Shinji Kagawa

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Mad Winger said:
There were SO many ways of including Kagawa into that lineup:

1. Let him play behind the striker and bench either Rooney or RVP. The latter because he's not really been that good this season, and the former because he keeps losing the ball and hasn't scored a goal from open play since the opening game against Swansea.
2. Let him play on the left instead of Januzaj. The kid had an awesome game, but let's not kid ourselves: he played way above expectation, and any sane manager would have played Kagawa ahead of him. It was a gamble that payed off. Hindsight is a bitch.
3. But let's say Januzaj was so impressive in training that he had to play. Moyes could still have played him on the right, and Kagawa on the left(or the other way around).

There always seems to be a reason not to play Kagawa. Weird that Fergie didn't see the same reasons last season, when Kagawa started roughly 75% of the time he wasn't injured. Did the inclusion of Januzaj really stir things up that much?
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Are you on a WUM?

RVP is in poor form, but he's still done a feck load more than Kagawa has done so far. Before yesterday's game, Rooney was on a run of some top class performances. Oh and that 'kid' was man of the match and scored two top class goals.

You seem to love pointing out every players shortcomings but Kagawa's. Very strange.
 
Anyone else find that Mad Winger's posts are forcing them to go against Kagawa? I love Kagawa, but his posts make you want/need to criticise Kagawa.
 
Brwned said:
It's not a personal attack it's a simple observation. It's like saying I spend too much time on an internet forum. That's not an attack at all. Reading one of your posts about Kagawa is like listening to my little cousins' conversations about One Direction. It's bizarre how emotional you get over someone that isn't even aware of your existence and is getting paid millions for this terrible tragedy he has to endure.
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That's how you choose to interpret it. I can play that game to. For instance: I think you interpret my posts this way because you feel insulted when I write that it's retarded that Kagawa doesn't play. You're personally not that fond of Kagawa as a player, so you hate to see so many people writing good things about him.

Wow, that was fun actually! I can see why you like doing that:wenger:

I couldn't really give more of a shit about Kagawa as a person. I want him to play because I think that's best for the team. That's the "mystery" behind my posts! I want us to play better football, and I honestly believe that Kagawa is the key to solve that problem. So be that he's my favorite player. That has very little to do with this! Had we signed Mata instead of Kagawa, then you'd see me in the Mata thread instead. I don't think Rooney should play as a no.10 if there are players like Kagawa in the squad.
 
Mad Winger said:
There were SO many ways of including Kagawa into that lineup:

1. Let him play behind the striker and bench either Rooney or RVP. The latter because he's not really been that good this season, and the former because he keeps losing the ball and hasn't scored a goal from open play since the opening game against Swansea.
2. Let him play on the left instead of Januzaj. The kid had an awesome game, but let's not kid ourselves: he played way above expectation, and any sane manager would have played Kagawa ahead of him. It was a gamble that payed off. Hindsight is a bitch.
3. But let's say Januzaj was so impressive in training that he had to play. Moyes could still have played him on the right, and Kagawa on the left(or the other way around).

There always seems to be a reason not to play Kagawa. Weird that Fergie didn't see the same reasons last season, when Kagawa started roughly 75% of the time he wasn't injured. Did the inclusion of Januzaj really stir things up that much?
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:wenger:
 
OK, I give up... An 18 year old who's proved nothing except for a decent 20 minutes against C.Palace at home when they're down to 10 men and we're chasing a goal, clearly is a much better choice on paper than Kagawa. It's not a gamble at all, even though pundits all over the world wrote so.

I know that he played an awesome game! Did you miss that part, or did you ignore it for the hell of it? My point is: no one in their right mind would have put their money on Januzaj winning the game for us, coming back from 0-1 by scoring two goals. That's why the whole thing was so fecking sensational. Had it been Rooney or RVP, it would hardly have been a story.
 
He played better against West Brom than Kagawa, hence he got the nod. It was more the "hindsight is a bitch".
 
Cina said:
Your location is dedicated to Kagawa.

Who does that?
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People who like winding "haters" up. If I'm gonna be the Kagawa fanboy of the forum, then I'm gonna play that role for what it's worth. In reaility though, I'm just a fan of good football. feck me for wanting the club I support to play better.
 
You are the only one that will disagree. That's the point.
 
Every time Kagawa has played this season hes been average to poor, Janujaz was better on the occasions he has played so it makes sense. I think your obsession with Kagawa is purely based on Dortmund, at some point you have to realise he may not be that player at United. I would give Adnan more chances now, he looks interested and hungry.
 
Mad Winger said:
People who like winding "haters" up. If I'm gonna be the Kagawa fanboy of the forum, then I'm gonna play that role for what it's worth. In reaility though, I'm just a fan of good football. feck me for wanting the club I support to play better.
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Yeah but you realize you're turning into a joke over it, right? I mean, nobody takes your posts seriously about him now, whenever I see a post from you in this thread (or the many others you seem to like bringing him up in in a not so subtle fashion) I automatically think it's going to be some biased nonsense.
 
Cina said:
Yeah but you realize you're turning into a joke over it, right? I mean, nobody takes your posts seriously about him now, whenever I see a post from you in this thread (or the many others you seem to like bringing him up in in a not so subtle fashion) I automatically think it's going to be some biased nonsense.
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I'm way past the point where I care about what a bunch of strangers online think about me. I'm merely trying to convey the message that in order to play better football we need a player like Kagawa to play. Since we don't have any other similar players, all attention naturally falls on him. It sucks because it makes it all sound fanboyish, but I still think that intelligent posters will be able to see what I'm actually trying to convey. This is not an election where I need to care about the "votes" of idiots, anyways. As long as some people are able to see what I'm trying to say(and judging by my message box, there are), then I'm at least not talking to a wall.

I'd rather write exactly how I feel and be unpopular, than walk on egg shells and be more likeable.
 
I must lack the intelligence to interpret your posts correctly because when you say things like this it makes me think that you're head over heels in love with him.
Mad Winger said:
Thank goodness for the recent Kagawa rumors! Had it not been for this, then I wouldn't have been able to keep my mind off the important game we have on monday.


As I mentioned earlier in this thread: there have only been 2 players in my entire lifetime as a football spectator that has turned me into a transfer muppet:Ronaldinho and Kagawa. The idea of actually getting the "only" player that I have ever truly wanted, is very exciting. I can't even imagine how the realmuppets must feel every summer! How do the guys who are wanking over at least 5 players every damn summer survive!? I'm nearly going crazy over the idea of getting just one! Every summer, I usually just lean back and put 100% of my trust into our management, and don't really care about who we get. The last time I felt so compelled by the transfer window was in 2003. Until we get a clear answer concerning Kagawa's future, this is going to be a really intense time for me. :nervous:
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That post is gayer than Dale Winton forcing his engorged cock into Andi Peters' mouth all the while angrily screaming the words to "I am who I am".
 
Mad Winger said:
I'm way past the point where I care about what a bunch of strangers online think about me. I'm merely trying to convey the message that in order to play better football we need a player like Kagawa to play. Since we don't have any other similar players, all attention naturally falls on him. It sucks because it makes it all sound fanboyish, but I still think that intelligent posters will be able to see what I'm actually trying to convey. This is not an election where I need to care about the "votes" of idiots, anyways. As long as some people are able to see what I'm trying to say(and judging by my message box, there are), then I'm at least not talking to a wall.

I'd rather write exactly how I feel and be unpopular, than walk on egg shells and be more likeable.
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feck and i was already writing "man, if you can't beat them, join them".

well said.
 
Brwned said:
I must lack the intelligence to interpret your posts correctly because when you say things like this it makes me think that you're head over heels in love with him.
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And? It's not exactly a secret that he's my favorite player:lol:

No, the reason I want him to play is still because I think a player like him is necessary in our starting XI. And I'm far from being the only supporter who thinks that.. Are you saying that they all are Kagawa fanboys?
 
Mad Winger said:
OK, I give up... An 18 year old who's proved nothing except for a decent 20 minutes against C.Palace at home when they're down to 10 men and we're chasing a goal, clearly is a much better choice on paper than Kagawa. It's not a gamble at all, even though pundits all over the world wrote so.

I know that he played an awesome game! Did you miss that part, or did you ignore it for the hell of it? My point is: no one in their right mind would have put their money on Januzaj winning the game for us, coming back from 0-1 by scoring two goals. That's why the whole thing was so fecking sensational. Had it been Rooney or RVP, it would hardly have been a story.
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Look, I love Kagawa as a player and would love him to become a huge player for us, but the few appearances Januzaj has had on the wing has been better then anything Kagawa has ever shown from the wing at United, better then what any of our wingers have done since Valencia was tearing up the premier league and Nani doing the same early in 2011/12. The reason he started was because he was one of our best players when he got subbed on against West Brom. Kagawa played pretty well when he has played this season, but it was never more then decent if I'm being honest, although that's because he hasn't had a chance to build up form. I just think Kagawa isn't suited to Uniteds style at all. Would love it if he worked out here, but because we have Rooney and Van Persie here, he's never going to be our first choice #10, so the only other places he could play would be the wings, where Nani is undoubtedly better, and Januzaj has looked more suited to, or in center midfield (where I would give him a go).
 
Mad Winger said:
And? It's not exactly a secret that he's my favorite player:lol:

No, the reason I want him to play is still because I think a player like him is necessary in our starting XI. I'm far from being the only supporter who thinks that either.. Are you saying that they all are Kagawa fanboys?
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My favourite player is Giggs. I think he's swell. I don't cry into my pillow when he doesn't get picked though. The thing is you think anyone who doesn't agree with your views on Kagawa are "haters", that's what I mean about acting like a teenage girl. I want Kagawa to play. I wanted us to sign him before I even knew we were interested too. I said as much just a couple of days ago:

Brwned said:
Ultimately though I think it's just the fact that we have a player in our team that is regarded by the manager, players and fans of arguably the most vibrant, exciting team in Europe as being a "world class" player and, for whatever reason, he's performing well below that level. People would just like to see him given more slack than others because he's shown he's the kind of player that can be at the heart of beautiful, exciting, title-winning football, yet at the moment it seems he's being given less slack than almost anyone in the squad.

We have a player here who the resident Dortmund (and Germany) fan believes is at a similar level to Özil and yet we're finding it hard to fit him into the team at a time when just one of our starting attackers is in good form. No-one denies that he's miles away from being in his best form but it's clear the biggest reason for that is his lack of confidence and the way we're handling him isn't likely to help that. Most players need the confidence and support of their manager to play at their best and it seems Kagawa is particularly fragile in that sense, so as much as that counts against him in terms of being "world class", it's not particularly unusual for people to think it's worth giving him that extra support

....


Bit of a meandering post but all I'm saying is yes, Kagawa hasn't performed particularly well so far but it's not that surprising that he receives more support than our other underperforming players because a) he has qualities we're lacking at the moment that aid fluid, attacking football, b) he's proven he's capable of being a key player for a title-winning side and c) he seems to be being cut less slack than other performing players despite seemingly having a good attitude.
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So no, it doesn't upset me that people want him to play. I just think you're a complete loon.
 
Brwned said:
My favourite player is Giggs. I think he's swell. I don't cry into my pillow when he doesn't get picked though. The thing is you think anyone who doesn't agree with your views on Kagawa are "haters", that's what I mean about acting like a teenage girl. I want Kagawa to play. I wanted us to sign him before I even knew we were interested too. I said as much just a couple of days ago:
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Christ, your way of interpreting things is oustandingly stupid at times... How on earth did you draw the conclusion that I think that all the people who disagree are haters? People are very much welcome to disagree, as long as they act civil while doing so. Speaking of which...
 
Mad Winger said:
Christ, your way of interpreting things is oustandingly stupid at times... How on earth did you draw the conclusion that I think that all the people who disagree are haters? People are very much welcome to disagree, as long as they act civil while doing so. Speaking of which...
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From this?

People who like winding "haters" up. If I'm gonna be the Kagawa fanboy of the forum, then I'm gonna play that role for what it's worth
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Shark22 said:
Everyone is disagreeing with you.
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Everyone disagree that Kagawa is a good player who should feature more in the starting lineup?

Which rock did you say you live under?

EDIT:
And whether or not you agree with me has nothing to do with being a "hater". A hater is a person who reduces me to nothing but a Kagawa fanboy and disregards everything I write(even the stuff that has nothing to do with Kagawa) only on that basis. I've noticed people calling me out for writing posts about Kagawa when in fact those posts had absolutely nothing to do with Kagawa. That is the most hilarious part about the haters. They're so thick and paranoid they have to actively search for evidence of my fanboyism. They have to fabricate evidence in order to acutally get "valid" arguements.
 
Mad Winger said:
Everyone disagree that Kagawa is a good player who should feature more in the starting lineup?

Which rock did you say you live under?
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As another poster pointed out, you're actually making people that actually rate Kagawa rather high come across as thinking he isn't any good. Everybody is disagreeing with you at this moment in time, regarding the fact that you think we should have dropped Rooney, RVP or Januzaj to give him a start. It's mental.
 
Trouble for Kagawa is that right now he is behind Januzaj on form. Next game Januzaj deserves another start. Rotation might mean Kagawa can get a start but right now after the Sunderland game surely he has slipped (briefly) in the pecking order. The last game Kagawa started he wasnt that great unfortunately.
 
I like Kagawa but MadWinger it seems you're trying your hardest for me to dislike him. Some of your points you've stated are absurd.
 
Shark22 said:
Everybody is disagreeing with you at this moment in time, regarding the fact that you think we should have dropped Rooney, RVP or Januzaj to give him a start. So, they are all haters then?
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Read my edit(I was a bit slow there). Whether they agree or not doesn't make them haters.

And there were many people before the game who shared my opinion that Kagawa should have started ahead of one of those 3(or 4 if we count Nani, which we should) players. Don't kid yourself.
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
:lol:
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I'm not having a go, but he has done nothing since he's moved to United (not his fault I know, he hasn't had a chance as yet) - yet he's talked about like he's the savior with every passing game. He's too good to be on the bench no doubt.

I liked him a lot at Dortmund, and thought he would be a quality signing (and realistic) for us at the time too.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
I'm not having a go, but he has done nothing since he's moved to United
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"Nothing" is stretching it, don't you think? At least he got significantly better stats last season than all of our other wingers. These are the stats from all the PL and CL games:


Kagawa: 1505 min played, 6 goals, 6 assists = A goal/assist every 125 min

- Valencia: 2408 min played, 1 goals, 7 assists = A goal/assist every 301 min
- Welbeck: 1705 min played, 2 goals, 4 assists = A goal/assist every 284 min
- Young: 1395 min played, 0 goals, 5 assists = A goal/assist every 279 min
- Giggs: 1480 min played, 2 goals, 4 assists = A goal/assist every 247 min
- Nani: 893 min played, 1 goals, 4 assists = A goal/assist every 179 min
 
He is a quality player & I think with more games Kagawa could do well for us, but at the moment on form he shouldn't be playing ahead of RVP, Rooney, Nani or Januzaj.

However Januzaj won't be starting every game seeing that he's very young, so when he or Rooney are rested then Kagawa would be a good option on the wing or just behind the striker.

There are plenty of games coming up so Moyes will need to rotate and hopefully he gets a few games.
 
Did he ever play in the CM role at Dortmund or was he always AM?
 
John_K said:
Did he ever play in the CM role at Dortmund or was he always AM?
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Always AM. I think he occasionally played as a winger, but that was really, really rare.

He did however start his pro career as a CM in Japan. But his coach and mentor saw that he could play further up the pitch, so he started playing him as an AM. That payed off for them both, to say the least.
 
Mad Winger said:
"Nothing" is stretching it, don't you think? At least he got significantly better stats last season than all of our other wingers. These are the stats from all the PL and CL games:


Kagawa: 1505 min played, 6 goals, 6 assists = A goal/assist every 125 min

- Valencia: 2408 min played, 1 goals, 7 assists = A goal/assist every 301 min
- Welbeck: 1705 min played, 2 goals, 4 assists = A goal/assist every 284 min
- Young: 1395 min played, 0 goals, 5 assists = A goal/assist every 279 min
- Giggs: 1480 min played, 2 goals, 4 assists = A goal/assist every 247 min
- Nani: 893 min played, 1 goals, 4 assists = A goal/assist every 179 min
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I mean nothing to warrant the way he's been talked about by some. He hasn't been given a proper chance to cement his position in the side as yet, which is clear.

As for the stats, they are all pretty average. I'd be surprised if Nani and Welbeck both don't drastically improve their respective tallies this season.
 
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