Manchester United vs. West Ham United

Lynk said:
Why do people care about going forward so much? The first priority of a right back is defense. O'Shea is a far better defender and is a greater asset at set pieces due to his height.
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Sure.

Against Chelsea, or Stoke which has some big lads.

Hammers aren't going to threaten us with height, or even in terms of offense.

We are playing at home, and our fullbacks will have plenty of opportunities to get forward. Rafael is the future, so i just think he really should have got a game today. No worries though. His time will surely come.
 
Lynk said:
Why do people care about going forward so much? The first priority of a right back is defense. O'Shea is a far better defender and is a greater asset at set pieces due to his height.
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Why? Because a careless pass upfront, can quickly turn into a goal against us. It also stops any build up play we were trying to attack with. It is important that all defenders should improve their ball distribution in the modern game.
 
Based on some of the comments in this thread you would think that John O'Shea was the only reason we dropped points at Fulham. The whole team played poorly, we don't need a scapegoat.

I'm pretty happy with that line-up to be honest. Should be more than enough firepower out there to get the result. Hopefully it's comfortable enough that we can give Hernandez a run out near the end and see if he can get his first goal in the league. We shouldn't be dropping points at home to this lot though.
 
Alright, scratch hate. But there's a great disappointment here, which I don't seem to remember from last year. He's solid, and while we do have our young Rafael we shouldn't be moaning in that matter, like:

Please No John O'Shea at right back...please! i cant put myself through another 90 minutes of hopeless ball control, random off target 'crosses' launched into no mans land and general wankness any time hes on the ball, that display at Fulham last week was embaressing, his second touch is a tackle every bloody week.

Rather focus on the disappointment of Rafael not starting. And I'm not just reacting to this thread, there were similar reactions last week.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Now that's just not true, is it?
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It's not true. O'shea is pretty well rounded and the fact he has been so versatile is why he's lasted so long. But the fact is, he stands out at nothing in particular. He's the definition of a utility player, and a hassle free player that every club needs.

He definitely has his place in the team, and against some teams he should make the first team. But this is west ham, at home. We don't need a make shift righback who has no eye for the pass, limited dribbling, limited pace and limited attacking instincts.

That's not a crack at O'shea. It's just a fair assessment of his talent.
 
championo said:
Why? Because a careless pass upfront, can quickly turn into a goal against us. It also stops any build up play we were trying to attack with. It is important that all defenders should improve their ball distribution in the modern game.
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So can the dodgy positional sense Rafael has.
 
Hellboy said:
He offers us nothing in a home game like this I mean. No threat from the opposition whatsoever, we need someone that can attack.
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Aye, because we'll be completely toothless without an attacking right back. Against West Ham. At home.

We're bound to score. I just want to see a clean sheet. For a change.
 
Lynk said:
So can the dodgy positional sense Rafael has.
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Which is why he should get his chances to improve it against relatively weak opposition. Rafael is the future of the club, he's going to be here in 5 years (hopefully). O'shea won't.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Aye, because we'll be completely toothless without an attacking right back. Against West Ham. At home.

We're bound to score. I just want to see a clean sheet. For a change.
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So the implication is that if Rafael plays we conceed? You do the boy a disservice. I personally think Evans in current form is more of a liability then Rafael who plays in a less defensively critical position (especially when you consider West Ham have no genuine wingers), but do have a pacey target striker.

Besides which. You've missed the point of why people want Rafael to start.

It's not because O'shea isn't good enough.

It's that this is an ideal game to get Rafael's season started.
 
Oh my god, people actually think they know more about football than Sir Alex Ferguson.
 
Please can someone PM a decent stream that I can watch in my browser (firefox)?
 
It's good enough to argue why we should keep O'Shea, but for the love of God.. for all the reasons, this is a game Rafael should start. But I'm not angry, O'Shea is a decent defender and I hope he does well. In Fergie we trust, maybe there's something we don't know about.
 
TonyMontana said:
Oh my god, people actually think they know more about football than Sir Alex Ferguson.
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OMG. Football fans questioning the managers lineup?

This is unheard off.

Cease all debate. Switch to drone mode...

SAF is GOD. SAF is GOD. SAF is GOD.

PS. Nobody has said they know more then SAF. Some are just saying they would have liked to see Rafael start. There is a difference. See if you can spot it.
 
Devilton said:
Which is why he should get his chances to improve it against relatively weak opposition. Rafael is the future of the club, he's going to be here in 5 years (hopefully). O'shea won't.
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Personally, if the likes of Brown and Neville can stay fit for a full season, and O'Shea to a lesser extent, then Rafael could be loaned out to get some playing time. Rather him improve with another club and cost them goals while maturing than making rash decisions while United are chasing trophies.
 
I have a question for those who will watch it via ESPN asia, who will commentate the game ? Will it be their own people or those in England (sorry if my question is not that clear) ?
 
Pretty much every time Fergie plays the formation/team everyone is crying for, it never works as well as we expect/hope.
 
Devilton said:
OMG. Football fans questioning the managers formation?

This is unheard off.

Cease all debate. Switch to drone mode...

SAF is GOD. SAF is GOD. SAF is GOD.
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Yeah it's one thing debating the formation and line up of the 2009 champions league final but it's another to criticize him for picking our best right back in a game against West Ham. What next? Why aren't we arguing about Smalling getting a game because he is "yung n lernin"? Shouldn't we be mentioning Evans or Vidic who had poor games last weekend?
 
I hope Evra gets a goal or a stunning performance, he needs a little pick-me-up after the WC.
 
MrMarcello said:
Personally, if the likes of Brown and Neville can stay fit for a full season, and O'Shea to a lesser extent, then Rafael could be loaned out to get some playing time. Rather him improve with another club and cost them goals while maturing than making rash decisions while United are chasing trophies.
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Loan deals rarely benefit a player, so i personally wouldn't want to see that happening to a player who has already shown a great deal of promise.

It's fine with someone like Diouf who was on the fringes, or Welbeck who also would have had a tough time getting games. But Rafael plays in a position where the other alternatives are either very old, very injury prone, or both.

It would be folly to send him out and then find out Nev has gone down to an injury and Wes is out for 3 months with yet another of his perennial problems.
 
Lynk said:
Yeah it's one thing debating the formation and line up of the 2009 champions league final but it's another to criticize him for picking our best right back in a game against West Ham. What next? Why aren't we arguing about Smalling getting a game because he is "yung n lernin"? Shouldn't we be mentioning Evans or Vidic who had poor games last weekend?
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Well done. Good job equating Rafael who was recently called to the Brazil squad with Smalling. Excellent...debate won. No need to continue.
 
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