Cristiano Ronaldo - Performances (wums will be thread banned)

[Ish]

Another fantastic individual season for Ronaldo.

The man's a machine, and has my respect. Even if i don't like him much.

He should come back to OT. Would increase our chances of winning trophies ten fold.

 

[RedRevongge]

He is still not done yet, so a bit hard to say. But I guess he'll take his place in the tier below Pele and Maradona (although he would probably need a own tier between Pele/Maradona and those who are right below them!)

It's hard to judge as maradona and pele were before my time but in my opinion Ronaldo and that other pretty good fellow should be up there.

I know people will refer to his lack of international success but to me the champions league is now the competition to win.

Looking at his record and incredible consistency I just can't see how he can be overlooked. Like you say his career is still on going but even then he must be close to those great players

 

[Classical Mechanic]

If we lose DDG and don't adequately replace him (Valdes is a good keeper but he'll be truly exposed at Utd, much more than at Barca's) then I don't see it happening.

We will sign Lloris or Cech, they are both good enough to challenge for the best honours. Neither Barca or Real have a top keeper.

 

[kouroux]

We will sign Lloris or Cech, they are both good enough to challenge for the best honours. Neither Barca or Real have a top keeper.

When was the last time a team won the PL with their keeper not having a very good season too ? In Spain, they're so dominant in attack that they don't need to have world class keepers.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

If we lose DDG and don't adequately replace him (Valdes is a good keeper but he'll be truly exposed at Utd, much more than at Barca's) then I don't see it happening.

To be fair, goalkeepers are more replaceable than outfield players. Barca have had Bravo in goal, Atletico got over De Gea leaving and replaced him well with Oblak. It's just about picking the right one.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

When was the last time a team won the PL with their keeper not having a very good season too ?

That's not his point. He means that lots of keepers have very good seasons.

 

[PlayerOne]

I know Barca are amazing and all that, but IMO it's poor that he has only one league title at Real Madrid.

 

[SirAF]

It's hard to judge as maradona and pele were before my time but in my opinion Ronaldo and that other pretty good fellow should be up there.

I know people will refer to his lack of international success but to me the champions league is now the competition to win.

Looking at his record and incredible consistency I just can't see how he can be overlooked. Like you say his career is still on going but even then he must be close to those great players

Absolutely, he can definitely climb up to that tier. I'm just trying to appear slightly objective

 

[kouroux]

That's not his point. He means that lots of keepers have very good seasons.

I don't think he meant that. Or at least I wasn't answering to that.

 

[Snake Plissken]

I know Barca are amazing and all that, but IMO it's poor that he has only one league title at Real Madrid.

Barcelona haven't had that 'magic' quality since Guardiola's penultimate season, so there are no excuses after that in my opinion.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

When was the last time a team won the PL with their keeper not having a very good season too ? In Spain, they're so dominant in attack that they don't need to have world class keepers.

You don't need a top three in the world keeper to win the Champions League. you only need a tier two keeper for that.q Czech and Lloris fit that bill for me.

 

[Amar__]

I know Barca are amazing and all that, but IMO it's poor that he has only one league title at Real Madrid.

What do you mean one title? This is his third season where he is top scorer in Spain, that counts more than La Liga trophy.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Barcelona haven't had that 'magic' quality since Guardiola's penultimate season, so there are no excuses after that in my opinion.

So you spend most of your time on here slating Ronaldo for not being a team player but then choose to blame him entirely for Madrid's shortcomings.

Is it a team sport or not?

 

[Moston_Lad]

All those goals but nothing to show for it.

 

[RedRevongge]

All those goals but nothing to show for it.

Except the women, money, cars and pichichi

But I agree he deserves to win something really

 

[Snake Plissken]

So you spend most of your time on here slating Ronaldo for not being a team player but then choose to blame him entirely for Madrid's shortcomings.

Is it a team sport or not?

I was talking about Madrid as a club so you can unbunch your panties sweetheart.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

I was talking about Madrid as a club so you can unbunch your panties sweetheart.

Alright buddy.

 

[kouroux]

You don't need a top three in the world keeper to win the Champions League. you only need a tier two keeper for that.q Czech and Lloris fit that bill for me.

I wasn't talking about the champions league but still I think that would only work if you have a cracking team/pressure system/defense to compensate with it. I don't think LVG is that great of an organizer and tactician to make us that good without a top class keeper playing for us.

 

[Ish]

It's hard to judge as maradona and pele were before my time but in my opinion Ronaldo and that other pretty good fellow should be up there.

I know people will refer to his lack of international success but to me the champions league is now the competition to win.

Looking at his record and incredible consistency I just can't see how he can be overlooked. Like you say his career is still on going but even then he must be close to those great players

There is not a chance Ronaldo will ever be considered to be in "that" category, alongside Maradona & Pele, IMO.

Those players all had a little something "more" in their game, compared to Ronaldo, who's sacrificed alot of his flair for ruthless efficiency (goals).

Also, the thing I hate about these "club" numbers that both Messi and Ronaldo put up, and it's another fact often ignored when compared to past greats, is that club level football is so skewed. They both have teams above anything else La Liga has to offer (their bench is often more expensive then the entire squad of their opponents), and both their teams are geared around getting the absolute best out of them both. Even the Champions league is a skewed competition. There are generally a handful of "great teams", but the rest are novice teams, with very small budgets.

The concentration of the world's best players are essentially stacked in 3 clubs - and 2 of them are Barca and Real, plus Bayern. In the EPL, you struggle to pick more than 2-3 world class players in the top sides, yet you look at those 3 clubs and every position is arguably stacked with the best in the world.

So yeah, i think their inflated "stats" need to be taken into perspective as well.

 

[PlayerOne]

Except the women, money, cars and pichichi

But I agree he deserves to win something really

What does he deserve it? It was his choice to move there.

 

[Ayush_reddevil]

Think United fans are so scarred by the post Schmeichel era that gk replacement is actually considered a far bigger issue than it actually is. Just look at the keepers the top teams apart from Chelsea have in the pl, don't think it's that hard to find a keeper better than Hart, Ospina or Mignolet

 

[LeChuck]

Also, Maradona took Napoli to the Serie A against the late 1980s Milan...(one of the greatest teams assembled), twice. That alone is more than either Ronnie or Messi have ever done. And this is without going into the WC '86. I think Napoli was the first time a team from southern Italy had won Serie A. They were as unfashionable and unfancied as they come.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Also, Maradona took Napoli to the Serie A against the late 1980s Milan...(one of the greatest teams assembled), twice. That alone is more than either Ronnie or Messi have ever done. And this is without going into the WC '86. I think Napoli was the first time a team from southern Italy had won Serie A. They were as unfashionable and unfancied as they come.

I'm sure @Marcosdeto can debunk some of the myths in this.

 

[RedRevongge]

There is not a chance Ronaldo will ever be considered to be in "that" category, alongside Maradona & Pele, IMO.

Those players all had a little something "more" in their game, compared to Ronaldo, who's sacrificed alot of his flair for ruthless efficiency (goals).

Also, the thing I hate about these "club" numbers that both Messi and Ronaldo put up, and it's another fact often ignored when compared to past greats, is that club level football is so skewed. They both have teams above anything else La Liga has to offer (their bench is often more expensive then the entire squad of their opponents), and both their teams are geared around getting the absolute best out of them both. Even the Champions league is a skewed competition. There are generally a handful of "great teams", but the rest are novice teams, with very small budgets.

The concentration of the world's best players are essentially stacked in 3 clubs - and 2 of them are Barca and Real, plus Bayern. In the EPL, you struggle to pick more than 2-3 world class players in the top sides, yet you look at those 3 clubs and every position is arguably stacked with the best in the world.

So yeah, i think their inflated "stats" need to be taken into perspective as well.

I can't say I completely agree with this. Yes their teams are geared to utilise their strengths but are you telling me teams didn't set up to make the most of Maradona?

In my opinion the Champions League has a lot of strength. The Spanish clubs, some good German clubs over the years and some high spending premier league clubs.

No other players have come close to the top two over the last decade. They are just incredible footballers.

 

[Ish]

I can't say I completely agree with this. Yes their teams are geared to utilise their strengths but are you telling me teams didn't set up to make the most of Maradona?

In my opinion the Champions League has a lot of strength. The Spanish clubs, some good German clubs over the years and some high spending premier league clubs.

No other players have come close to the top two over the last decade. They are just incredible footballers.

I haven't watched enough of Maradona at club level, but my limited understanding is that he played for a good Napoli side, but nowhere near the class of this current Madrid and Barca team.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not dismissing their records, I'm just saying, IMO, there's a bit of an inflation in those numbers. For instance, no matter how good Ronaldo, do you think he'd have been able to achieve those numbers with us, in the EPL? A league, not necessarily "better" than the Spanish league, but definitely more competitive.

 

[FC Ronaldo]

 

[LeChuck]

I'm sure @Marcosdeto can debunk some of the myths in this.

It is myth free.

 

[RedRevongge]

I haven't watched enough of Maradona at club level, but my limited understanding is that he played for a good Napoli side, but nowhere near the class of this current Madrid and Barca team.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not dismissing their records, I'm just saying, IMO, there's a bit of an inflation in those numbers. For instance, no matter how good Ronaldo, do you think he'd have been able to achieve those numbers with us, in the EPL? A league, not necessarily "better" than the Spanish league, but definitely more competitive.

No he probably wouldn't have to be honest. But I'm almost certain he would have hit 30+ league goals EVERY season that he has been at Madrid and also won POTY in each of those years which would have been an unreal feat. Again its impossible to compare different eras and to order players but for me Messi and Ronaldo are the same tier as Maradona and Pele

 

[Skorenzy]

Also, Maradona took Napoli to the Serie A against the late 1980s Milan...(one of the greatest teams assembled), twice. That alone is more than either Ronnie or Messi have ever done. And this is without going into the WC '86. I think Napoli was the first time a team from southern Italy had won Serie A. They were as unfashionable and unfancied as they come.

It is myth free.

Yeah, except that this legendary Milan side (the Sacchi one, not the Capello one which was after Maradona had left Italy in 1991) only won a single league title.

Maradona joined Napoli in the summer of 1984, for a world record transfer fee I might add, and left in 1991.

Serie A champions
84/85: Hellas Verona (their 1st and only title ever)
85/86: Juventus
86/87: Napoli (their 1st of only two titles ever)
87/88: AC Milan
88/89: Internazionale
89/90: Napoli (their 2nd of only two titles ever)
90/91: Sampdoria (their 1st and only title ever)

So, while late 80s Serie A might've been extremely competitive and likely one of the hardest leagues of all-time the fact that in Maradona's 7-year stint in Italy there were 2 teams aside from his own that managed to win their 1st and only league title ever does take some of its uniqueness away from him. He did manage two, of course, but where are the plaudits for Elkjaer and Vialli?

 

[thejtrain]

He'll be the only Madrid player going home with a smile on his face.

i can imagine Ronaldo bouncing about in the dressing room just now spraying champagne everywhere as his teammates contemplate another league title lost

 

[Marcosdeto]

i can imagine Ronaldo bouncing about in the dressing room just now spraying champagne everywhere as his teammates contemplate another league title lost

brilliant!

but to be fair, i think that Ronaldo deserves a lot more that what he has won, as i said in another post a few days ago, i really think that Real Madrid and his team mates failed him

he scores so many goals and yet, they amount to very few accolades

 

[Samid]

I'm not watching and I'm relying on the shitty VG live

3-1 Ronaldo!

I'm really sorry, I didn't realise it was that bad.

 

[Marcosdeto]

Yeah, except that this legendary Milan side (the Sacchi one, not the Capello one which was after Maradona had left Italy in 1991) only won a single league title.

Maradona joined Napoli in the summer of 1984, for a world record transfer fee I might add, and left in 1991.

Serie A champions
84/85: Hellas Verona (their 1st and only title ever)
85/86: Juventus
86/87: Napoli (their 1st of only two titles ever)
87/88: AC Milan
88/89: Internazionale
89/90: Napoli (their 2nd of only two titles ever)
90/91: Sampdoria (their 1st and only title ever)

So, while late 80s Serie A might've been extremely competitive and likely one of the hardest leagues of all-time the fact that in Maradona's 7-year stint in Italy there were 2 teams aside from his own that managed to win their 1st and only league title ever does take some of its uniqueness away from him. He did manage two, of course, but where are the plaudits for Elkjaer and Vialli?

excellent post, totally agree, i said this many times, but the legend about maradona being the only football player to ever win a national championship with a lesser team still follows

 

[Snake Plissken]

brilliant!

but to be fair, i think that Ronaldo deserves a lot more that what he has won, as i said in another post a few days ago, i really think that Real Madrid and his team mates failed him

he scores so many goals and yet, they amount to very few accolades

I agree with you mate, I'm just having a laugh. There might be things I dislike about the guy but you could never pin their short comings directly on him with a scoring record like that.

 

[united_99]

Think United fans are so scarred by the post Schmeichel era that gk replacement is actually considered a far bigger issue than it actually is. Just look at the keepers the top teams apart from Chelsea have in the pl, don't think it's that hard to find a keeper better than Hart, Ospina or Mignolet

Well we didn't have problems winning PLs once Schmeichel left, but we only won the CL once we had a great team again which also included a great gk.

Some of the goals our gks conceded in the CL after Schmeichel left were schocking. In the CL knock out stages when small details matter a gk a lot of time can be the difference between progressing to the next round or getting knocked out.

 

[SonnyTheHaloPro]

58 goals, damn that is really impressive.

 

[SirAF]

I'm really sorry, I didn't realise it was that bad.

 

[Vialli_92]

brilliant!

but to be fair, i think that Ronaldo deserves a lot more that what he has won, as i said in another post a few days ago, i really think that Real Madrid and his team mates failed him

he scores so many goals and yet, they amount to very few accolades

Against Juventus though his over all contribution was tiny.

He scored an away goal from 1 yard for them which is important as away goals are priceless.

For the rest of that game he done nothing though

2nd leg at home he scored a penalty and set up Bale for a good chance but he missed.

He also only had 39 touches all game only player who had less than him was Casillas.

Over 180 minutes that contribution really isn't enough and certainly great players would have grabbed that game by the scruff of the neck and really have made their presence felt.

This is why ill never rate Ronaldo as highly as other people do regardless of how many goals he scores.

Fantastic goalscorer one of the beSt ever but his all round game is certainly not up to scratch of some of the great players to have played the game.

 

[Trizy]

Kinda almost feel bad for him, he's basically a one man team. Take him out of Madrid and they would not finish second.

 

[LeChuck]

Yeah, except that this legendary Milan side (the Sacchi one, not the Capello one which was after Maradona had left Italy in 1991) only won a single league title.

Maradona joined Napoli in the summer of 1984, for a world record transfer fee I might add, and left in 1991.

Serie A champions
84/85: Hellas Verona (their 1st and only title ever)
85/86: Juventus
86/87: Napoli (their 1st of only two titles ever)
87/88: AC Milan
88/89: Internazionale
89/90: Napoli (their 2nd of only two titles ever)
90/91: Sampdoria (their 1st and only title ever)

So, while late 80s Serie A might've been extremely competitive and likely one of the hardest leagues of all-time the fact that in Maradona's 7-year stint in Italy there were 2 teams aside from his own that managed to win their 1st and only league title ever does take some of its uniqueness away from him. He did manage two, of course, but where are the plaudits for Elkjaer and Vialli?

The overarching point was that Maradona managed to do that, something that Messi and Ronaldo didn't. And winning the '86 WC (not single handedly, but as the main man). Along with his other plaudits as a player. Also, the fact that Napoli were the first team from Southern Italy to win the Scudetto ever is massive. The North South economical divide was huge (thanks, wiki).

Also, that late 80s Milan side were fantastic, they still had all the big names there.

My point is - I think this sets Maradona apart from Messi/Ronaldo. And someone on these forums did an excellent post on why Pele's achievements are monumental as well (as there were a lot of posters saying he's not up to that level).