Manchester United's Chief Scout and Head of Global Scouting have left the club

[JPRouve]

You'd have to hope against hope that he's told the club that this sort of archaic structure can't continue. For the faults he's been responsible for as manager, he seems to know exactly what the issues facing the club are.

While it's nice to have Rangnick helping behind the scene, we started the transition before he arrived with the appointment of Murtough. The problem was that from what I understand until Ole left we were still in an hybrid mode, with the manager having more power influence on the first team, hopefully we will never see that kind of setup ever again.

As Rangnick said, with that kind of setup it almost doesn't matter how good the manager is, it's too much responsibilities for one person. The thing that the likes of Wenger and SAF were great at was delegating to the right people and evaluating the work of these people. People like Mourinho and LVG never did that in their career while Ole wasn't a good enough coach for Manchester United. And I don't blame them, it was the responsibility of the CEO to understand that specialization and teamwork were a lot better for everyone involved.

 

[roseguy64]

According to all the news Ole thought he had the deal in the bag until that idiot Woodward decided not to go ahead with the Harland deal because he had to pay an extra million or so to his agent and there was a release clause. The Dortmund came and brought him. Woodward is the one who has destroyed this club.

Dislike Woodward all you like but you'll find a lot of fans don't disagree with not setting the release clause precedent. First it's Haaland and then it's every player. The club just doesn't want players to have release clauses. Whether that's right or wrong is up to the individual.

 

[sirAlexsglasses]

What makes you think Rangnick had anything to do with this?

It was Murtough.

The moves will be seen as a moment of change in United’s scouting structure and will attempt to streamline an operation which critics have said has become too top heavy.

John Murtough has full control of the football operations and has driven some of the changes as he seeks to help turn Manchester United around.

Key to those changes will be the appointment of Erik Ten Hag, who has reached an agreement in principle to become their next permanent manager, as The Athletic revealed earlier this month.

But hey, Murtough's shite according to the CAF anyway......

I would say Ralph’s comments in recent months highlighting our problems are the driving force behind this, that and it is what he has built his reputation on.

 

[JPRouve]

I would say Ralph’s comments in recent months highlighting our problems are the driving force behind this, that and it is what he has built his reputation on.

We were already doing it and it was reported that Murtough was the one that tried to bring Rangnick. It's also worth mentioning that Murtough has done the same job for the academy.

 

[buchansleftleg]

I'm glad that, for once, it seems like we are clearing the decks for a radical restructure rather than what has gon on before... new manager signs onboard....brings in 1 or 2 new people as favoured people...old managers staff shuffled off into made up job title...rinse and repeat.

We seem to have lost the art of unearthing our own gems and adopted a "poaching" approach where we just copy the homework of more organised clubs and try and swoop in at the last moment.

That sort of approach only works if you are trying some sort of "Scorched earth" type policy like Abramovich did at the start of his reign. He hoovered up all the talent around, sometimes seemingly just to deny the opportunity for rivals to get them.

 

[Cassidy]

Did Rangnick ask them about Nkuku and they were not clued up

Im joking

 

[DevTheRed]

Any word on who’s going to be taking their places?

 

[Adnan]

Any word on who’s going to be taking their places?

Myself and @JPRouve are currently in talks about replacing them.

 

[JPRouve]

Myself and @JPRouve are currently in talks about replacing them.

It would be a disaster, I have rating Krychowiak on my CV.

 

[Adnan]

It would be a disaster, I have rating Krychowiak on my CV.

 

[dannyrhinos89]

Hardly a loss given that we seem to do the majority of our scouting on FIFA 22.

scouting on fifa would actually be better than what these have done.

 

[Andersonson]

Any word on who’s going to be taking their places?

A MLS Scout who is a good friend of Joel Glazer

 

[Sandikan]

There was a scouting team?

I swear they just went on championship manager, filtered on most expensive players who are keen to come here, and just went down the list.

 

[mazhar13]

Mark Ogden was the first to call Ten Hag. He knows his onions

Even a broken clock is right twice a day, we've been linked with ten Hag since the second Solskjaer got sacked, hardly sticking his neck on the line.

Odgen's article on that had Rob Dawson as the co-author. Rob Dawson is one of the more reliable United journalists and is certainly more reliable than Odgen, too. I wouldn't be surprised if Odgen got the info from Rob Dawson.

 

[DevTheRed]

Myself and @JPRouve are currently in talks about replacing them.

Hey your transfer tweet output alone puts most of our recruitment to shame

 

[Adnan]

Hey your transfer tweet output alone puts most of our recruitment to shame

I was sacked and replaced by the more competent @mazhar13. My tweets were being sourced from all over the world, and I even brought Chilevision to the forum's attention..

 

[Revaulx]

I’m really not sure how much influence “scouting” has had on player purchases at United, regardless of who one believes is making the decisions on who to buy: manager, club scouts, manager’s personal scouts, ex-players, director of football, tea lady, whoever.

I believe the influence of players’ agents and selling clubs who have players they are looking to offload is vastly underestimated. Whichever one of those is best at charming the man with the cheque book will be the one who succeeds in selling his wares to United.

With any luck the professionalising of stuff that seems under way post-Woodward will change this.

 

[RVN1991]

In that Athletic article on Bout/Lawlor leaving it cites Larsson and Chicharito as two of his signings... fecking hell if that's the best they could put together for the article on his time here.

Even during Sir Alex's latter years our recruitment was abysmal. Talk about long overdue.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

 

[Velvet Revolver]

Yeah another poster said that but Forlan gave us a call and offered him to us because he was too good for his team. Don't think our scouts did much for that one

Didn't Giggsy do the same with James? and Phelan with Maguire?

 

[Green_Red]

Let's not get too excited, we don't know who is coming in.

I wonder if Rangnick has influenced this

Surely, he has said in the past he was surprised we weren't scouting some young players in the German leagues.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

 

[2cents]

Our recruitment has been a shambles a lot longer than a decade, 2005-2006 the last really successful group of four or five players brought in over 12 month (VDS, Park, Vidic, Evra, Carrick). Very few if any signings since then have made a really crucial and long-standing contribution to a successful United side.

 

[atkar83]

No big surprise given how scathing Ralf has been about our player recruitment, and how this has (rightly) become the media narrative.

Lawlor seemingly only worked as a scout in South Africa (not even sure what this means, for who?) for one year before joining United and became chief scout in 2014/15. Madness.
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jim-lawlor/profil/trainer/7284

Marcel Bout joined the set up around the same time under LVG - he's more experienced in the game but largely in a coaching capacity rather than scouting:
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/marcel-bout/profil/trainer/10093

How on earth do a team like United end up with this kind of set-up? I hope one day someone writes a proper book on how badly run our club has been since Fergie left.

So where did the scouts that found the likes of Nani, CR7, Chicharito, etc. etc. go? Did they all leave and were replaced by inferior scouts or did they just luck out back then?

 

[Revaulx]

Well I’d have thought that sacking two senior long-serving figures was a pretty good indication that a major shake-up is already in progress.

 

[Revaulx]

So where did the scouts that found the likes of Nani, CR7, Chicharito, etc. etc. go? Did they all leave and were replaced by inferior scouts or did they just luck out back then?

That’s a good question. We weren’t always hopeless.

Politics maybe? Turf wars between different factions? Demotivation due to interference from non-football people? Lack of synergy between scouts and manager? The last of these is a biggie; there’s no way that would have been the case under SAF.

 

[Robertd0803]

In 5 years time we will all be proclaiming Murtough as one of the best things to ever happen to the club once all these changes play out and the club is back where it should be.

Blind faith talking.

 

[Kaos]

So where did the scouts that found the likes of Nani, CR7, Chicharito, etc. etc. go? Did they all leave and were replaced by inferior scouts or did they just luck out back then?

We didn't really scout Ronaldo did we? He just tore us a new one during a preseason friendly and Fergie decided to buy him there and then.

 

[Irrational.]

Best news I’ve heard all day. They haven’t a fecking clue and God knows when we last unearthed a gem.

 

[led_scholes]

So where did the scouts that found the likes of Nani, CR7, Chicharito, etc. etc. go? Did they all leave and were replaced by inferior scouts or did they just luck out back then?

Was it scouting though? Saf saw Cristiano destroying our whole team. Then, with Quieroz, Mendes around we had turned our eyes to the Portuguese market, and Nani-Anderson were the most exciting talents in the Portuguese league. Apart from Chicharito, Vidic, and Pogba, I can't think of any other exceptional talents being discovered by our scouts almost the last 20 years.

Even on De Gea (who was the established gk of Atletico) their analysis was way off. They believed that he will much better than Neuer.

Edit: Rossi was also a good one.

 

[DevTheRed]

I was sacked and replaced by the more competent @mazhar13. My tweets were being sourced from all over the world, and I even brought Chilevision to the forum's attention..

Ah I remember the Chilevision saga.. right up there with concrete information and Ollys gifs back in the day

 

[Lash]

We were already doing it and it was reported that Murtough was the one that tried to bring Rangnick. It's also worth mentioning that Murtough has done the same job for the academy.

I believe he may have also been involved in the women's team as well.

 

[soapythecat]

We didn't really scout Ronaldo did we? He just tore us a new one during a preseason friendly and Fergie decided to buy him there and then.

It was definitely this. SAF even suggested the same - I think one of the players (possibly RVN) said they needed him after the game. I watched the game in Ibiza and remember thinking Wow watching Ronaldo rip through us. He looked brilliant….but I was off my tits at the time though.

 

[VorZakone]

It would be a disaster, I have rating Krychowiak on my CV.

Me too! Wasn't he really good for Sevilla?

 

[Loon]

Somebody in this thread indicated UWS had hinted of this change months ago, so I guess these departures are not at the request of the incoming manager.

 

[gajender]

We didn't really scout Ronaldo did we? He just tore us a new one during a preseason friendly and Fergie decided to buy him there and then.

It was definitely this. SAF even suggested the same - I think one of the players (possibly RVN) said they needed him after the game. I watched the game in Ibiza and remember thinking Wow watching Ronaldo rip through us. He looked brilliant….but I was off my tits at the time though.

United actually scouted Ronaldo plenty of times but were forced to buy him ahead of schedule as other Clubs were ready to make the move for him .

 

[RopersReturn]

They obviously both had a huge influence assembling this current shi££Ty side, particularly Lawlor, who managed to dig in deep for a number of years.

 

[Loon]

Interesting thing is Neville responded on Twitter that Lawler had been marginalised for years. Why would they do that?

 

[diarm]

Interesting thing is Neville responded on Twitter that Lawler had been marginalised for years. Why would they do that?

I don't think it was intentional. He just refused to use emails and after the De Gea debacle, all the other offices got rid of their fax machines.

 

[Loon]

I don't think it was intentional. He just refused to use emails and after the De Gea debacle, all the other offices got rid of their fax machines.