The world has moved on.
Politics at Westminster | BREAKING: UKIP
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
The world has moved on.
We are going backwards, money is being sucked upwards, the majority are getting poorer
It is called a devaluation after a generation of living beyond our means, borrowing unbelievable amounts of money on low interest rates whilst Chinese produced goods kept inflation at record low levels.
It is called another cyclical capitalist feck-up being paid for by the workers.
This is true, but there's no reason why wealth can't be redistributed in a capitalist system to make up for the unfairness of the markets. Old style socialism isn't the answer, we just need a better form of capitalism.
I don't think that explains a growing wealth gap. Even when GDP was increasing during the good times, the wealth gap was growing as incomes were effectively stagnant.
feck off - capitalism isn't about social justice it's about exploitation. We could do with some old-style socialism vintage 1945-50.
It's a nice thought, but the idea that Britain can go back to that - while the rest of the world retains the modern capitalist system - and remain prosperous is a bit far-fetched. In fact, it's just not possible. The only way the kind of socialism you want can work is if there is a global change of the system, not just a British one. It would need to be gradual, as well.
Government spending to support other Governments spending, hardly the capitalist dream
The point is that the uber-capitalist economy of the United States ploughed the modern equivalent of hundreds of billions of dollars into Europe in the years after the second world war, that made Europe's socialist policies more viable - that it required huge injections of outside wealth to get it going.
Without the government investment european economies would have been in the shit for years, the private sector would not have stepped up. Oh and your uber capitalist economy has a coporate tax rate higher then most nations in the world
We're talking about the forties here, not now.
And their corporate tax rate is irrelevant, what is relevant is tax revenue as a percentage of GDP.
The 40's, massive debts, devastated economies and what rescued us was government spending.
I find it amusing how you are twisting the facts that socialism in Europe after the war was made possible due to a rich capitalist country handing out money.
If the Americans decided to spend their money on something else but give Britain about $8 billion worth of assistance after the Second World War then we would never have been able to create the National Health Service - therefore you can thank American capitalism for making it possible.
It wasn't American capitalism that made it possible, the American private sector didn't fund it, the American government did.
This isn't entirely true to be honest. Marshall Aid didn't come in until a few years after the end of the war, and then it had restrictions on what it could be spent on. Much of it would go on areas like re-building damaged property, as this allowed a lot of the American funds to be re-patriated back to America through importing their materials.
You could argue that Marshall Aid being used on these areas freed up our own spending for other areas, but you also have to note key changes such as the introduction of National Insurance payments, which kick started and has maintained areas like the NHS.
Obviously many of these areas are outdated now, but Labour should take a look at its history, the successes of Attlee's government (I know you disagree with this, but you never responded to my post on that a few weeks ago) and try to draw some value from it. You can temper economic development with social reforms and they need to build their policies with that in mind.
Give Queen a new royal yacht for diamond jubilee, says Michael Gove | UK news | The Guardian
These people are completely mental.
Absolutely pathetic.
Tasteless idea. I like the Queen and am looking forward to the Jubilee, but any money spent should be on the celebrations through which all the country can benefit, not on unnecessary 'presents'.
Unlucky Team Boris, i'd call this an unstopable Ace
Nope, it was solidarity that got Europe through it.
An unfashionable concept these days, but for all those without a home or something to eat, their next-door neighbors came through for them. Lending building material or groceries, ask any old timer from that era and they'll talk about the community and camaraderie they felt during and after WWII
Whatever happened as far as government/private spending in the aftermath is historically still disputed.
Not mutually exclusive though, are they? In this instance, government spending and solidarity went hand in hand.
Epic troll is epic
Don't expect the same thing again.
It shouldn't be mutually exclusive, but in hindsight isn't it funny how the government's benevolence maintained a social status quo?
It's a different issue I know, my point here is that I find it strange to differentiate between state and private capital.
Communism wasn't in vogue until the later 60's, even Cuba under Castro were pragmatic regarding market powers if it suited their needs.
Pragmatism set in among Europe's leaders as soon as Adolf's corpse hit the deck.
It is strange because all wealth is generated by workers not by capitalist drones.
The need for external aid may have had something to do with the brutal 6 year war that had just been raged across the whole continent, claiming 50 million lives, gutting Europe's most powerful economies and destroying some of its great cities.
And building markets for your products and keeping Europe from going commie-bastard Red.
Exactly. And I will just say that simply increasing your overall gdp or even gdp/capita is not necessarily needed to improve social justice, education or healthcare. Look at Kerala as an example.
Jesus Christ. A £60m yacht... for the Queen... in the middle of an (unnecessary and destructive) austerity drive.
If Armando Ianucci had written that I'd have said, "Bollocks, that's just not credible".
If Armando Ianucci had written that I'd have said, "Bollocks, that's just not credible".
What do you mean by status quo? It's an interesting point, because in many ways that was a time of social revolution here in the UK with the first proper left-leaning government the country had ever had. Yet in America and other places it was certainly a socially regressive period in many ways.
Pragmatism did indeed set in, but it had to really. The country had been destroyed physically in a way it never was during WW1 (which claimed more British lives but left infrastructure intact). Very skilled economic management was required to maintain inflation and handle huge surges in demand, had we had a less competent mind than Keynes offering guidance, it could well have been a very different story.
The rich have no shame... is that not yet apparent?
But politically... is there any better way to say, "If you're not from the tiny constituency we serve, we could not give a flying feck what you think"?
The diamond jubilee must not be overshadowed by the Olympics... 
How is this jubilee an achievement anyway? Congratulations for not dying?
How is this jubilee an achievement anyway? Congratulations for not dying?
Long to reign over us...
That's been said repeatedly for years but (amazingly to me) no one takes much notice.
A fecking yacht. For the fecking queen.
I'm going to have to retire to my bedroom.
I'm going to have to retire to my bedroom.
By the US? ie the Marshall Plan?
He even uses the phrase "perhaps because of the austere times". He wants the country to buy the Queen a new yacht, because public services are being cut and because people are losing their jobs. The man's in charge of the country's education policy, and he appears to have the logical faculties of an apple.
I can't really see her getting much use out of a yacht.