Exactamundo. Great post.
Healthcare
- Thread starter RDCR07
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Healthcare is a basic human right, money should have no say in it. If a country has the possibility to offer it to all it's citizens equally then it should, otherwise it's a huge failure.
That's a bingo.
However, you/we are preaching to the converted. I don't think anyone here feels differently. If they do they have kept it short to avoid the certain mass assault they would be subjected to.
I think all feel the same except maybe some in the top 3%, who actually profit on bad healthcare systems around the world.
I am not sure how many of the bankruptcies attributed to medical debt are actually people without insurance, which is why I said significantly reduced. Its worth noting that to be considered a medical debt bankruptcy the filing just has to include some medical debt. In many cases the amount of medical debt was is under $1,000, and the filer had many other debts.
Of course any sort of healthcare debt is unacceptable because it should be basically free at POS for everyone. I am in favor or single payer UHC BTW
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Christ, those insurance prices are insane. For comparison: We have universal healthcare here, but the insurances I do have are a couple of health insurances (payout in case of serious illness and another that covers lost income in such an event) and a whole host of different ones through my union (contents insurance, homeowners insurance, a couple of health insurances, like life and disability, travel insurance, insurance to cover legal fees). Comes in at a total of $100 per month, and half of that are union fees, and the union offers a lot more than insurance.
its a story that shows why its so important to fight for single payer and not means testing and piecemeal bullshit. people arent going to fight to defend obamacare because it was a pile of shit that they needed a spreadsheet to decipher. people will fight for single payer.
The Reasons More Older Americans Are Filing For Bankruptcy
https://www.forbes.com/sites/nextav...icans-are-filing-for-bankruptcy/#1d4cd55a5fad
The article was good for highlighting people get medical debt in the US but lack any substance. Its main point is the number of over 65s filing bankruptcy with some medical debt rose last year. A shift from 7% to 8% of the total bankruptcies is very misleading. Firstly the percentage of the population over 65 rises every year so you would expect that number to rise over time. The number of total bankruptcies has been trending down. People over 65 have fixed incomes so bankruptcies in that age group will not fall as fast as the rest of the population. That could mean the overall share of bankruptcies for the over 65s shifted up.
Elephant in the room -- raising costs.
Definitely a major problem. Not just in the US but pretty much everywhere.
There was a notable study done in the 70s that predicted that if healthcare costs/employment continued to rise at the rates in the 70s something like 30% of people would work in the NHS within 50 years. Thankfully the predictions were out but healthcare costs have risen conssitanetly and will continue to do so.
The US is somewhat lucky if they can move to a single payer UCH system because costs could potentially be reduced by 20-30%.
Agree -- the cost increase of healthcare across the world is due primarily to chronic diseases especially diabetes, hypertension and obesity and the complexity of management of folks who have a more complex scenario of more than one chronic disease.
The cause of chronic disease is due to ageing population and urbanisation (or both) which has led to a shitty lifestyle. What is at the core of that shitty lifestyle especially the baby boomers tends to be of a psychological in nature ie depression, isolation/loneliness etc.
Why the system is failing is the lack of accountability of everyone up & down the ecosystem and the lack of patient-outcomes approach.
You can had rising population and increasing number of procedures to the list above. When I was a kid the number of common operations performed by the NHS was relatively small. A knee or hip replacement was unheard of and now they are common everyday operation. Advancements in medicine and healthcare are awesome but they can also had a burden to budgets.
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I think technology advances counter the costs of increasing procedures. Its the need to manage ageing tsunami of baby boomers and the associated chronic diseases (55%-60% of folks over 60 will have one chronic disease and worse in some other countries ie at a younger age) thats the major issue/cost burden.
Worryingly, we are actually only seeing the outer edges of rising healthcare costs due to this aging tsunami/.
I doubt this will happen anytime soon because of the political pressures of a gridlocked Washington. Even if the Dems win back the Congress and the Presidency, they will not move forward on single payer since they themselves aren't united on the the way forward and the threat of re-losing Congress will be on their minds since the GOP will kick up a major fuss if the Dems attempt to move to single payer. So the question then becomes how to fix the leaks in Obamacare, which is actually something very reasonable the Dems could do - institute the penalty for the individual mandate and maybe even double down on it by increasing the fees for people who opt out to make sure the pools are better populated and drive costs down.
Yes I know it is unlikely to happen BUT if it ever does it's an opportunity to reduce healthcare spending. Got to try and be glass half full 
Yes I know it is unlikely to happen BUT if it ever does it's an opportunity to reduce healthcare spending. Got to try and be glass half full
It should happen, unfortunately those for it are shouting at one another in an echo chamber instead of making the case within society at large. This is precisely what is slowing it down from every happening.
I've helped lots of people with health, infertility, digestive problems, angina, lump out of my daughters neck, knee problem, back problem, cold sore, mouth ulcers, prostate pain, joint aches.
I take nutritionals, herbs, x-potency homeopathics and energy devices.
I take nutritionals, herbs, x-potency homeopathics and energy devices.
I am replying to this hear instead of derailing the Trump thread.
I have a wife that worked 16 years in the NHS and is now in her 17th year working in the US system. Her mother worked in the NHS for many years after we left, and obviously all the girls she trained with are still in the NHS. I have also been a consumer of healthcare on both sides of the pond, with 3-4 surgeries in the US. Our experiences totally contradict your assertion that the healthcare in the US is average.
The healthcare is the US is very good for people with insurance, which is most of the working population. You definitely do not have to be rich to receive very good healthcare over here. I would say most people on average earnings or above get better healthcare than they would receive in the UK.
US healthcare is a service whereas the NHS is an entitlement. They both have good and bad TBH. There is no shortage of money in the US system and the facilities and equipment are generally years ahead of the NHS. I would give the NHS the nod when it comes to the quality of the nurses and doctors but the access to more readily available technology like MRIs and labs help balance that out.
Here are some polls for the NSH and US healthcare which might surprise some people:
Overall Satisfaction with US Healthcare was 65% in 2016:
http://news.gallup.com/poll/195605/americans-satisfaction-healthcare-system-edges-down.aspx
Overall satisfaction in the NHS was 63% in 2016
https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/publications/public-satisfaction-nhs-2016
Now for a little anecdote. My Mother-in-Law has skin cancer and she has been waiting several months for a NHS appointment to have suspect areas of skin removed. As of today she still has no appointment and this has been going on for over four months. I also suffer from the occasional suspect area of skin, I have one now. I called my dermatologist and booked an appointment for next week. Any procedures required will be performed during the visit. If I don’t like that dermatologist I could switch to the dozens of alternate doctors in the area with a simple phone call. In this instance the NHS is failing my Mother-in-Law pretty badly, whereas I am getting exceptional healthcare in the US.
The downside in the US when you have insurance is more paperwork and having to pay copays and deductibles. On the flip side tax is much lower here so you really don’t end up paying anymore for healthcare than many working Brits do.
He was not arrested for an unpaid ambulance bill. You can't actually be arrested and jailed for debt. He was arrested for contempt of court for failing to appear. This is more of a legal/court issue than a healthcare issue.
im sure it hasnt occured to you in your comfortable middle class existence but appearing in court to discuss paying money you dont have is not just as simple as telling your boss you have a dentist appointment and driving your camry to court
don't employers have a legal obligation to give you the time off to go to court?... pretty sure they do in the uk
That as nothing to with the fact he was arrested for contempt of court. When someone files against you the local sheriff's office usually hand delivers a summons. It will will have all the pertinent information and a date to attend, plus a number to call if you can't attend that day. In my comfortable middle class world I actually have first hand experience of the exact process he was faced with. You can't ignore a summons or even a request to be a juror, endof.
He could have attended on the original date, explained his situation and the case would have probably been thrown out. Or he could have NOT killed himself and appeared in court the next day, apologized for contempt of court, and then done what he should have done in the first place.
I was highlighting what you said to make the greater point that it is a shocking system. No different to the corruption you read about in third-world countries.
I would agree with that. The system and funding needs changing. The infrastructure in terms of hospitals, doctors, ancillary services and staffing is pretty good. It is a shame because with some sensible changes and a move to a single payer UHC system it could be amazing for EVERY American.
The marketing of prescription drugs to the public as products is astounding to me.
Yep that is something that is hard to get used to.
This data supports the view the US healthcare system is actually not in terrible state. When you factor in around 10% do not have insurance the rankings are surprising.
Just because you do more of something doesn't mean you are better. The reason many procedures and treatments occur is because they are lucrative. I tried a new dentist and they are constantly badgering me to max out my insurance and get fillings in areas that don't really need a full filling.
Maybe. But that is a result of healthcare as a service compared to as an entitlement. The procedures probably needed doing and there was money to get them done.
This highlights how far the NHS is lagging behind most countries in funding:
I do find it quite astounding how people lose their homes for the sake of life saving treatment.
The fact that this can happen when the initial debt owner can right it off for cents on the dollar is just pathetic.
Agreed.. but Mike said back on page one when I mentioned people going bankrupt because of high prescription charges.....
So which is it?
I find the US system to be a shambles and the country should be embarrassed about it IMO.
The markups are obscene and the money rather than the care is at the forefront. And that has been told to me by over 6 Dr's I know on a personal level.
Not that I needed that confirmation as its quite clear the minute you walk or get taken into the hospital.
The markups are obscene and the money rather than the care is at the forefront. And that has been told to me by over 6 Dr's I know on a personal level.
Not that I needed that confirmation as its quite clear the minute you walk or get taken into the hospital.
He's wrong. There are strict limits on surgeries and some will only be covered up to a percentage. You also have deductibles and lifetime maximums. Just because you have insurance doesn't mean you aren't going to be paying a lot of money on treatment.
I think my achilles rupture cost me about three grand with the rest covered by the insurance.