But that's what I'm asking. They're getting the players they want. Not settling for option B or C. Do they care that everyone thinks £50m on Walker is mad? Nope.
Manchester City 17/18 discussion | "If you're here for the Champions clap your hands" (#6505)
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
We've missed out on Alves who went to PSG and we're likely to miss out on Sanchez (possibly Bertrand too).
I don't really care about fees paid these days (being a City fan, how can I?), United can afford any fee because they earn it back in a few weeks. But I don't think paying over £100m in two separate deals to land Pogba and Lukaku is "on your own terms" at all.
I think you know Pogba cost 89 rising to 93, Lukaku cost 75 rising to 90. GBP.
I'm supposing they want him to stay that long or make the transition smoother for the next guy coming like with Barcelona, given his Ex Barcelona buddies are in charge. It's all still a big IF anyhow. And if it doesn't work out, tough!
No because Jose wins silverware, so there are no excuses needed.
So answer the first question. Can you see a difference between the 2 approaches this summer?
@roonster09
Walkers reported wages are around £120k, I've seen it as high as £130k and as low as £100k. We almost doubled the £65k he got at Spurs.
Word is we doubled the wages of Silva and Ederson but neither were on even £50k in the first place. The rumour with Silva is he was on £35k at Monaco and £75k at City.
Ederson is on around the same money.
Mendy I've not heard anything about wages but again I'd imagine he'll be getting close to 100k as he'll be pretty much getting 100% increase too.
Danilo I have no idea but he was only on £60k are Real so again I'd say he'll be costing no more than £120k.
There is no way we'll be shelling out much more than £500k on those wages.
With Toures pay cut only Silva, De Bruyne, Sterling and Aguero are over £150k at the club now and our wages seem to be around £100k for just about everyone else.
@antihenry - So what, we're still complying with FFP so be salty as you like my friend. Also United, Chelsea, Real, Bayern, Barca could all well afford it and United have for the last 3 or 4 years. Real seem to have completely abandoned the galactico transfer policy which is a choice (and because well they need very little strengthening). Chelsea have curbed their spending hugely but could easily afford it.
Barca spent over 100m last summer and took in barely 25 (they just bought poorly).
Bayern I believe have a rule they must always operate in the black and are probably the best managed club in the world.
United have pretty much matched us stride for stride.
The irony of a Chelsea fan whinging over money... its like 2003 to 2006 never happened. For all our spending you guys still have the most disproportionate amount of spending ever in a window from Roman second season.
@Bubz27 - I don't think there's a massive difference in approach. Both are targeting weak area's of their squads, both of us are probably having to overpay. Lindelof aside who given the current market is probably cheap at £31m. You'll strengthen your weak area's with Perisic eventually (although that will drag on by the looks of it) and probably a DM too I think. But it will probably cost a premium to bring them in, Something like Perisic and Matic for £100m combined. In the end though you'll get Jose's 4 targets.
I don't think he'd have a huge preference for Morata over Lukaku, Fabinho over Matic etc.. I think Jose just needs players of similar ability who can do the job he asks of them.
Just saw the news, looks like Guardiola has his fullbacks all sorted out then. I wonder if they'll be able to play to his vision now. I'd like to see how this plays out. This season is going to be even more competitive than the last one, I think.
I can't see any of Danilo, Walker or Mendy being able to play keep ball inverted fullbacks. I think this window shows Pep's vision has changed (slightly). We'll play in a similar manner but the fullbacks with probably play as out and out fullbacks (albeit very attacking) and the reason we went for pace above all, is how quickly they can get back to avoid the long ball in behind the fullback counters we got mullered with last season by Leicester, Everton etc..
We also started with a team that finished 7th and then 6th.
I don't believe that for sure. Even an average player gets more than that in PL and Delph earns more than that. There is no way player like Bernardo Silva will be on 75K per week.
You have to realise the fact that United is run like a company, whereas City is run like a private project by their owners. The way they spend cannot be compared to the way we spend.
And just as a clarification to City fans, I am not one of those who think that the Sheikhs investing in City makes them "plastic" or whatever word you use for it. I am more practical about success in modern times as the end justifies the means and was just stating a fact, that the modus operandi is different for the two clubs due to ownership. I stayed in the UAE for 15 years and I have experienced firsthand the ambition of the owners in transforming Dubai into what it is today, with ruthless efficiency - that ambition separates them from say, the Qataris for instance who are less efficient, you can expect them to put all their heart and soul into the City project if they have a certain vision. Their relentless zeal in things that they take up is sort of admirable (grudgingly conceded).
Of course he may be on a little more, but why would we pay £200k to a player whose wages were £35k. Why would he not take a 100% increase? The rumour is doubled wages which would be 70k, by that logic why would Sane take £80k, but he did.
Because this is not normal job where you will get 30-35% hike on your salary.
I don't know how much Sane is on but he was hardly proven player like Silva when City signed.
I didn't say he is on 200K but surely now lower than fecking Delph.
But it wasn't a 30-35% wage hike it was over 100% on his previous wage.
He may be on a tad more but I'd say it'll be well below 100k though, I guess we'll have to wait on a real leak or something to get the truth of it.
Delph came from Villa in a stupid drawn out transfer where he was coming, not coming, we needed an english player and lets face it, he's on twice the wage he deserves because of it. Our hand was forced with him. We are overpaying alot of average players but its something that we are working hard to rectify.
If you look at the entire list of players we are shipping out or have let go, its precisely because they are being paid too much. It's also why it will be hard to shift those last few.
There's no way he's going to walk into a City side knowing that they have money to burn and are already paying their players silly money just to be sitting on £75K. No chance!
Who are we paying silly money to these days. Last years signings all came with lesser wages and this seasons will be the same. Lets be honest here, he got a 110% wage boost or their abouts. Their are 4 players left at City over 150k and they are KDB, Aguero, David Silva and apparently a massively overpaid Sterling. Everyone else sits on around 100k, some on 110k some on 80ish.
All those average and stupidly overpaid have been or are currently being shown to the door.
Wage increase don't work on percentages in football. It's all relative and how much agent can squeeze and how many clubs are interested. If he was signed from some lower league teams like Alli was signed then yes, he would have earned lot less but from a CL semi finalist and French champions? No way.
For example Alli is on 50K (as per reports), do you think he will earn only 100K at any club if he ever leaves?
Alli signed that new contract for £50k 6 months ago perfectly winning to take a wage rise which still put him at half their top earners money.
So you think Alli will earn only 100K if he moves clubs?
Any links to Gimenez / Badstuber / De Vrij for City?
No but he was quite happy to take £50k while being one of the best players in the premier league. Alli is also a lot bigger name and more hyped than Silva and even then who knows what wage he'd accept.
So what is the minimum you would expect from PG this season??
The title (possible), the CL (unlikely) or the door. One of the three.
He has a half billion pound squad. He has his players in pretty much every position now.
Losing the CL final on pens and coming second in the league with 99 points or something would probably buy him another shot but thats unlikely.
The reality is he has to deliver and it has to be one of the big two trophies.
Agreed! PG and Wenger are really going to be up against it this season.
You expect him to win the title with no good, fit centre-backs or defensive midfielder?
Every club have one or the other weaknesses, if the perfect team is needed to win the league then there is no point paying so much for the manager.
It's reasonable to expect a challenge with a few weaknesses. Unreasonable to expect the whole thing with key weaknesses.
Fernandinho is a very good DM. Stones is a CB he bought for 50mil. In any case, given the way they've spent, it's Pep's decision to spend in other areas so far, not a lack of funds.
They spent 50 Million on a '"pep CB" Stones, they also have Kompany, Otamendi. There is a good chance they might not win it but this excuses of Pep doesn't have this player, that player is getting more and more every day.
Last time they won league they had washed up Demichelistheir CB, Chelsea won with Cahill and a fullback playing as CB.
It's all about organizing the defense and adapting too.
I agree. He has no excuses this season if he fails to deliver then he'll have no choice but to walk.
He has a squad worth half a billion, no squad is perfect (although Real come close), he's got the 3rd best defence in England when Kompany is fit. 4th best overall last season. He's adding £125m worth of fullbacks instead of using dads army. There is zero excuses now. Its his team.
Its his keepers Ederson, Bravo
His fullbacks Walker, danilo, Mendy
Of the CB's he's got Kompany, Otamendi one of whom is seen as the best CB in England while fit. Stones is his £50m CB.
He's got a front line that can consist of any from Aguero, Jesus, B Silva, D Silva, KDB, Sane, Sterling
The only place he's not got his players is holding midfield and even then he's got Fernandinho who is quite useful, Yaya who is very good against weaker teams and his own signing in Gundogan.
--------------------Ederson---------------------
Walker-----Kompany---------Stones-------Mendy (£150m spent by Pep)
-------------------Gundogan--------------------
--------------KDB-----------SilvaD--------------
B Silva-------------------------------------Sane
---------------------Aguero---------------------
With a bench of - Yaya, Bravo, Fernandinho, Danilo, Jesus, Sterling, Otamendi
Not winning the league with that 18 as his first choice squad would be a failure.
Fernandinho's decent, not on his 13/14 level and has a terrible tendency to give away bad fouls, imo. Stones was expensive, definitely, but he still just turned 23 two months ago. There's no way to know whether City have actually been chasing defensive targets and coming up short, bearing in mind that they need more quality in defence so they'd have been after more difficult pursuits.
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Ederson's young and may well need a season to adjust, Stones is 23, Walker and Mendy (also 23) are both coming in to play some weird inverted full back positions that will seriously put pressure on their composure and competency on the ball, rather than play to their lung-busting strengths. Gundogan and Kompany likely won't stay fit for the whole season either. Guardiola's spent a lot of money, but not necessarily with a clear view to succeeding immediately.
City haven't really been in the picture for a bit but I'd be more than a little surprised if the fans were generally feeling impatient. I expect Guardiola to challenge this season, definitely, but he definitely shouldn't 'walk' if he comes up short.
That is a solid squad on paper provided he can keep Kompany fit, it should be gunning for the title
Agreed. There is still two foreign spots in the squad for next year though and I wouldn't be surprised to see the club fill them. CB cover and DM, perhaps? Impossible to say.
Sans Stones, that's a frighteningly good team. If you don't win the league this season, serious questions have to be asked about Pep. Prior managers have been sacked for less.
Mourinho had less time also
I like the fact he loves experimenting. It's always nice to analyze his tactics. What i can't stand is that he is trying to buy his way to the title. He shows he can't play his favourite football without certain players.Haha, just knew it.Anyway, he's got a self righteous side of his, i'm not a fan, but i appreciate having someone with his approach to the game in the league. For me, it would be boring if we all would play the same way, an issue i have with the Bundesliga. So, a sacking would leave the league a bit short, but fingers crossed that they don't win a thing next season.
Have you already got your hopes up for next season? I think Lacazette will bang in a few, but there're still rumours that your team might have difficulties holding on to the Ox.
As i said yesterday, we need to focus on the Europa League and domestic cups. The league is just too much for us. Think Lacazette will need some time to adapt.
Really dunno if its' that wrong to buy your way to the title. Neither is it wrong to want players who suit your style of play. Half of being a good manager is to have the keen insight to buy good players and not duds. Its' not likely that a club will win the title with 11 kids from the academy starting every game.
If given a choice between a manager who develops youth well vs a manager who can buy well, I'd choose the latter, although ideally it would be nice to have both characteristics in one. But buying well is more important, as Mourinho did last summer. Its' key to a successful team.
In fact, this is the first time Guardiola has not stepped into a team that is ready-made for him. If he wins things with a squad that he's built by buying wisely, I suppose he deserves credit. If he fails, it will obviously mean he is a poor manager as it will only be tactics that would let him down despite buying so many good players.