Luis Nani | 2012/13 Performances

[Cina]

Valencia can probably keep up with Ronaldo on a run, so it wouldn't be wrong to start him, as you say because of his defensive contributions. I would still want Nani on the left though. There will probably be more room for Valencia to run in against RM, as Ronaldo doesn't track back as much and they will be attacking, leaving them slightly vulnerable for a fast counter attack.

Normally he would but he's looked like he's lost pace this season so I wouldn't be so sure, but I think we will see him on the right, or maybe Young.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

Given that none of the three seem to have any kind of final ball or likely goal threat...it's come to the point where I genuinely don't care who plays on the wing.

We all know our biggest threat is into the feet of RVP, Rooney or Hernandez or from set pieces. The wide men obviously draw markers away from others and have some effect, but in terms of involvement in goals, it really doesn't matter who plays.

In that case, I wouldn't begrudge Nani a start in Madrid. He's certainly not going to perform worse than Valencia has for the last 4 months.

 

[Tomuś]

Strange use of houlier, I think the general consensus here is that Nani was better.

As I said in the Valencia thread though, I thought he did alright and I don't at all understand why he's getting slagged as "awful" etc. Nani on the other hand was much better than ok in that first half and pretty "meh" in the 2nd, although even in the second half he created 2 nice chances for RVP.

Well you're sort of right as for the houllier. Nani had good first 30 minutes I'd say. What I don't like though, is using double standards when comparing them. I'm over the moon about the fact we didn't sell Nani and there are positive signs but I can also judge his their current performances. There's a massive bias towards Nani at the moment, which I'm sure you've notcied yourself. I also acknowledge it was the other way round last season, although somewhat more justifiable (Valencia's great form).

I'd say Nani did more in the attacking sense but he also fecked up a few things. Valencia was steady and nowhere as bad as he's been this season. The last few games he's looked at least closer (or rather not as far away) to what should be required from him.

None of them played well yesterday but believe me, I'm utterly happy with having them both on the wings. Nani gives us something that no other winger does and I do respect that. Don't ignore the fact we look more balanced with Valencia on the right than when he doesn't play. That's the fact - even if he doesn't play well, he gives us width and balance. Now he just needs to start playing with more confidence and purpose.

And once again, I accept that the houllier was inappopriate there, the frustration over the Nani-bias got the better of me there.

 

[Cina]

And once again, I accept that the houllier was inappopriate there, the frustration over the Nani-bias got the better of me there.

feck me, surely you can see the irony of that. Your Valencia bias is just as bad.

 

[Tomuś]

feck me, surely you can see the irony of that. Your Valencia bias is just as bad.

I haven't praised Valencia's performance once this season, and I've seen people praising Nani's after his come-back. feck me, surely you can see the difference.

 

[I'm always right]

And once again, I accept that the houllier was inappopriate there, the frustration over the Nani-bias got the better of me there.

The thing is, since when has the Chief been a massive biased Nani fan? Personally I don't see that there has been any bias in comparing the two at the weekend, Nani was better and that's why pretty much every poster on here is saying that. I'd argue that the main "bias" shown in this thread over the past few days was your post with that houlier. We know you adore Valencia and as I said, I think he had an alright game too, but to houlier someone for thinking Nani was better shows a massive bias on your part.

 

[I'm always right]

I haven't praised Valencia's performance once this season.

I really don't want to get into another one of those debates here where we bore the rest of the caf but you have Tomuś, of course you have mate and there's nothing wrong with that.

 

[Brightonian]

None of them played well yesterday

This would basically be my point of contention. I thought Nani played a pretty good game. As a big club, it's easy to ignore the opposition's performance, but I though Fulham were excellent and Riether was probably the best amongst them. He put in an almost flawless performance, and it was only really that which stopped Nani cutting them open much more often, and getting a goal or assist from the game. If you watch it over, you can count maybe ten times when Nani pulls the trigger on a shot or a through-ball, and Riether is able to dive back in and just get a block or deflection on it. Even with that, Nani Evra and Rooney combining up the left flank was our most dangerous outlet all night.

Valencia's game, I thought, was average. He definitely adds something to the team, and he wasn't as completely barren creatively as he has been for most of the season. Also his defending was very good as usual - he was unlucky to get penalised for a couple of very good tackles after chasing back. But he still didn't do enough going forward, particularly taking on his fullback, despite a number of obvious opportunities to do so, for this to be called a good one from him.

 

[Tomuś]

The thing is, since when has the Chief been a massive biased Nani fan? Personally I don't there has been any bias in comparing the two at the weekend, Nani was better and that's why pretty much every poster on here is saying that. I'd argue that the main "bias" shown in this thread over the past few days was your post with that houlier. We know you adore Valencia and as I said, I think he had an alright game too, but to houlier someone for thinking Nani was better shows a massive bias on your part.

If I was that biased I wouldn't have accepted the mistake and stick to it (see?)

You may not notice that but it seems as if some people already prepare their posts before games, something along the 'Valencia once again shit, thanks God we have Nani'. I have no problem with calling Valencia's performance shit this season. I do that. What gets on my tits, is saying Nani's playing well currently. feck it, I even read Nani did more in his first game after coming back than Valencia's done all season!

 

[KM]

IMO He was pretty good in the first half but faded badly in the second half.

Some of his short passing in the one-two's were excellent but also thought his crossing was a bit off. Although that cross for RVP's header was excellent.

It's quite heartening to see him back in the frame though. He has been out for a long time and I do think we'll see him a big performance from him soon.

 

[Cina]

I haven't praised Valencia's performance once this season, and I've seen people praising Nani's after his come-back. feck me, surely you can see the difference.

Tomuś, you're rambling on about Nani-bias vs Valencia-bias and how fans of Nani just criticize Valencia yet I could pick an absolute shiteload of posts from you in the last few months comparing them both as players, and usually you're more flattering to one in particular.

Nani is better offensively for he can play all across the front formation to a reasonable extent and, as you said, has more in his locker. Two feet, can finish and cut in.

Valencia is twice the player defensively and can make the whole right wing his bitch even if playing at right-back, something many on here forgot or will to forget due to his shite form this season. When on song, he is one of the most consistent players I've seen and he didn't know what misplacing pass means till this season.

It's about whom you prefer, I just want them both on the pitch and in-form, something which hasn't happened very often since we bought Valencia.

EDIT And I'm wondering if you still have anything to put out of joint if we're going this route everytime Nani has had shite streak - this is Valencia's first since he's been here.

Hell, let's go further.

Are you a Valencia fanboi? You sure sound like one.

Yes, I dare to like him.

 

[Gaeilge]

The thing is, since when has the Chief been a massive biased Nani fan? Personally I don't there has been any bias in comparing the two at the weekend, Nani was better and that's why pretty much every poster on here is saying that. I'd argue that the main "bias" shown in this thread over the past few days was your post with that houlier. We know you adore Valencia and as I said, I think he had an alright game too, but to houlier someone for thinking Nani was better shows a massive bias on your part.

Nani was more productive than Tony the last day. It would appear at though Tony is lacking in confidence in a serious way. The full blown, pacey winger of years gone by is merely a shadow of himself recently. Saying that, Nani's final ball is disasterously inconsistent. This is not down to a lack of games or rust as the one-eyed bandits would pledge an oath on...he is just inconsistent. He always has been. Nomatter where he picks up the ball he is ubber confident of beating his man and usually does. Great flicks, tricks and skills are always on show. His short passing and 1 2's are exceptional. I am reminded of Andy Cole with Nani. Fantastic statistics but if you are really honest, could easily have amassed twice the numbers he has.

 

[I'm always right]

If I was that biased I wouldn't have accepted the mistake and stick to it (see?)

You may not notice that but it seems as if some people already prepare their posts before games, something along the 'Valencia once again shit, thanks God we have Nani'. I have no problem with calling Valencia's performance shit this season. I do that. What gets on my tits, is saying Nani's playing well currently. feck it, I even read Nani did more in his first game after coming back than Valencia's done all season!

That's just posters being ridiculously hyperbolic about Valencia's form this season.

I do think you have a point in that posters are now showing a bias against Valencia and calling him awful etc when he's actually had a perfectly alright game, it's similar to what many did with Evra last weekend it confuses the hell out of me. This has probably also led to more posters wanting to see Nani back in and around the team. However, my point was... saying Nani was better last weekend is not biased, it's just (imo of course), true.

 

[Tomuś]

Tomuś, you're rambling on about Nani-bias vs Valencia-bias and how fans of Nani just criticize Valencia yet I could pick an absolute shiteload of posts from you in the last few months comparing them both as players, and usually you're more flattering to one in particular. Hell, let's go further.

If the quotes you used show my Valencia's bias then I don't think we'll reach the conclusion.

 

[Gaeilge]

If the quotes you used show my Valencia's bias then I don't think we'll reach the conclusion.

There is nothing to actually be reached here. You are simply trying to convince the caf that black is white by motioning the glorious step back. Just give up and slowly migrate

 

[Rossa]

I'd want Nani on the left and Valencia on the right as they create a lot of space for our midfield players and strikers. Teams always double up or triple up on Valencia, and therefore he is quite valuable whichever way you look at it. So even if he makes a backpass to Carrick, Carrick can then pass it on to an unmarked man in the middle or shift to the left.

Nani has more in his locker and can go past both defenders, but he can be inconsistent and although he isn't woeful in defense, he isn't as good as Valencia there.

 

[Forevergiggs]

Nani on the left will be a terrible move. Let's not get overboard with Evra's form. He has been an asset in attack but his defensive position gives me chills each game. Evra would need protection and I bet a million dollars we would have Welbeck/Young/Rooney start on the left to give him protection.

 

[Rossa]

Nani on the left will be a terrible move. Let's not get overboard with Evra's form. He has been an asset in attack but his defensive position gives me chills each game. Evra would need protection and I bet a million dollars we would have Welbeck/Young/Rooney start on the left to give him protection.

Oh shut it with Evra's positioning. When he attacks do you want a clone of him to stay back in defense? If he attacks, it is the CM's job to cover for him! That's what Carrick does time and time again for Rafael, thus why fewer attacks go down our right side, but none of our left CMs have realized this. It was something Fletcher used to do, and Carrick did it one match (where he surely must have been cloned becaues I can swear there were two of him). Evra's defending has been good this season, and all stats show that he has been better than almost all other fullbacks!

Nani isn't as poor defensively as you would have it either. He is also more unpredictable on the left as he can go either way.

 

[I'm always right]

Gotta agree with everything Rossa has posted above.

 

[Forevergiggs]

Oh shut it with Evra's positioning. When he attacks do you want a clone of him to stay back in defense? If he attacks, it is the CM's job to cover for him! That's what Carrick does time and time again for Rafael, thus why fewer attacks go down our right side, but none of our left CMs have realized this. It was something Fletcher used to do, and Carrick did it one match (where he surely must have been cloned becaues I can swear there were two of him). Evra's defending has been good this season, and all stats show that he has been better than almost all other fullbacks!

Nani isn't as poor defensively as you would have it either. He is also more unpredictable on the left as he can go either way.

He hasn't been great one on one in defense and there are plenty of times he comes back jogging and leaves the defensive work for Young/Welbeck. Evra doesn't have the legs anymore to come back and position himself.

So, Carrick does it for Rafael but leaves Evra hanging? Carrick is a central midfielder in a two, not a right side or left side midfielder in a three as you are suggesting. We don't play with a left CM or a right CM. One of our CM's hang
backs and provides protection from counters whereas the other joins the attack. The reason the left side has looked more secure this season is because of the protection provided by Young/Welbeck this season.

Nani does a decent job tracking back not nearly as good as Valencia or Young. Most of his attempts are half-hearted and more often than not he allows the opposition players to cross at will. He also drifts inside and roams around, leaving Evra exposed.

There is no way Nani is starting on the left against Madrid.

Gotta agree with everything Rossa has posted above.

If they remake Clueless today, you are bang on to get Alicia Silverstone's role.

 

[Tomuś]

Oh shut it with Evra's positioning. When he attacks do you want a clone of him to stay back in defense? If he attacks, it is the CM's job to cover for him! That's what Carrick does time and time again for Rafael, thus why fewer attacks go down our right side, but none of our left CMs have realized this. It was something Fletcher used to do, and Carrick did it one match (where he surely must have been cloned becaues I can swear there were two of him). Evra's defending has been good this season, and all stats show that he has been better than almost all other fullbacks!

Nani isn't as poor defensively as you would have it either. He is also more unpredictable on the left as he can go either way.

Spot on. A good Nani is easily worth sacrificing a little bit of defensive duties at which Young excels. Our midfielders will have to put one hell of a defensive shift though. It looks like Carrick is more mobile and industrious as ever so that augurs well for the Madrid games.

 

[Tomuś]

He hasn't been great one on one in defense and there are plenty of times he comes back jogging and leaves the defensive work for Young/Welbeck. Evra doesn't have the legs anymore to come back and position himself.

So, Carrick does it for Rafael but leaves Evra hanging? Carrick is a central midfielder in a two, not a right side or left side midfielder in a three as you are suggesting. We don't play with a left CM or a right CM. One of our CM's hang
backs and provides protection from counters whereas the other joins the attack. The reason the left side has looked more secure this season is because of the protection provided by Young/Welbeck this season.

Nani does a decent job tracking back not nearly as good as Valencia or Young. Most of his attempts are half-hearted and more often than not he allows the opposition players to cross at will. He also drifts inside and roams around, leaving Evra exposed.

There is no way Nani is starting on the left against Madrid.

He is not half-hearted when it comes to defending. He is a hard worker who simply can't tackle but he does contribute his bit in that aspect. I've rarely seen him refusing to track back in big games. That's not his game and yes, Valencia/Young are much better than him at that, but he's not a lazy bastard who will stand there merely waiting for the ball.

 

[Cina]

If the quotes you used show my Valencia's bias then I don't think we'll reach the conclusion.

Yeah, explicitly saying you're a fanboy of him isn't enough really.

 

[PatrickP]

I thought he played well whilst at the game but everyone else I have spoke to since I got back has said he ws average at best.

I am biased though as I think he is a brilliant player and I really hate when the crowd get on his back

 

[I'm always right]

If they remake Clueless today, you are bang on to get Alicia Silverstone's role.

I'm a good looking fella to be fair, but not that good looking.

 

[Brophs]

I'd start Nani v Madrid every time, though that has something to do with the fact I don't rate Young nearly as highly as he and Valencia.

 

[Orton]

He hasn't been great one on one in defense and there are plenty of times he comes back jogging and leaves the defensive work for Young/Welbeck. Evra doesn't have the legs anymore to come back and position himself.

So, Carrick does it for Rafael but leaves Evra hanging? Carrick is a central midfielder in a two, not a right side or left side midfielder in a three as you are suggesting. We don't play with a left CM or a right CM. One of our CM's hang
backs and provides protection from counters whereas the other joins the attack. The reason the left side has looked more secure this season is because of the protection provided by Young/Welbeck this season.

Nani does a decent job tracking back not nearly as good as Valencia or Young. Most of his attempts are half-hearted and more often than not he allows the opposition players to cross at will. He also drifts inside and roams around, leaving Evra exposed.

There is no way Nani is starting on the left against Madrid.



If they remake Clueless today, you are bang on to get Alicia Silverstone's role.

Oh bloody hell, if we lose to Real Madrid it wont be because Nani doesn't defend as well as Valencia or Young. He tracks back more than enough for me, and offers more going forward. It's a no brainer. You can only play so many defensive minded players in a system if you want to win, and if we want to beat Real then we need some threat from the wings and right now Valencia doesn't offer much at all.

 

[PatrickP]

I'd start Nani v Madrid every time, though that has something to do with the fact I don't rate Young nearly as highly as he and Valencia.

I woul dhave Young on the left and Nani on the right

I thought Young was very effective the few games before his injury.

 

[Forevergiggs]

He is not half-hearted when it comes to defending. He is a hard worker who simply can't tackle but he does contribute his bit in that aspect. I've rarely seen him refusing to track back in big games. That's not his game and yes, Valencia/Young are much better than him at that, but he's not a lazy bastard who will stand there merely waiting for the ball.

I don't have any hate towards him. If you go check the "Beating Madrid" thread, I have him in my starting line-up on the right for the game . When on form, he is a tremendous asset but lets be honest that Nani is not very good at tracking back and doing his defensive work. To excuse him by saying that it's not his game is not correct, imo. Like Holloway said in one of his recent interviews, if it is good enough for Messi, the best player in the world, it is good enough for you.

 

[Cina]

I woul dhave Young on the left and Nani on the right

I thought Young was very effective the few games before his injury.

He can take a while to hit his stride after injuries though.

I reckon we'll see Valencia and Young anyway, maybe even Valencia and Welbeck, if Young isn't deemed fit enough. SAF is cautious in Europe and he'll prefer their defensive qualities to Nani's attacking qualities.

Besides, it wouldn't exactly feck things up, with RVP and Rooney on the pitch, goals will still come.

 

[Tomuś]

Yeah, explicitly saying you're a fanboy of him isn't enough really.

I said I like him. You see, I like all of our players - that's the difference. You would get a feeling I'm as much of Nani fanboi as I'm of Valencia's if you heard me in real life. Even here, I said many good things about Nani and the biggest problem I have is the one with unfair judgement, not with Nani himself. I was the same towards criticising Berba/Gibson/Evans etc in the past. I try to see good things in our players - not stick to the flaws ignoring everything else.

I thought you'd do better than constantly getting at the fact I dare to like Valencia.

 

[kouroux]

Messi hardly ever tracks back like he used to do when he was playing on the wing.One of the players who spends most of the time walking on the pitch

 

[Forevergiggs]

Messi hardly ever tracks back like he used to do when he was playing on the wing.One of the players who spends most of the time walking on the pitch

Where will Nani be playing?

 

[Tomuś]

I don't have any hate towards him. If you go check the "Beating Madrid" thread, I have him in my starting line-up on the right for the game . When on form, he is a tremendous asset but lets be honest that Nani is not very good at tracking back and doing his defensive work. To excuse him by saying that it's not his game is not correct, imo. Like Holloway said in one of his recent interviews, if it is good enough for Messi, the best player in the world, it is good enough for you.

I've never said you hated him, mate. Actually, you've put much better of an effort than some the brain-dead arse-licking here. Just don't agree with your point - that's all.

 

[Cina]

I said I like him. You see, I like all of our players - that's the difference. You would get a feeling I'm as much of Nani fanboi as I'm of Valencia's if you heard me in real life. Even here, I said many good things about Nani and the biggest problem I have is the one with unfair judgement, not with Nani himself. I was the same towards criticising Berba/Gibson/Evans etc in the past. I try to see good things in our players - not stick to the flaws ignoring everything else.

I thought you'd do better than constantly getting at the fact I dare to like Valencia.

Where is the unfair judgement coming from exactly?

Saying Nani had a better game than Valencia is hardly a damning statement of one over the other. If things were on the other foot and Valencia had the better game then the exact same comments would be arising only in reverse.

The whole thing about posters being biased towards one or the other and therefore trying their best to criticize one to make a point about the other being better is totally overblown on here. You get a few posters with every player who will do that but the majority don't, they judge based on how they played.

I haven't even made a comment on how Nani played this weekend because I know people will automatically think my "favouritism" is coming into play.

 

[PatrickP]

He can take a while to hit his stride after injuries though.

I reckon we'll see Valencia and Young anyway, maybe even Valencia and Welbeck, if Young isn't deemed fit enough. SAF is cautious in Europe and he'll prefer their defensive qualities to Nani's attacking qualities.

Besides, it wouldn't exactly feck things up, with RVP and Rooney on the pitch, goals will still come.

Fair point.

I think Nani has improved his tracking back from what I have seen in last couple of games. If Young isn't fit I would like to see Welbeck and Nani given a go in Madrid. With Rooney dropping in front of midfield i think that they can provide enough defensive support whilst being able to hit on the break.

valencia has been too ineffective on the break this season. He normally cuts it inside or rolls it back to Rafael which slows us down a lot. The breaks will be improtant in Madrid

 

[kouroux]

Where will Nani be playing?

On the wing obviously, I was just saying that what Holloway said about Messi working hard doesn't make sense anymore.Messi (on that aspect of things) is not an example for Nani

 

[londonredmaniac]

Was better on Saturday...linked up with Rooney well.

Was watching that Rooney 100 goals at Old Trafford thing and it's amazing how many times Nani is the one linking well with Rooney. Brilliant.

I can be one of his harshest critics at times...but I do think he is a quality footballer when he is playing with confidence.

Get his new deal signed. Hopefully by the end of the month the real Nani will be back and firing.

 

[manusteve]

For a club with history of great wingers, I'm concerned that the current group of Nani, Valencia and Young leave a lot to be desired.
So if we HAVE to play 4-4-2, then I think we need better wingers.
With Nani, clearly he polarises opinion, but shouldn't we just treat him on merit, viz. great skills but hasn't put it together consistently for a long time.

 

[Shrek]

For a club with history of great wingers, I'm concerned that the current group of Nani, Valencia and Young leave a lot to be desired.
So if we HAVE to play 4-4-2, then I think we need better wingers.
With Nani, clearly he polarises opinion, but shouldn't we just treat him on merit, viz. great skills but hasn't put it together consistently for a long time.

So who are these better wingers?