American Cops Doing What They Do Best

Sky1981 said:
Two wrong doesn't make right, at the end of the day they are the one tasked with maintaining law and order. They are innocents until proven guilty, the same as the object they're trying to protect and serve. If people starts running from the cop, wouldn't they be morally wrong by being biased and racist towards the cop in the first place?

Again, separate issue from this incident.
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Probably. Then again, the balance of responsibility shifts towards the person with the gun.
 
If you don't have the guts to exercise your rights then you don't deserve them. You should be polite to cops and comply with any lawful request but that's it.
 
Americano said:
I agree with you and I am not trying to rationalize the ex-officer's behavior. From what I can see, as I have said multiple times, it appears that he shot the man illegally.



Raoul, my brother, I agree with you. There is nothing that you are saying that doesn't make complete sense. My position remains, that if I had kids, I would teach them to passively and politely comply with the police: do not resist arrest, do not run, do not talk back, do not fight. That man has a gun and he may decide to use it, even unfairly. Make the smart choice and STFU and get on the ground.

The video actually shows, not very clearly, and a witness describes, a physical confrontation and wrestling match on the ground where the man was subdued. I AM NOT SAYING HE DESERVES TO DIE BECAUSE OF THIS. I am saying that it is a huge mistake to lay your hands on a cop because rightly or wrongly, he has the ability to kill you. The chances that you may get killed start going up from zero when you decide to get out of the car, resist arrest, fight with a cop, and run. So why increase the odds of a potentially lethal confrontation? You can't control the actions of the police, but you can control your own choices. So make the right ones. That's what I mean by "intelligence test".
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The video - which is basically eye witness evidence for billions of people, as well as the eye witness on the ground (person who shot the video) will be more than enough to seal the deal here. If there is anything other than a murder conviction or if the guy somehow gets off on some legal technicality, the entire national will erupt in protest and there will be a hell of a lot more violence than in Ferguson.
 
Raoul said:
The video - which is basically eye witness evidence for billions of people, as well as the eye witness on the ground (person who shot the video) will be more than enough to seal the deal here. If there is anything other than a murder conviction or if the guy somehow gets off on some legal technicality, the entire national will erupt in protest and there will be a hell of a lot more violence than in Ferguson.
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I wonder how the police force will see this incident. Especially the South Carolina PD, how would they react?
 
Sky1981 said:
I wonder how the police force will see this incident. Especially the South Carolina PD, how would they react?
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I'd imagine a vast majority of cops will take this as a sign of "I better think twice when interacting with suspects or ordinary citizens, as anything I do can be recorded".
 
Blodssvik said:
Neither deserves the benefit of the doubt regarding what happened prior to the shooting.
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In the interest of justice, and as fairminded people, shouldn't we have the full picture, from the time he was pulled over until the shooting? It may not change anything, but I believe we are obligated to try to understand the full event and base our decisions and opinions on that.

Raoul said:
The video - which is basically eye witness evidence for billions of people, as well as the eye witness on the ground (person who shot the video) will be more than enough to seal the deal here.
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I hope everyone is willing to allow due process to run its course, and refrain from violent protest. I think change is on the horizon that will make things safer for everybody. If we approach that with unity and peace we have a chance of success.

The reason I came back to this discussion was the obvious injustice of this case. It's different to me than what happened with Michael Brown. I said earlier that I doubted any cop would coldly snuff out someone's life without a good reason, and I was wrong, because that is what it looks like to me on the cell phone video from North Charleston. I'm surprised and saddened by it, but I still don't see it as representative of the police as a whole.
 
Raoul said:
The video - which is basically eye witness evidence for billions of people, as well as the eye witness on the ground (person who shot the video) will be more than enough to seal the deal here. If there is anything other than a murder conviction or if the guy somehow gets off on some legal technicality, the entire national will erupt in protest and there will be a hell of a lot more violence than in Ferguson.
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Will the video be admissible? If he claims it is doctored chain of evidence and all that.
 
Americano said:
I think everyone should follow the law. Citizens should be compliant and not resist arrest and police should be judicious in their use of force. Those who don't follow those simple ideas deserve the appropriate punishment (which doesn't always happen) and risk their life and liberty. Precious things can be taken from you unfairly and instanteously in this life. I was surprised at the lack of indictment in Eric Garner's case.



I know that. But you don't always have your lawyer with you when attract the attention of the police to advocate for your rights. I am just telling you what I would teach my kids, and the example I would set, about dealing with the police. For best results, be nice. If after seeing what could happen to you if a situation escalates, and you still want to take your chaces with a cop, go ahead and antagonize them. It's your right to be a dumbass.
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Including the cops, coz if they do, there is no need of submissive bullshit.
 
Sky1981 said:
I wonder how the police force will see this incident. Especially the South Carolina PD, how would they react?
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Even the bad police have to distance themselves from this one. This is so cut and dried its impossible to argue. I thought they couldnt get worse after the Tamir Rice shooting but there they go again.

At this rate, they will all have mandatory body cameras in a hurry.
 
Grinner said:
If you don't have the guts to exercise your rights then you don't deserve them. You should be polite to cops and comply with any lawful request but that's it.
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Would you be ok with your children dying to try and prove some sort of point about civil rights?

In the current climate in America, especially for people of colour, it's ridiculous to imply that they would be cowards for being pragmatic. I know what I would be telling my kids and it definitely wouldn't be to make sure to push their civil rights to the limit when some dude with a gun is asking them to do something. That's not being a coward, that's just not being an idiot.

Of course, the problem here is that all these examples of cops killing defenceless people has whole communities scared. And that means that any confrontation with the police can be terrifying, which makes the primitive survival instinct kicks in. Fight or flight. Two actions which are both liable to get them shot.

Fear of potential harm aside, expecting a bloke who's just been fecking tasered to behave calmly and rationally is ridiculous.
 
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Pogue Mahone said:
Would you be ok with your children dying to try and prove some sort of point about civil rights?

In the current climate in America, especially for people of colour, it's ridiculous to imply that they would be cowards for being pragmatic. I know what I would be telling my kids and it definitely wouldn't be to make sure to push their civil rights to the limit when some dude with a gun is asking them to do something. That's not being a coward, that's just not being an idiot.

Of course, the problem here is that all these examples of cops killing defenceless people has whole communities scared. And that means that any confrontation with the police can be terrifying, which makes the primitive survival instinct kicks in. Fight or flight. Two actions which are both liable to get them shot.

Fear of potential harm aside, expecting a bloke who's just been fecking tasered to behave calmly and rationally is ridiculous.
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Is that poster coloured? I don't know that. If every citizen knew their rights and how to deal with the police then maybe the cops would get away with less of this shit.

Black people have been prepared to die for their civil rights in very recent history so I don't think it's unreasonable here either. It takes a lot of guts though, I'll grant you that.
 
Dash cam video just released. Looks like a routine traffic stop where the driver inexplicably ran away.
 
Grinner said:
Is that poster coloured? I don't know that. If every citizen knew their rights and how to deal with the police then maybe the cops would get away with less of this shit.

Black people have been prepared to die for their civil rights in very recent history so I don't think it's unreasonable here either. It takes a lot of guts though, I'll grant you that.
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When police are as trigger happy as they seem to be in the US then it's madness to wind them up, in any scenario. If someone feels strongly about civil rights there are plenty of ways to fight that cause without being confrontational at a stop and search. I certainly wouldn't call anyone - black or white - a coward for doing whatever they can to defuse the situation and advise their kids to do the same. Or course that's not to say they shouldn't subsequently take the cop's name and number then make sure they're accountable for their actions.
 
Grinner said:
Is that poster coloured? I don't know that. If every citizen knew their rights and how to deal with the police then maybe the cops would get away with less of this shit.

Black people have been prepared to die for their civil rights in very recent history so I don't think it's unreasonable here either. It takes a lot of guts though, I'll grant you that.
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Yea, I'm sure the kind of cop that shoots an unarmed man in the back then tries to plant evidence would love to hear a suspect tell him they know their rights.
 
Rado_N said:
Yea, I'm sure the kind of cop that shoots an unarmed man in the back then tries to plant evidence would love to hear a suspect tell him they know their rights.
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There's plenty of YT vids where cops back down when an informed citizen knows how to deal with cops. So long as you do it in a calm and controlled fashion then the chances of getting shot are miniscule. Even if you act like a turd the chances of getting shot are still miniscule.

You ask a cop what the probable cause is and they will probably make a mental note to do everything on the up and up going forwards. They'll probably detain you for half an hour and mess with you but you'll be keeping them honest.
 
If Republicans in Texas get their way there'll be fewer cases like this to worry about. They're trying to make recording police illegal. Because freedom.
 
barros said:
So anytime a cop shoots a black guy means is a bad cop? I didn't see the video and I didnt read about this case but if a guy fights with a cop then he gets what he deserves.
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Best not to comment if you haven't seen the video.
 
barros said:
So anytime a cop shoots a black guy means is a bad cop? I didn't see the video and I didnt read about this case but if a guy fights with a cop then he gets what he deserves.
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Are you a WUM?
 
A sheriff's spokesperson tells NBC two officers were treated for dehydration and one may have been kicked by the horse.
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I hope they got the two guys some water after that workout.

Wankers.
 
I literally don't know what to say. That San Bernardino incident is....feck I'm lost for words.

Are they always this blatant? Over here at least they wait until you're in the back of a riot van before the kick seven shades out of you.
 
Also worth mentioning that this all seems new and shocking to people whose only exposure to police brutality is when it's caught on video. Can you imagine how many more incidents there have been when there was no cameras around? If you're living in a deprived area there's a good chance you'll have seen (or even experienced) thuggery like that first hand. Which makes it completely understandable that people sometimes don't assume complying with police instructions is the best way to avoid getting hurt.
 
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