the revisionism with Rooney is just so strong. In 2013/14 we'd have finished 12th without Rooney.
Rooney Contract Haggling / Transfer Requests Revisited
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Yes.
Plus the revisionism about Ronaldo. He acted like a cnut throughout the transfer window right after we won the CL.
I don't think he acted like a cnut and nor did Rooney. In fact, this is something almost every top professional player does. People need to understand more than football this is their jobs. Everyone wants to get the best deal they can. When there is millions of dollars involved you can't be crying when players act the way they act for better deals.
I have nothing against players renegotiating for better contracts in any way they want to and fans need to get over themselves. Like I said, you can love a club all you want but at the end of the day it's all business. The only time I'd say a player is being a cnut is if they pulled their stunt right before a champions league final or something.
The biggest turn off for me being the part where he questioned the clubs ambition and managers desire to win. There can be no coming back from that in terms of losing respect. Once Rooney leaves this club, he would quickly fade from active memory.
Rooney has not done any worse than
1. Ronaldo who left with some comments that arent exactly forgettable. Now he remembers about how much he misses the club whenever he needs a new contract
2. Vidic who jumped ship when Moyes was in charge. He was a captain and he signed a precontract with Inter leaving like a coward instead of a club captain
3. Roy Keane who in 1999 or 2000 stalled on a contract and had threatened to leave because he didnt get what he wanted in terms of salary
I cant believe how these people are seen as legends for doing worse stuff and at times leaving and Rooney is villified for staying after doing similar stuff
Going by our financial deals around the time, I wouldnt be surprised if like Keane Rooney was offered a lowball salary. Which would have upset anyone given what Tevez made at City and Rooney was a better player than Tevez. And he did a Keane and got the salary he wants. For all his brilliance, we were also measly under SAF. I also had thought we were not ambitious enough back then when City was signing players irrespective of the amount and we were haggling for benzema and the likes. Of course Rooney did a lot of things that may be a bit disrespectful but its modern football. Someone as irrelevant as Theo Walcott did it because he didnt get the salary. Neymar did it for Barca. Even Messi did it multiple times.
As to the Rooney deal in 2013, I was glad when he signed. That and Januzaj signing a contract was probably the only good things under moyes. He was also our best outfield player that season and was the player who carried us that season.
1. Ronaldo who left with some comments that arent exactly forgettable. Now he remembers about how much he misses the club whenever he needs a new contract
2. Vidic who jumped ship when Moyes was in charge. He was a captain and he signed a precontract with Inter leaving like a coward instead of a club captain
3. Roy Keane who in 1999 or 2000 stalled on a contract and had threatened to leave because he didnt get what he wanted in terms of salary
I cant believe how these people are seen as legends for doing worse stuff and at times leaving and Rooney is villified for staying after doing similar stuff
Going by our financial deals around the time, I wouldnt be surprised if like Keane Rooney was offered a lowball salary. Which would have upset anyone given what Tevez made at City and Rooney was a better player than Tevez. And he did a Keane and got the salary he wants. For all his brilliance, we were also measly under SAF. I also had thought we were not ambitious enough back then when City was signing players irrespective of the amount and we were haggling for benzema and the likes. Of course Rooney did a lot of things that may be a bit disrespectful but its modern football. Someone as irrelevant as Theo Walcott did it because he didnt get the salary. Neymar did it for Barca. Even Messi did it multiple times.
As to the Rooney deal in 2013, I was glad when he signed. That and Januzaj signing a contract was probably the only good things under moyes. He was also our best outfield player that season and was the player who carried us that season.
He ruined his relationship with the fans the moment he asked to leave the club. His name has never been sung the same at Old Trafford since that day. Before then it was sung with regularity throughout games just cause he was on the field and even when he wasn't. He was an icon, almost the heartbeat of the club for a few seasons. He now has to do something on the pitch in order to get his song sung. That says it a lot to me in terms of what the match going fans think. Add to that his regression over the last 4/5 years and you can understand why fans get on his back.
He should go down as a club legend especially given that he will probably end up the clubs all time leading goal scorer but for many, including myself, he won't.
He should go down as a club legend especially given that he will probably end up the clubs all time leading goal scorer but for many, including myself, he won't.
Love him or hate him. He deserves every penny he makes or can get during his short career.
People go to school and build careers to last them a lifetime, even if you are not at the top of your field you get paid enough to have a somewhat comfy life. Footballers put all their eggs in one basket to work at the top max age 34..and those that can't ask where they end up. It's a lottery and will not begrudge him because a bad injury at 17 could have derailed his whole life.
I have never thought him a great individual player but that's my opinion. On the other hand he is the highest profile British player in the league and highest earner or negotiating to be is befitting of his standing.
People go to school and build careers to last them a lifetime, even if you are not at the top of your field you get paid enough to have a somewhat comfy life. Footballers put all their eggs in one basket to work at the top max age 34..and those that can't ask where they end up. It's a lottery and will not begrudge him because a bad injury at 17 could have derailed his whole life.
I have never thought him a great individual player but that's my opinion. On the other hand he is the highest profile British player in the league and highest earner or negotiating to be is befitting of his standing.
Ronaldo is better looking than Rooney. I am not being flip at all: unfortunately, this matters in how we judge people. Rooney looks like a baddy and hasn't any charisma to take the edge off.
this is a 2 way street then, players need to accept criticism and be rightly accountable for their performances. And not expect unwavered support even if they are 'legends'
Pretty simple.
Ronaldo became one of the best players in the world. Who doesn't like to be associated with the best.
SAF absolutely loved Ronaldo and he loves him back. One more reason to think Ronaldo as our legend..
Ronaldo was fantastic for us but I will never consider him as an United legend. And its pretty strange to consider him a legend and Rooney not.
Rooney hate makes some easily forget that he did something for the club and was pretty good for us not to mention instrumental in some titles and so on.
Rooney hate makes some easily forget that he did something for the club and was pretty good for us not to mention instrumental in some titles and so on.
As long as the criticism is directed at his poor performance, it is fine.
Denying Rooney's contribution to the club is a big fad, calling him names, throwing the wages argument in every argument is uncalled for.
Put an old jacket on Rooney he becomes a tramp, put the same jacket on Ronaldo he becomes trend setter.
with hindsight he was right in some regards
after 2009 Fergie discovered the term value.....instead of challenging Barca and Europe's best we took a few steps back doing just enough to challenge for the title
with even a couple of marquee signings we would have won the league those years we lost by a point to Chelsea and on goal difference to City
still i accept the point that he shouldn't have gone public with that ambition comment
Rooney definitely had a point then. Valencia may have been a good signing but we took out Tevez and Ronaldo and replaced them with Obertan, Valencia and Owen. It's a testament to how good Fergie is that we continued to challenge but we should have done far better with the Ronaldo money. Maybe if we'd bought better then the 3 years post Fergie wouldn't be such a struggle.
Local champion then?
I think he would. Chelsea aren't Liverpool.
SAF didn't like backstabbers and Rooney was at the very beginning of his decline. He also bought Kagawa and RVP who were meant to do Rooney's job
Haha.. Kinda...
It's tame, he was getting the best deal for himself. It's just that he is such a high profile player that the MIB got involved and the media blew it up.
The MIB door-stabbing his house.. what thugs. No need for that.. it's just a fecking game !
He has been worth every penny we have paid him, a great lad and a great career.
The MIB door-stabbing his house.. what thugs. No need for that.. it's just a fecking game !
He has been worth every penny we have paid him, a great lad and a great career.
How are some posters still confused about what Ronaldo and Rooney did.
Ronaldo ACTUALLY WANTED leave. As is the right of every player. In addition if you sign a Latin player there should be no surprise that one day they'll want to join one of the Spanish giants.
Rooney didn't want to leave. He just threatened to leave in order to get what he wanted. Be it more money or first team guarantees.
It's such a simple but important difference.
Ronaldo ACTUALLY WANTED leave. As is the right of every player. In addition if you sign a Latin player there should be no surprise that one day they'll want to join one of the Spanish giants.
Rooney didn't want to leave. He just threatened to leave in order to get what he wanted. Be it more money or first team guarantees.
It's such a simple but important difference.
If we did sell Rooney after SAF's retirement, and assuming our subsequent seasons ended as badly as they did (or even if we finished 4th all three seasons), would we be sitting here blaming ourselves for selling him?
He's unlikely to have pulled up any trees if he was indeed transferred. And that's assuming we'd have done badly without him, which is quite debatable really.
Fergie's comments at his retirement speech were just him being bitter and throwing Rooney under a bus if you ask me.
You only have to read Fergie's last book to see how petty he can be when he feels slighted.
He always seemed to get rid of big names because of personal differences or personality issues rather than because of ability.
You only have to read Fergie's last book to see how petty he can be when he feels slighted.
He always seemed to get rid of big names because of personal differences or personality issues rather than because of ability.
So one wanted to fulfill his footballing ambitions while the other was just a mercenary that decided to demean the manager, the club and teammates for more money? That's pretty simple!
Lets not pretend that players are so naive. They know that when the club doesn't want them, often at the opinion of a manager who will only be there a short time, they will be tossed aside.
Yeah exactly. Well I wouldn't call him a mercenary but then I'm not particularly bothered by this side of things. Can't believe seven years on posters are still comparing the two scenarios.
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Aww what! Why am I credited as the OP and infracted when I was replying to Stevoc! ._. Even the OP says for what it's worth stevoc! There was a couple of pages of discussion well before I posted. Stinger.
Actually when I watched the season review not long back I noticed in the first few games how subdued and po'd Ronaldo looked. By mid season he was flying and back to his usual self. I think it was made quite obvious he wanted to go and SAF said one more year and it took him a couple of months to break out of the funk.
Keane would have earned double if he'd left the club, rightly so he wanted to be paid somewhere near his worth. He was one of the best players in thee world and was miles off earning what top players were earning. Rooney on the other hand was always a huge earner.
No wonder we were hopeless under Moyes if that is your definition of carrying a team. The team was set up to benefit him and it shouldn't have been, the Rooney of 2 years previously would have scored a lot more goals in those circumstances.
He earned well but again he would have received a lot more had he left in 2010. Around the time he was the most recognised footballer (even was on the cover of FIFA since 2007 or so. And was also an excellent striker/no.10. It's not any wonder that we later gave him what he wanted.
He definitely carried us. I don't blame him for the incompetence shown by our defenders and midfielders. We had sub par players everywhere except GK and RvP/Rooney. Had Rooney been sold we would have been out of top 10 as the way Moyes was going he would have replaced him with jelavic or something
Lol what?
Instead of 12th we finished 7th...after being champions. Everyone lets give a big round of applause for Wayne Rooney! Context bro, context and Rooney was still poor that season compared to other strikers in Europe (just a bit more effective than others in the United team).
Bizarre compliment that is.
Was going to post something similar but didn't have the energy for an argument. Rooney saved us from finishing 12th by helping us finish 7th. What an achievement.
Sure, but that's what we know now, after the fact. What I meant is if it happened, you can bet that the media would blast the club for selling him every time he had a half-decent game..."Oh, look at United, without Rooney, they have to settle for fourth, blah blah blah".
If he manages to score 5 goals after he leaves (which I believe he is still capable of in a single season), then you are looking at a news story like that every two months. It would be insufferable.
I find it a total myth that Rooney was 'good' that season. He was awful at times.
Hell, he wouldn't even bother listening to the man who sorted out his 8 year £900,000/hour contract:
Hell, he wouldn't even bother listening to the man who sorted out his 8 year £900,000/hour contract:
So would you have preferred finishing 12th than 7th?
It's about the same result and feeling of 'what the feck has happened here...'
I assume you were delighted with Moyes' triumphant league finish? Against all the odds we finished inside the top ...8.
Anyways the thread was about Rooney being criticized way too much for asking for an out rather than a discussion on Rooney's form. I think the general consensus was he has been on a decline (perhaps way faster than anyone could have imagined) in past 3 years.
No. But at least I am not criticizing Rooney for turning up in a few matches when most of the squad went missing almost always.
So did Van Persie. Hell even Hernandez was a match winner just as many times. It's a myth Rooney was a head above the rest.
Carried us to what? It was our worst season in well over 20 years. To carry us you are alluding that we achieved something and we didn't.
The quote which you picked up just says, we would have been in a worse position if not for Rooney. Does not really say that he was the "only" one to contribute.
Moyes season was a disaster. Players were terribly demotivated. Many seems to have lost the interest to turn up. And in such a squad, I dont see any reason to be dismissive of any small contributions any individual made.