than us, he is the star man, they can allow him to have that freedom. At united we have better attacking players than him, he wouldn't come and be the star player in the way Ronaldo did. So why would Fergie ask other players to sacrifice their game to allow that?

Also Ferge buying him an asking him to play a more restrained role, which isn't that unlikely, look at Kagawa, once Rooney came back he was moved to areas which aren't ideal for him and demand more dicipline, it's yet to be seen where he will play, but the odds of him playing a/m whilst rooney and rvp are here seem limited.

And if he did that to Bale and asked him to stick to his flank more, exactly the way he uses the wngers we have, even the ones who could roam, than with Valencia/Young on the other side I don't think it would be ideal. Again Bale with Nani could be great though still then I wouldn't break the bank for Bale unless we could get a decent deal for Valencia/Young.
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If you really believe we'd sign Bale and regress him to the payer he was two years ago, just an out n out winger, I think you're doing the manager a massive disservice.

You're Kagawa example is flawed,we've barely seen him and have no idea where or how he's going to play. Kagawa's best position is already taken by Rooney, so there is a selection headache there. There wouldn't be if we signed Bale, he just takes Youngs position.

Ultimately I think you need to watch him more, you seem to think he has a completely free role. He simply doesn't, he's still spends most of his time on the left, he's just got the ability to affect the game in other areas and therefore does so. His role at Spurs could be exactly replicated here and to great effect.
 
MrMojo said:
If you really believe we'd sign Bale and regress him to the payer he was two years ago, just an out n out winger, I think you're doing the manager a massive disservice.

You're Kagawa example is flawed,we've barely seen him and have no idea where or how he's going to play. Kagawa's best position is already taken by Rooney, so there is a selection headache there. There wouldn't be if we signed Bale, he just takes Youngs position.

Ultimately I think you need to watch him more, you seem to think he has a completely free role. He simply doesn't, he's still spends most of his time on the left, he's just got the ability to affect the game in other areas and therefore does so. His role at Spurs could be exactly replicated here and to great effect.
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Well I guess we'll have to see. Like I said Bale with Nani could be great, with Valencia I don't think he's the best choice we could go after and in general unless we could sell him or Young for good money, or do a decent swap I don't see the point of getting Bale. Plus we don't particularly need another winger, especially when we could use a midfielder more so I would hope we look there first before we go for a winger, similarly with lewandowski we don't really need a striker.
 
Ash_G said:
Well I guess we'll have to see. Like I said Bale with Nani could be great, with Valencia I don't think he's the best choice we could go after and in general unless we could sell him or Young for good money, or do a decent swap I don't see the point of getting Bale. Plus we don't particularly need another winger, especially when we could use a midfielder more so I would hope we look there first before we go for a winger, similarly with lewandowski we don't really need a striker.
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Given that it looks like Nani is on his way out you'd be happy with Valencia and Young as our wingers?
 
MrMojo said:
Given that it looks like Nani is on his way out you'd be happy with Valencia and Young as our wingers?
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Nope but I'd rather we look at a winger more in Nani's mould than Bale's. Obviously wouldn't be upset if we got Bale and certainly would be excited by the idea but I simply don't thing he's an ideal Nani replacement, but a perfect Valencia/Young replacement.
 
Quality player, and now proven in the Premier league, would love him at United.

He isn't in that elite group of players, but he knows his skills and attributes and uses them well.

His physicality and ability to drift into goal scoring positions merits Ronaldo comparisons.
No-one in their right mind would say he's anywhere near Ronnie reardless though.
 
MrMojo said:
Despite being right footed I'd say Young is a more traditional left winger than Bale.Just look at Bale's goals this season, neither Valencia or Young would find themselves in those positions.
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Nah that's definitely not true, Bale is as natural a left winger in the entire league. Being left footed obviously helps but he can attack the byline far better than Young can. Young rarely does it, he always cuts inside and prefers to pass it rather than attack the fullback in the way Bale does. Bale is a far more natural winger, it's not even close IMO.

There's no doubt he has started cutting inside more since midway through last season, as Ash says he has had license to drift. But it wasn't natural to him at all and initially made him a less effective player. It was discussed loads in the ff and he really didn't suit it, nor did Spurs who became congested and lost their best attacking asset in their width.

Two things have since happened IMO. One, he's got far better at coming inside with the positions he takes up, previously it all looked a bit random and forced, as if he was just coming inside for the sake of it but I don't get that impression anymore. Secondly, he's picking his moments better. If you watch Spurs he still keeps his width on the left and fires in crosses, but just mixes that up with some runs inside. It isn't as if he's cut out what initially made him such a threat, the width is still there, he's just supplemented it with an extra dimension to his game.

If he came to us I don't think we'd need to change much of his game. Bale of last season was coming in too much which is pointless with Rooney there, but currently he is much more balanced and would fit right in.
 
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