Can this list be extended to Abu Dhabi please. Our neighbours are getting rather noisy...
A people's Revolution
- Thread starter Avatar
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Can this list be extended to Abu Dhabi please. Our neighbours are getting rather noisy...
It doesn't end in Africa... it won't end until there is fairness.
Egypt, the world is with you. Hopefully 2011 is the year the people of the middle east decided enough is enough and they want freedom, democracy and liberalism.
I think liberalism might be pushing it but I'm with you on the rest.
If there is one regime in the Middle East I'd like to see fall more than any other purely on moral grounds it would be Syria - the amount of Turmoil they have put Lebanon through in the last twenty years is ridiculous.
You can feck right off - this is the movement that gets rid of cnuts like you.
Because I am conservative I am the antichrist? Give me a break, I am probably more pro civil liberty than you are.
Considering how you cannot tolerate those of a different political persuasion to yourself your viewpoint is somewhat hypocritical.
What oppressive government are they going to bring down in Somalia? There isn't an actual functioning government there...
WTF?
The political situation in Kenya is completely different from those other countries.
You're playing up the stereotype of the 'ignorant Westerner' they have in those parts, believe me.
And Somalia is a failed state. Has been for a while now.
cant wait for revolution to spread to Iran too.
To be fair, you are a raving liberal compared to what they are used to in Egypt right now...
It's silly just to name a country whose politics you don't like and unequivocally state, "oh, I really wish they got rid of that government!" This isn't some kind of cool parlor trick game.
Anyways, why don't you Yanks and Brits do something about your own governments rather than wet dream about revolutions in other countries?
Anyways, why don't you Yanks and Brits do something about your own governments rather than wet dream about revolutions in other countries?
Our governments, including yours in Canada, are doing just fine.
One can hope, but I can't see it happening there. The Syrian people are in a better overall shape than the ones in Tunisia & Egypt.
Come on!
Surely you can see there are massive issues in most countries of the Middle East. Even if you want to go down the religion route, I'd say we in the west are at a bigger advantage than those countries with Muslim majorities. We have all the freedoms we need to function as Muslims in the west. The quicker the Muslims living in the west and the Muslim world realise this the better.
May God protect the countries which gives us these freedoms.
Yep, it's rather silly people handpicking governments based on how much they like/dislike them.
In all fairness EVERY country in the Middle east deserves some sort revolutionary regime change, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iraq, Iran you name it, none of them should be exempt.
Not really, its people like him that brought the likes of Mubarak to power and have continued to support him. Not Brian personally, but you get the drift.
His opening sentence wasn't the problem, most fair minded people will agree with that. It was the 2nd one where he felt more should be done by westerners to revolutionize their own govts, that doesn't quite fit.
He's got a point though, there's a huge democratic deficit in places like the US where there's a gap between public opinion and policy, as well as the lack of differing candidates in elections. In the UK there's also a an unfair electoral system that makes any form of grassroots politics seem redundant.
Perhaps 'revolution' was too strong a word to suggest, but western countries certainly shouldn't be immune from major reforms and that's only going to come through the strenuous efforts of the people.
No government is perfect. Never will be!
I don't see the point in undermining or criticising other better functioning governments or systems because we ourselves are in a rut. We're not here to score points.
Amazing to watch....especially the guy 45 seconds into the clip...
The way I see it both categories of government require some degree of change.
In the case of western governments its simply a few major reforms here and there, in the case of our governments it's wiping the slate clean and starting again from the grassroots.
The whole globe could do with a people's revolution in promoting democracy, independence and social justice.
You're absolutely right.
The government has just resigned.
I agree with your sentiments. However, I'll copy my post a few pages back.
Even if some sort of democracy comes about after a free election, I'm not sure it will survive in the presence of long established systems. These people need to go, and the systems and authority have to be completely dismantled. We know what happens when long standing systems are broken up (Iraq, Afghanistan, and South Africa are recent examples). I also think democracy needs to be understood by those who come to power and more importantly by the voters. It's not as easy as just copying the West's model. The west has hundreds of years of experience, and trained minds. The Arab world is too tribal at present, and any changes will need to be gradual.
More like sacked by the dictator.
Great vid. And the bloke at 0:45 reminds me of William Wallace in Braveheart with that call to arms.
That guy's a legend.
As long as Mubarak himself doesn't address the protestors his resignation,the march,violence and conflict will probably continue.
The examples you give are quite frightening.
In Egypt's case I'm not sure how many people have a burning desire for western-style democracy and how many just want affordable food, a job and the ability to plan for the future.
The elephant in the room is population growth, unless that is addressed then prosperity will be damned difficult whatever political system they have.
And who's speaking out about that?
The Muslim world is at crossroads. There are too many forces trying to pull the same shirt.
The people don't hate the puppets, they hate HIM.
I think you'll note that it was the previous Labour Government who were very interventionalist. I put self determination at the top of the list of most cherished political values - therefore I think it is entirely up to the Egyptians and no one else how their country is run.
I think it tends to be that whoever comes into power democratically immediately forgets about democracy and establishes autocratic rule.
Egypt might be different though due to the sheer number of educated people.
Hyperbole.
The muslim world wants what everyone else wants - prosperity, safety etc. The problem is resources are limited so there needs to be some sort of allocation.
Democracy is not going to change this all of a sudden.
Western interventionism didn't start with the last Labour government. In fact your beloved Thatcher and her partner in crime Reagan were great allies and supporters of the autocratic leaders of the middle east including Mubarak, and to add to it they did their bit in crushing populist movements in South America and implementing puppet dictators.
The conservative/neoliberal policy has always been to support autocratic dictators to tame the volatile population so that the big corporations could have free access to exploit any potential resources and markets.
I hope so!
The biggest issues in Egypt is that of corruption which is ingrained in every facet of society. I fear any new government will, like you say be only different by name, and not deed. The Salafi movement gaining ground with the young educated classes is going to be another issue.
What would happen if Egypt, Israel border becomes an issue? At the moment it's kept secure by USA's funding.
I don't disagree. We all want prosperity and security.
The only way of having any chances of fair distribution is getting rid off monarchies and autocracies.
Yeah Israel will be very worried by any change, maybe justifiably in the short term. In the long term I tend to think being surrounded by autocracies with oppressed and deeply frustrated citizens can't be a good thing, especially as these regimes tend to use Israel as a bogeyman - if a sewer bursts in Damascus they finger Mossad. Notice the president of Yemen has asked the Qataris to stop Al Jazeera broadcasting the Egyptian protests as it's apparently helping Zionism!
Besides, I don't think this stasis is actually in Israel's interests, whatever the Likudniks think. At some point they are going to have to give up that land, and if they can't rely on Egyptian support for permanent inaction then so much the better.
But the pessimist in me thinks there's going to be a feck-off great regional war this year or next.
Anyway, this isn't about Israel. Even some of the most Israel-centric analysts can see that wanting the will of the people to be thwarted because of fears over Israel is the mindset of a right cnut.
Hmm we have democracy in the UK but the gap between rich and poor is ever widening.
People still cling to the romantic notion of nation states but the real power lies in the supra national organisations like the IMF, World Bank and MNC.
I suspect if there is a new government they will be offered loans and development loans in return for Austerity packages and liberalisation of domestic markets.
They will just swap one ruler for another.
The Atlantic that steaming pile of right wing poo!