And pollsters?
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
And pollsters?
They're alright, usually within the margin of error. Just happens that as little 1% makes a world of difference in outcomes.
You can believe what you like, Mark Carnage admitted he was wrong
I think really the only dynamic is what we pay for not allowing free movement. The likes of Poland, and Romania must be shitting it, they have so many people here, and Brexit means we can pick and choose which we allow to stay. It'a a very crude lever but the current immigrant population from the EU is a big play, like it or not.
Boo hoo, usual Brexit scare story. Unsubstantiated bollocks as normal.
I'm not getting this obviously, i need to find a brexit scare story and post it in this thread.
Lost me a bit Chorley, what we will pay for not allowing free movement is tariffs on our exports, which the fall in the pound will hopefully more than compensate for.
Lack of access in finance will no doubt be a bigger problem, but whilst I admit I don't understand the subject, I do have some faith that our bankers are world-class cunning bastards, I doubt we will lose it all.
I take it that you are again misinformed. Are you Michael Gove in disguise? Even Boris Johnson has finally woken up and smelled the coffee.
We haven't left yet though. It will bite when we leave with zero trade deals. Can't see how anyone can have a different view, particularly as the City's lucrative business is picked off by passport-wielding rivals.
That implies he ever believed in what he was spouting. Fairly clear from the start he didn't think Brexit was a wise idea and backed it to cosy up to the base.
... im an effort to defeat his old 'friend' David C just for the sake of it.
While you're probably right about Johnson being a liar from the start, he recently acknowledges that it wouldn't be wise to cut ties completely. Chorley however appears to have his head just burried in the sand as Michael Gove exemplifies it.
He is obviously totally unaware about the amount of EU-funded reasearch that is going on in the UK which will, depending on the deal, dry up significantly or completely. Given how May and her government acted so far, I consider it highly unlikely they are willing to spend anything near the EU funds. Hence, scientists with and without a EU passport currently working in the UK will move where the research grants move. That's how the science community has been working for decades, it's a very mobile bunch. The UK will lose highly skilled tax payers and of course every lower skilled job that come with high skill jobs. If that's what the UK want, so be it. There isn't a single element of 'scare' in this.
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Well if it implodes after exit it will mean Carnage is wrong again. Whats it to be?
Will brexit... specifically boarder controls play a big part in the northern Ireland elections likely to be triggered this week?
Definitely.
Presumably any election will also be around the time article 50 is due...
And a return to a full international border or even the suggestion of one could kick off troubles?
Hummm not looking ideal
It's a nightmare. The Brexit vote really fecked Northern Ireland hard and probably paid a part in tensions being so high right now. It can only make things worse from here too. Middle England fecking the rest of the British Isles. History repeating itself.
My dad consistently jibes to me (I was the only one to vote remain) about how the UK economy is booming post Brexit and every time some little thing goes wrong he jokingly blames Brexit for it.
I need some cold hard facts to throw back in his face.
I need some cold hard facts to throw back in his face.
His argument is absurd to begin with, seeing as nobody knows how the economy would be doing if Remain had won. More than likely a lot better than it has up until this point and definitely a lot less uncertainty about what lies ahead.
He's usually pissed so it's hard to argue against him anyway but I'd just love to properly pin something on him and shut him the feck up over it.
He was (and almost certainly continues to be) firmly of the belief that Brexit was ridiculous and stupid. He is however in charge of a major organization responsible for maintaining Britains financial stability. From the second the result was announced everything he has said publicly has to be seen through the lens of doing what is best to maintain that stability. Unlike randoms on an internet forum, he cannot just say what he thinks because it wouldnt be wildly irresponsible and damaging.
How do you Brexit supporters not understand this stuff? Are you that desperate for some kind of positive confirmation that you didn't make an idiotic, economically suicidal and utterly illogical choice at the ballot box?
So far not that much has happened other than the pound devaluation which will start to affect prices/imports this year.
Would hardly say the UK economy is booming though.
It was doing well, recovering from the previous recession but then decided to shoot itself in the foot.
This is a long term effect that will not happen within a few months.
It all depends on what happens over the next few months. If it is a complete divorce from the EU, then the real effects will gather speed over the next two years. However, if May turned round tomorrow and said actually we're not leaving the EU , the pound would soar.
Without judging the actual vote and whether Brexit is a good or bad thing.
You are arguing with people who were claiming before the vote that the EU was a dictatorship where the members had no say and who are now claiming that Brexit is justified because every member has a say and it prevents simple negotiations.
They just had the bloke on five live who reported it... Apparently he has also reported the pm which is still ongoing and he is taking legal advice about taking them to court.
I should add that he sounded like an utter utter cnut
A troll wasting police time, such hilarity.
Isn't part of the problem though, that it's been biting for many people already, while we were members of the EU. The macroeconomic data has been suggestive of a rosy picture before, yet the fruits of such were reaching fewer voters. Remain's status quo had little in which they could believe, save for more of the same.
There was a report out last week which advanced the idea of that post 2019, Brexit will mean higher wages and lower house prices. Maybe it wont' come to pass to the extent predicted, however the public are seeking those sort of changes to the experience of daily life. Neither Cameron nor Tim Farron for that matter, felt able to push that type of message during the campaign.
If hate crime is a real thing, then she deserves to be investigated for it. Or should we just think that some uneducated dickhead posting something on Twitter is a serious offense but the Home Secretary of the United Kingdom using speech to promote a climate where human beings are thought of as lesser because of their nationality is just fine?
The public are desperate to believe in fairy-tales alright. Just a pity that one side of the debate is so much more willing than the other to tell them what they want to hear, whether or not is has any resemblance to reality.
Lower house prices? Oh that will be a real joy for the 7 million or so morgage holders who suddenly find their property is worth considerably less than the money they borrowed to buy it. Yay negative equity! Who ever said Brexit wouldn't give us anything?
How is what she said hate speech? Obviously people aren't lesser because of their nationality but that doesn't mean that governments aren't allowed to prioritise maximising employment among British citizens either, does it? That's the government's perogative.
There must be something positive about Brexit, somewhere, otherwise 17 million people wouldn't have voted for it, surely.
Which of her remarks do you consider to be a hate crime?
As a first time buyer i would love that, although im highly sceptical it will come to pass (particularly the wages bit).
At least you are consistent: you didn't give a damn about their concerns before the referendum, and you don't now.
Yeah it'll also mean free dental care for every Brit, free Beer for every Brit and a £6000 holiday fund for every family so they can enjoy the new statutory 8 weeks holiday.
She used the term "not taking jobs British people could do.” which might sound innocuous enough taken alone, but considering it was followed by a proposal to force companies to maintain lists of foreign workers they employ, it was part of a larger move to put the blame on to immigrants for the economic problems of the UK (something every study has shown to be nonsense) and to create a divide between native British people and foreigners by posing them as a threat to the economic opportunities of British people.
It was disgusting, which is why she was attacked mercilessly for it, and withdrew her repellant idea after only a week.
Not quite.
It acknowledged that in the year immediately following Brexit there are likely to be further difficulties. However if we are prepared to ride them out, there can be rewards into the 2020s.
Don't tell me what I am or am not concerned about you pompous ass. I live outside the UK now, but I was one of those professional Brits who couldn't afford to get on the housing ladder because of crazy house prices. In the area I come from, prices had up to quadrupled in my lifetime. Unlike you however, I have the sense to look at both sides of the picture, and anything that makes house prices significantly fall is going to be great for new buyers, and absolutely brutal for those already on the housing/morgage ladder. That doesn't mean we should just continue with unaffordable housing, but it does mean that we need a very well thought out and carefully planned solution that doesn't leave 7 million people in negative equality.
But then again your Brexiteers never have cared about thinking things through and carefully planning have you. You're firmly in the camp that believes things are as bad as they could possibly ever be, so lets set fire to the building and see if a better new one magically appears in its place.
Why are leavers so happy to point towards macroeconomic data now when this was the argument before?
Also I find Leave's faux concern for the left behinds, and criticism of Remain voters who think that leaving makes the situation worse for them, utterly exhausting. I have no idea how you can un-ironically act like leaving was the only option for helping them, or that it will mean that the Conservative government, or the Labour government before them, will suddenly care.
Lets be honest, your real motivations and kindred spirits in the leave campaign weren't the same as the working class in the north but the sort of people you're very happy to remind us exist when it suits your argument: very well off, older people in South East England.