Is Mou still 'The Special One' for you all?

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I don't think there is any manager in world football who obsesses over winning trophies irrespective of the style of football like Mourinho does which is why he was always the perfect fit for United. He is a fantastic motivator who would go to any length to get the very best out of his players and unite them under an objective. His strength on the coaching side of the job is his defensive coaching and he provides extremely detailed instructions to defenders which is why he is a dream for any defender to work under. His in-game management and reading of the game is among the very best (for instance the West Ham away match this season). He is a good squad builder and identifies the weakness in his own team and in that respect his record in the transfer market to strengthen those positions is near flawless.

But no manager is perfect and when Mourinho was appointed as the United manager, I had hoped that he decides to reinvent himself as football is always changing and no manager can afford to say still but it looks like he is still using the same management style and coaching methods which he is accustomed to throughout his career. Our lack of finishing chances in part is down to the players but Mourinho is responsible too. He has always been a firm believer of giving freedom to his attacking players and let the players find the solutions on the pitch by themselves. This works for him when he has experienced players who can perform without any instructions and after increased understanding amongst themselves can turn into a functioning attacking unit. He has faced this problem earlier in his career too. Remember when he called West Ham as the '19th Century team' when Chelsea struggled to score against them? He was also the one who coined the term 'park the bus' when Chelsea couldn't break down Spurs in his first stint in England. He faced those problems fewer times back then as the individual quality was higher in those teams to rescue a win.

Fergie never had any problem breaking down deep lying defences. This is because back then the team used to perform certain attacking drills in training against specific teams to break down the opposition. Van Persie mentioned this fact during the title winning season which certainly helps players to repeat those predetermined moves in the match. Having young players in the team certainly adds to Mourinho's problems as they require guidance on how to play their game. Van Gaal was accused of over coaching the team last season(for example, taking a touch before shooting) which senior players didn't like but the younger attacking players certainly thrived due to almost being spoon fed about what to do in different situations of the match. Martial's decision making has been poor this season in part due to moving away from the micro-management style to the more hands-off approach which Mourinho has when it comes to attacking. Same is the case with Rashford who isn't being as prolific and not giving performances anywhere resembling last season's. Rashford usually occupied positions in between the centre back and full back last season which is where he made the runs in behind or took on centre backs and exposed their pace( the goals vs City and West Ham for example). This season he is being out muscled by defenders and he is being easily nullified most of the times.

I am still optimistic under Jose as United couldn't have a better manager to attract big names to the club and eventually challenge for the title. It would be stupid to not give him the benefit of the doubt at the moment even if he is under achieving in the league currently. Managerial stability is of the utmost importance if we want to win the title again or we risk going down the same road as Liverpool.
 
Mourinho was the best decision we've made in the post Sir Alex era.

He will take us to the promise land. Mark my words.
 
It's a disappointing thread this. We need stability and a manager that is here for more than a season. United are going in the right direction, patience is needed. The home form needs addressing, especially goalscoring but Jose needs time. If we win the Europa league, it will be a good season in my opinion. A league cup and a Europa would be a great start for Jose. We want the league and competing with the best teams in the champions league again, patience and continuity are key. He needs to imprint his style and ethic, need to get rid of who isn't with him. Needs his players to be fully up for the challenges he presents and be fully committed. The term special one is old now, mourihnos record of winning trophies is fantastic. He's already one us something, yeah the league cup isn't the CL but it's a trophy and a taste of winning for players. I'm 100% behind Jose and willing to give him three years plus as long as we are improving and signs of progress are there. If we had a few more clinical players we would be right up there, the comparisons to lvg are rubbish. We create so much and we are to beat, another good window with a few better attacking players and we will be right up there challenging.
 
I don't see any reason to doubt Mourinho's credentials or his ability to turn us into a winning side. As he said himself, it is always easier for a manager in his second season so I fully expect things to be different next season. All I want out of this season now is the Europa League and for me Jose would have had a successful start as United manager.

You can't really blame him for all the draws we have had so far. If we had converted even 3 of those into wins, I doubt whether threads like these would have been popping up.

We just need to be patient and let him get on with it. I look forward to every game this season and haven't missed any. I couldn't say the same under Moyes/LVG.
 
He's clearly one of the best managers in the world. But his tenure here has been a tad underwhelming so far. We threatened to turn a corner, but then figured out it's actually a circle and there are perpetual corners. Hopefully he'll get it right soon.
 
Can only say that time will tell. He is not finished with season one. I am assuming he will get at least one more season at the helm, maybe more. I guess I will have to wait until I see where we are in another season or two.
 
The criticism of Mourinho is entirely justified, we've been bad at times but I think we're on the right track. Pep at City is just proof that there's no guaranteed winning formula, no matter the pedigree of the manager. I am happy that we have a guy at the helm whose ego is on par with the size of the club. He might not be hitting all the targets for this season but I think next season is when he should be fully judged.
 
No he isn't. Better than LVG .But i feel he lost some of that swagger when he came back from Madrid.
 
He's the best option we've got right now, but I don't think he's special anymore. He looks like damaged goods these days.
 
He was a special one. He is not any more.

But this club can not afford to sack him this season even if we end up with not qualifying for the champion league next season. Manchester United have made enough mistakes.

He will stay. But I do not like him that much. Especially his bad record of using young players is confirmed at Manchester United this season. Rashford, Lingard, Mathial are all stagnating this season, not to mention other young prodigies missing from our sight.

No one is perfect though. Let us see what happen. It is not time of giving verdict now.
 
He's clearly one of the best managers in the world. But his tenure here has been a tad underwhelming so far. We threatened to turn a corner, but then figured out it's actually a circle and there are perpetual corners. Hopefully he'll get it right soon.

This sounds really insightful like it should be on a t-shirt somewhere until you remember circles have no corners :lol:
 
He shouldn't be sacked. Definitely not. His CV has a lot of weight to give him more leeway than normal and he's been clear on how he wants to shape the first team. To the point he's thrown some sly digs at Van Gaal.

However I have a feeling it will get worse before things get better. We've only lost three league games all season. I think Europa will be a priority so we may match those defeats in the final run of games.
 
I really don't get where the 3 seasons break-in time comes from.

1st to settle in.
2nd to show tangible improvement - As in CL spot. None of the we look like a better team, our players are better but we're still 6th nonsense.
3rd season - Challenging for EPL and CL title. I don't expect us to win at this point, but at least be in the top teams mix with potential for future wins.

is my expectation currently.

2013-14 under Moyes, 2014-15, 2015-16 under LvG are already under the drain and we really can't afford 3 more seasons just to realize Mou can't turn us around.

It is a (maybe) slow walk towards where we want to be, but it's fair to see 4th place or better as a fair target for Mou next season.
 
Ehh... it was Jose himself who created 'the special one' tag.
true

i meant that after that first presser the hype machine picked it up and ran with it....dont know too many United fans who bought into it....

its spawned a series of the including 'the chosen one' :eek:, the normal one etc
 
I've never been enthused by Mourinho, there's too many questions about his management even in the successful years. His best attribute (winning at all costs) is also his worst as it doesn't give players time to develop. He effectively wants and needs a ready made team to be properly successful. I think we will have to buy in some stars at their peak now to improve the team enough to compete for the premiership as he hasn't got the patience or man management to bring through anybody but his "favourites".

I'd much rather we had a manager who had the vision to improve the team using the core of very talented youngsters we've got and added as required, but I don't think we will get that with Mou. Having said that, I think he will get us to near where we want (and at least £150 million poorer) down the line. Ideally I'd like us to get there and then look for more of a team builder, but there's no way that'll happen.

Basically, I don't think he's the special one but he's definitely the pragmatic necessary one we need at the moment.
 
Yeah I don't blame him for us missing so many chances in our home games.

Fans want mangers out so fast now, I find that annoying
Yeah it's silly. We won't ever build a strong side if we keep chopping and changing managers.
 
We came 5th in a season where Chelsea were 10th and Leicester won the league pal.

So Chelsea and Leicester swapped positions? I don't feel the Premier League teams are any better than last year going by Champions League performances. It seems more to me that the mid-table teams have improved a bit while that the top teams have regressed considerably. Will of course be glad to eat humble pie if Leicester win the C1.
 
He has lost the touch. It was evident in his last season with Chelsea but we will give him another year regardless of if we make the UCL or not.
I think getting him was a mistake but I mean I do hope I eat my words and Mou gets back to his winning ways, its just that so far I think he has done more harm than good.

We dropped so many points due to terrible team selection. The Fellaini fetish is hard to explain, he never played Schweini who is clearly still a much better player than Fellaini. Took him too long to insert Mikhi into the line up and we dropped points early because of it.
Not to mention he seems to be clashing with a lot of young players.

We are better than last year but nothing special. What Conte did with Chelsea is how you make an impact.
 
Yes pretty much he can create a leagacy here with stability, But he needs to make efforts to stick to united principles too.
 
He's the boring football one, but that hasn't changed in years.
 
Is he?

I'll admit I wasn't very enthused about having him here and actually didn't want him...but desperate times, desperate measures needed and if we did get back on track, I can admit to being wrong and join the bandwagon.

But as every game passes, I find myself losing patience. The draws are as bad as LvG but his whining about players to media annoys me even more. I can't remember of a single incident where Fergie washed his dirty linen in public. Fergie always was uber-protective of his team even after a loss he usually was harsh with the media. I hate the fact Jose is a media darling and doesn't hesitate to dangle his players out. If a player speaks out similar, I'm sure his ego will blow up and the player is apt to never play again.

I'm leaning more and more to....Feckin win or get the feck out.

I may respect Jose for if he does turn us around, but I'll never love him irrespective of success.

1) The draws are as bad as LVG - with the possible exception of Saturday, they're not. Even then, under LVG we lost to West Brom at home without even TRYING to score a goal. This has not happened in any game under Mourinho.
2) Can't think of a single incident where Fergie whined to the media aboout his own players - Nani, repeatedly. That time he dedicated an ENTIRE press conference to slagging off Rooney? Pogba? Keane? Gibson, Evans and Rooney at the same time? The entire team after our second CL final defeat to Barcelona? It happened so many times in high profile situations I refuse to believe anyone has genuinely completed forgotten about every single instance.

I never thought he was the Special One and I never wanted him here. I only warmed to the idea because it meant not enduring another season of LVG...it got to the point where any change was less dumb than no change at all.

The most annoying thing about Mourinho being manager so far though, is people, on this forum, who just invent reasons to have a go at or criticise him. People re-invent reality to justify weird spiteful attacks on him and I can't for the life of me, as someone who hated him before he was here, figure out why anyone would put any effort into doing this.

If any player is dropped or doesn't play for a few games, Mourinho has a "vendetta" against them. Sometimes he'll bring back in someone he apparently has a vendetta against, then be accused of having a vendetta against the player they replace. It's beyond fecking stupid. People accused him of having it in for Luke Shaw, for not giving any reason for not playing him...then he gives a reason, and the same people have a go at him for doing so. Even though it's the exact same concern four other managers have said they had with Luke Shaw.

What makes it SO unbelievably stupid, is that when Moyes was in charge, people on here were so in love with Mourinho, they would criticise Moyes for things that were completely made up, and always find a way to shoe horn their Mourinho agenda into the argument. That was annoing. Now he's here, and acting exactly like you'd expect Mourinho to act, people suddenly decide to irrationally hate him. What is wrong with people on this forum???

He's been here less than a year. He could still win two cups and get CL football. The general consensus is we should have more points than we do but for wasteful finishing. He has hardly been a disaster. He's doing a whole lot better than the two managers before him were at this point in their first season. THe football is also a whole lot better although certainly still needs to improve if he wants to get the team back where people want it to be.

People are looking for a miracle instead of progress, and getting their knickers in a twist about things that just aren't nearly as dramatic as they want them to be. Like suggesting a player needs to have the same commitment levels as his team mates to have a chance of being picked ahead of them. Or suggesting a player needs to be ready to play, before they can play. I mean I hate to break it to the drama brigade, but this is actually incredibly tame by Jose standards. I'm looking forward to the reaction when he does something actually twattish, which sooner or later he will.
 
I never thought he was the Special One and I never wanted him here. I only warmed to the idea because it meant not enduring another season of LVG...it got to the point where any change was less dumb than no change at all.

He is the right one for the stability and style of play, Lack of goals is because of a blunt attack.
 
1) The draws are as bad as LVG - with the possible exception of Saturday, they're not. Even then, under LVG we lost to West Brom at home without even TRYING to score a goal. This has not happened in any game under Mourinho.

I frankly don't see that as an improvement. We have 11 draws, joint top in the league!
If any player is dropped or doesn't play for a few games, Mourinho has a "vendetta" against them.

Who claimed this? All that was said was that Martial, Shaw and Rashford have regressed under Mou and were better before. Now if it's one player I can understand, but all 3 youngsters having a loss of form at the same time points to something more tactical than just Player x is not committed, which he spouts off to media.

And winning at all costs, unattractive football, shooting off his mouth to media are all characteristics of Jose that have been known to all before. Why should it stop applying just because he joined us? Surely those can be criticized even now.

People are looking for a miracle instead of progress

Not quite. Rather people are looking forward to seeing tangible progress, not stuff like "yeah, it's a draw but it was a better draw than under previous manager" If you look hard enough you'll find what you're looking for, irrespective of it it's really there or not.
 
I never thought of him as the special one (im not a sycophant, so why would i buy that bolox?)
so no

Hes doing fine imo.
 
I don't think there is any manager in world football who obsesses over winning trophies irrespective of the style of football like Mourinho does which is why he was always the perfect fit for United. He is a fantastic motivator who would go to any length to get the very best out of his players and unite them under an objective. His strength on the coaching side of the job is his defensive coaching and he provides extremely detailed instructions to defenders which is why he is a dream for any defender to work under. His in-game management and reading of the game is among the very best (for instance the West Ham away match this season). He is a good squad builder and identifies the weakness in his own team and in that respect his record in the transfer market to strengthen those positions is near flawless.

But no manager is perfect and when Mourinho was appointed as the United manager, I had hoped that he decides to reinvent himself as football is always changing and no manager can afford to say still but it looks like he is still using the same management style and coaching methods which he is accustomed to throughout his career. Our lack of finishing chances in part is down to the players but Mourinho is responsible too. He has always been a firm believer of giving freedom to his attacking players and let the players find the solutions on the pitch by themselves. This works for him when he has experienced players who can perform without any instructions and after increased understanding amongst themselves can turn into a functioning attacking unit. He has faced this problem earlier in his career too. Remember when he called West Ham as the '19th Century team' when Chelsea struggled to score against them? He was also the one who coined the term 'park the bus' when Chelsea couldn't break down Spurs in his first stint in England. He faced those problems fewer times back then as the individual quality was higher in those teams to rescue a win.

Fergie never had any problem breaking down deep lying defences. This is because back then the team used to perform certain attacking drills in training against specific teams to break down the opposition. Van Persie mentioned this fact during the title winning season which certainly helps players to repeat those predetermined moves in the match. Having young players in the team certainly adds to Mourinho's problems as they require guidance on how to play their game. Van Gaal was accused of over coaching the team last season(for example, taking a touch before shooting) which senior players didn't like but the younger attacking players certainly thrived due to almost being spoon fed about what to do in different situations of the match. Martial's decision making has been poor this season in part due to moving away from the micro-management style to the more hands-off approach which Mourinho has when it comes to attacking. Same is the case with Rashford who isn't being as prolific and not giving performances anywhere resembling last season's. Rashford usually occupied positions in between the centre back and full back last season which is where he made the runs in behind or took on centre backs and exposed their pace( the goals vs City and West Ham for example). This season he is being out muscled by defenders and he is being easily nullified most of the times.

I am still optimistic under Jose as United couldn't have a better manager to attract big names to the club and eventually challenge for the title. It would be stupid to not give him the benefit of the doubt at the moment even if he is under achieving in the league currently. Managerial stability is of the utmost importance if we want to win the title again or we risk going down the same road as Liverpool.
These are really good points.
But seeing that we have this squad and knowing that they respond in the way they do, for e.g. the younger players - why doesn't Mourinho adapt his approach to fit this? Or get someone in to work with them like this? Surely that would have been more beneficial to us this season? A little more guidance for our young attackers and more attacking drills for young and experienced players alike would surely help us? This inflexibility worries me tbh. We've spent quite a bit of money on Martial for example who showed us what he's capable of last season - surely for all that investment we should ensure he reaches his maximum potential? I'm worried Jose just wants to tear everything up (even if it's promising) just to have things his own way without compromising - and costing us a hell of a lot of money in the process.
 
Is he?

I'll admit I wasn't very enthused about having him here and actually didn't want him...but desperate times, desperate measures needed and if we did get back on track, I can admit to being wrong and join the bandwagon.

But as every game passes, I find myself losing patience. The draws are as bad as LvG but his whining about players to media annoys me even more. I can't remember of a single incident where Fergie washed his dirty linen in public. Fergie always was uber-protective of his team even after a loss he usually was harsh with the media. I hate the fact Jose is a media darling and doesn't hesitate to dangle his players out. If a player speaks out similar, I'm sure his ego will blow up and the player is apt to never play again.

I'm leaning more and more to....Feckin win or get the feck out.

I may respect Jose for if he does turn us around, but I'll never love him irrespective of success.
There's hardly anything to love there but success. However, it's that one thing that he brought everywhere without exception. He's the guy with the best credentials and he's here to stay. That's not a hard fact to reconcile with.

I only wish we didn't have to endure all the gerrymandering that goes into fitting all these fanciful notions into his image. Includes - a list of young players he nurtured everywhere he's been (too flattering for even a narcissist like himself to produce); waxing enthusiastic about his wonderful football (shudder); his man-management infallibility; his puerility and buffoonery are 'no worse than anyone else's ' (with the customary excavation of something Sir Alex did, that isn't remotely similar);
and suchlike.
 
There's hardly anything to love there but success. However, it's that one thing that he brought everywhere without exception. He's the guy with the best credentials and he's here to stay. That's not a hard fact to reconcile with.

I only wish we didn't have to endure all the gerrymandering that goes into fitting all these fanciful notions into his image. Includes - a list of young players he nurtured everywhere he's been (too flattering for even a narcissist like himself to produce); waxing enthusiastic about his wonderful football (shudder); his man-management infallibility; his puerility and buffoonery are 'no worse than anyone else's ' (with the customary excavation of something Sir Alex did, that isn't remotely similar);
and suchlike.

Even Mourinho repeatedly tries to manipulate his character to somehow appease supporters or that's what it feels like. C'mon...just be a cnut and win. It's obvious he isn't satisfied with the way things have gone and needs to end the season well.
 
Even Mourinho repeatedly tries to manipulate his character to somehow appease supporters or that's what it feels like. C'mon...just be a cnut and win. It's obvious he isn't satisfied with the way things have gone and needs to end the season well.
Exactly, but you can see why he would do it. A bit harder to understand why everyone else laps it up. Particularly in light of the fact that we had years to inoculate ourselves from this tripe.
 
I actually think I like him now more than I did earlier in his career. He seems a lot calmer now than he was in the past and a lot less self-involved.

He seems more versatile too. He has shown to be keen to take on a "United approach" to management. He plays way more attacking football than he ever did in his previous jobs. I think only at Liverpool away and Chelsea FA Cup (after the sending off) did he really play defensively. We have a a very attacking intent in almost all our games.

He has put more faith in youngsters than I thought he would too. Rashford, Martial, Bailly, Pogba (all <23yo when the season started) have played a lot under him. He could have easily played Mkhi-Ibra-Mata up front and sent Martial and Rashford to the bench, if he was being his previous self.

Our position has not really improved but that's his first season here, we had a lot of dead wood in the squad that needed clearing out and the league is much stronger this season than last. Sounds like a lot of excuses, but all I'm saying is that while he hasn't done very well, I'll judge the team's achievements more at the end of the year and happily give him 1 more season to see what he can do regardless.

I'm pleased with him so far, he seems to be doing the right things for me.
 
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I like him more than ever.

But I've always found him very overrated in England. This season is exactly what you should expect.
 
I frankly don't see that as an improvement. We have 11 draws, joint top in the league!

I think there's been a very clear and obvious improvement in our performance levels. We're a very hard team to beat, and we actually try to score goals. Last season most games I was desperate to see finish because of how tedious and frankly completely rubbish they were. That's not happened at all this season.

Last season we'd lost more than 3 times in the league, we were out of the Europa League, we didn't finish 4th, and we were the worst team in the league to watch. If you can't see an improvement it's not so much a case of other people looking too hard as you not looking at all beyond the results. I mean fair enough if you want to do that, but even the results up until this point haven't exactly led to disaster. One domestic cup, possibility of a European one, and level with 4th place if the team win their games in hand (which would also put them within very close reach of 3rd)...it could still go quite well. Last season the entire thing from Christmas onwards was a massive uphill struggle and it was only City constantly fecking about that even made it interesting.

Who claimed this? All that was said was that Martial, Shaw and Rashford have regressed under Mou and were better before. Now if it's one player I can understand, but all 3 youngsters having a loss of form at the same time points to something more tactical than just Player x is not committed, which he spouts off to media.

Are you serious? Here's what I got from just trawling a couple of random pages in the Luke Shaw thread:

The club shouldn't allow Mourinho's egocentric, deranged vendettas against young talents cost them a potentially great player in the way Chelsea did with De Bruyne and Lukaku

More likely Mou has vendettas against mentally fragile players or who don't go to bricks with him. Didn't he ditch Mata for Oscar also?

Why is he picking on Shaw? I just can't understand.

I certainly do. Mourinho clearly doesn't like him..

When is the best game to start him in? If not against a Championship team. Jose doesnt like him. It is a personal thing.

Jose doing what he does best, behaving like a proper Cnut. No excuse not to give him playing time, even if it's from the bench but no, Jose has to try and prove a point and make it more personal.. fecking hate the arrogant prick!

Amusingly just from these quotes, apparently Mourinnho also had an agenda against De Bruyne, Lukaku, Mata and Oscar (who he dropped Mata in order to play).

I didn't even venture into the Mkhitaryan thread but can only presume you didn't look in there at any point before December...

It's amazing how Mourinho succeeds in managing footballl teams at all when he apparently has an agenda against about 90% of the players he manages.

Has Mourinho spouted off to the media that Rashford is not committed, or Martial? This is exactly what I'm talking about. This didn't happen. He offered up at worst light criticisms, or words to encourrage them to do better. While it's emerged Luke Shaw has been criticised for the exact same thing by EVERY manager he's been managed by. You've invented a drama that isn't there. I'm not saying Mourinho is perfect, or I think he gets everything right, but nonsense arguments like this that just invent things that haven't happened, are annoying.


And winning at all costs, unattractive football, shooting off his mouth to media are all characteristics of Jose that have been known to all before. Why should it stop applying just because he joined us? Surely those can be criticized even now.

No one has said you can't criticise, but it's the inventionism that is annoying. "Sir Alex never did this", "he clearly has it in for x player"...I mean for feck sake.

He hasn't even done anything that outrageously Mourinho yet. He hasn't poked anyone with cancer in the eye, or claimed there's a conspiracy by Unicef to fix football against him, or launched a sexist tirade against a member of his own staff. He hasn't really done anything annoying other than moan constantly about having too many fixtures.

Not quite. Rather people are looking forward to seeing tangible progress, not stuff like "yeah, it's a draw but it was a better draw than under previous manager" If you look hard enough you'll find what you're looking for, irrespective of it it's really there or not.

If we won the Europa League and/or finished in the top 4, would that not be tangible progress?

We've got 86 goals this season. We only managed 87 all last season.
We've lost 7 games this season. Last season we lost 14.
We won 29 games all last season...in order to not better that, we have to not win another game for the entire rest of the season.

I'm not having to look very hard here...
 
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To answer to thread starters question. Jose should only be special to United fans if he performs and wins trophies.

Historically, yes, he's proven to be a specialist in success.
 
Jose was the only guy good enough to take over SAF and should've been hired when SAF retired.
SAF, leaving the team of champions, for Jose - the most successful manager in the World during the last 10 years - to take over.
We wasted 3 years with Moyes and then LVG, but finally we got the man who can take us back to the top.
I have absolutely no doubt.
 
I don't think there is any manager in world football who obsesses over winning trophies irrespective of the style of football like Mourinho does which is why he was always the perfect fit for United. He is a fantastic motivator who would go to any length to get the very best out of his players and unite them under an objective. His strength on the coaching side of the job is his defensive coaching and he provides extremely detailed instructions to defenders which is why he is a dream for any defender to work under. His in-game management and reading of the game is among the very best (for instance the West Ham away match this season). He is a good squad builder and identifies the weakness in his own team and in that respect his record in the transfer market to strengthen those positions is near flawless.

But no manager is perfect and when Mourinho was appointed as the United manager, I had hoped that he decides to reinvent himself as football is always changing and no manager can afford to say still but it looks like he is still using the same management style and coaching methods which he is accustomed to throughout his career. Our lack of finishing chances in part is down to the players but Mourinho is responsible too. He has always been a firm believer of giving freedom to his attacking players and let the players find the solutions on the pitch by themselves. This works for him when he has experienced players who can perform without any instructions and after increased understanding amongst themselves can turn into a functioning attacking unit. He has faced this problem earlier in his career too. Remember when he called West Ham as the '19th Century team' when Chelsea struggled to score against them? He was also the one who coined the term 'park the bus' when Chelsea couldn't break down Spurs in his first stint in England. He faced those problems fewer times back then as the individual quality was higher in those teams to rescue a win.

Fergie never had any problem breaking down deep lying defences. This is because back then the team used to perform certain attacking drills in training against specific teams to break down the opposition. Van Persie mentioned this fact during the title winning season which certainly helps players to repeat those predetermined moves in the match. Having young players in the team certainly adds to Mourinho's problems as they require guidance on how to play their game. Van Gaal was accused of over coaching the team last season(for example, taking a touch before shooting) which senior players didn't like but the younger attacking players certainly thrived due to almost being spoon fed about what to do in different situations of the match. Martial's decision making has been poor this season in part due to moving away from the micro-management style to the more hands-off approach which Mourinho has when it comes to attacking. Same is the case with Rashford who isn't being as prolific and not giving performances anywhere resembling last season's. Rashford usually occupied positions in between the centre back and full back last season which is where he made the runs in behind or took on centre backs and exposed their pace( the goals vs City and West Ham for example). This season he is being out muscled by defenders and he is being easily nullified most of the times.


I am still optimistic under Jose as United couldn't have a better manager to attract big names to the club and eventually challenge for the title. It would be stupid to not give him the benefit of the doubt at the moment even if he is under achieving in the league currently. Managerial stability is of the utmost importance if we want to win the title again or we risk going down the same road as Liverpool.

This is actually the most spot on comment I've read on here for a while, from a United fan as well (I'm guessing). We Chelsea fans know very well his weaknesses as a coach. His teams are terrible against low block defences. They look far from well rehearsed in the attacking 3rd. There aren't any automatisms. The team looks slow and predictable in attack. How frequently does Jose practice coordinated attacks in his training sessions? Not often judging by the comments of some of his ex-players. Hazard said under Conte, they practice a lot of automatisms so that players know where to go and what to do to break down defences. Movements, triangulation, when and where to occupy space and so on. He said they rarely did that under Mourinho. Robben has made similar comments as well and Xabi Alonso also aluded to that. Diego Torres in his book about Mourinho (regardless of how some have tried to discredit it) said the same.

We also had a similar problem with him in the 2013/14 season of creating many "chances" but not scoring enough goals. We thought the problem was because we had a terrible striker in Torres up front. The season after, we signed Costa and Fabregas and the it did improve our goalscoring relative to chances created but it didn't last long. Second half of the season, we were dour and had to rely on our defense+Hazard to drag us to the title. IIRC, in the 2nd half of the 2014/15, we won most of our matches by only 1 clear goal. Season after, 2015/16, everything collapsed. Jose never set up or had a system in place as far as improving attacking play and building an identity. He just relied on the individual quality of his attackers to win him games and they eventually got burnt out (that and the fact he never rested his best players)

So I'm not sure if what happened to us and Madrid will happen to you guys. Signing Griezmann and a proper out and out top class winger will probably help improve your chances created / goals scored rate but you have to wonder how long it will last. Personally, I'm not convinced he's the right man for your club.
 
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I'm not sure I agree with this. Martial and Shaw were fantastic for us under LvG. Now that we have a different Manager they're not good. Think it's more a case of Jose can't/won't utilise them in the same way as LvG did. Like how he's struggling with Rashford while LvG got him playing brilliantly and just like how Jose has managed to improve Rojo (it works both ways). Ultimately it's up to Jose to motivate and inspire his troops to reach the levels of performance we know they can achieve and he's failing with some of the players.
Martial's home life problems that so affected his form in the first half of the season cannot be blamed on Mourinho. Nor can Shaw's bad attitude as many managers have noted it. Rashford seems to have been running on a high of debuts last season and being an unknown quantity. While I do think Rashford could have been handled a little better Rashford just is too young to be consistent or strong enough. But having to sell Memphis, Schneiderlin, Bastian during the season shows that LVGs signings were a disaster, that have left us with Fellaini and Carrick as our backup midfield and no genuine winger. I'm not saying there aren't things Jose could do better on though as there are many things he could improve on.
 
This is actually the most spot on comment I've read on here for a while, from a United fan as well (I'm guessing). We Chelsea fans know very well his weaknesses as a coach. His teams are terrible against low block defences. They look far from well rehearsed in the attacking 3rd. There aren't any automatisms. The team looks slow and predictable in attack. How frequently does Jose practice coordinated attacks in his training sessions? Not often judging by the comments of some of his ex-players. Hazard said under Conte, they practice a lot of automatisms so that players know where to go and what to do to break down defences. Movements, triangulation, when and where to occupy space and so on. He said they rarely did that under Mourinho. Robben has made similar comments as well and Xabi Alonso also aluded to that. Diego Torres in his book about Mourinho (regardless of how some have tried to discredit it) said the same.

We also had a similar problem with him in the 2013/14 season of creating many "chances" but not scoring enough goals. We thought the problem was because we had a terrible striker in Torres up front. The season after, we signed Costa and Fabregas and the it did improve our goalscoring relative to chances created but it didn't last long. Second half of the season, we were dour and had to rely on our defense+Hazard to drag us to the title. IIRC, in the 2nd half of the 2014/15, we won most of our matches by only 1 clear goal. Season after, 2015/16, everything collapsed. Jose never set up or had a system in place as far as improving attacking play and building an identity. He just relied on the individual quality of his attackers to win him games and they eventually got burnt out (that and the fact he never rested his best players)

So I'm not sure if what happened to us and Madrid will happen to you guys. Signing Griezmann and a proper out and out top class winger will probably help improve your chances created / goals scored rate but you have to wonder how long it will last. Personally, I'm not convinced he's the right man for your club.

Genuine question, but isn't attacking/defending drills etc. down to the coaches? It's the managers job to decide how to set out the team and how to attack, but it's the coaches job to implement the system with the players in training, both individually and as a combined unit, is it not?

I remember reading something similar in Pep's book, he said something about how it's his job to get his players into positions where they can attack, but once they're there, it's on them to express themselves.
 
He hasn't been the special one for a long time now.

After his treble success with Inter, he was the best manager in the world imo.

His 1st two seasons at Real Madrid were a success. However, his last season was a disaster and it seemed to change him. He's just not been the same since his final season at Real.

He's got a lot to prove next season.
 
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