God, Shite Chicks is a terrible film.
"Blackface" Discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I learnt a lot about blackfacing. And definitely I will not do that as I understand till at which level can offend someone though if I would ever think to do it without knowing, I would never do it for racist purposes.
And then, just to stir more the shitpot
What do you think about this movie?
The whole movie is making fun and portraying white blonde women as stupid portrayed by black guys whiting up as a form of riciule
Yeah but that's a kin to Robert Downey Jr portraying a black bloke in Tropic Thunder.
Exactly.
Hilarious people are comparing blackface to white chicks. Should have a word with themselves.
Also don't buy into this "it's an American thing how was I to know?" Bullshit. I've walked the streets of Salford and seen golliwogs in the window I shit you not.
stir pot in motion 
Sorry guys.. will not do it again
Sorry guys.. will not do it again
It's a bit offtopic, but I thought it's worth sharing here. Did you know that the genes responsible for light hair, eye and skin colour originate specifically from Neanderthals? 40 thousand years ago Homo sapiens wandered from Africa to Europe, where they've met their nowadays quite 'infamous' cousins and miscegenated with them. Homo sapiens with clear cut lineage come directly from Dark Continent and are blackskinned. Therefore every non-black human has Neanderthal as his distant ancestor. That's not a small paradox to deal with for the white supremacists (or rather it would be if they weren't such boneheaded neantherthals).
I guess this also fits on this thread.
wow...Well, is grizman from dunkerque? would explain a couple of things.
Los of traditions to be reviewed in Europe
Los of traditions to be reviewed in Europe
I learnt a lot about blackfacing. And definitely I will not do that as I understand till at which level can offend someone though if I would ever think to do it without knowing, I would never do it for racist purposes.
And then, just to stir more the shitpot
What do you think about this movie?
The whole movie is making fun and portraying white blonde women as stupid portrayed by black guys whiting up as a form of riciule
It was certainly sexist and blondist but most of all it was very unfunny. Triple fail.
I must confess I laughed quite a bit. I have a weakness for Terry Crews.
Princess Michael of Kent is in the news for all the wrong reasons (again):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42462724
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42462724
Concerning the first tweet, that's not really true. She has been fired due to political cowardice, the council she was part of has been created a dozen of days ago, her numerous causes are well known, but they still gave her a position now the problem is that this council had nothing to do with that, it was about numeric and new technology and she created a polemic that took said council with her. They thought that by firing her, they would salvage the council but it failed because all members resigned at the exception of one.
It's a bizarre looking thing to wear even before you get to the issue of whether it is racially dubious or not.Princess Michael of Kent is in the news for all the wrong reasons (again):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42462724
Princess Michael of Kent is in the news for all the wrong reasons (again):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42462724
Nice of them to make sure we knew her father was a Nazi. Fuel to the fire.
Now how many people were actually upset by this? Is it really racist of her or just insensitive/ignorant of it's effect?
Before seeing that article if I had seen that pin I would have had no idea what it was. To me it just would have been a piece of jewelry of some blue guy.
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Yeah, we all know who her father was, at least all of the older generation and it means nothing, no-one can be held to blame or criticised for their parents. The thing is, she's either insensitive or she did it deliberately. She's either ignorant of what her brooch represented or a purposeful racist. She's not a stupid lady, she's married to the thick one in that partnership. Who knows? It isn't like they're all in each other's pockets anyway, doubt Meghan will bump into her more than once a year if that.
She's long been an incredibly pretentious gonk & a waste of ermine. Even the Queen thinks Princess Michael is 'too grand for the rest of us.'
Guardian said:
The half-caste defence is headscratchingly odd- she's pretty darn Aryan-looking.
Yeah not sure why she thought that would help
I think it definitely is an "American" thing, but it isn't exclusively American. The awareness of it in the US is much higher than anywhere else, and for pretty obvious reasons. The US took its sweet time in abolishing slavery. After which it institutionalized a form of race based classism that was near enough to slavery, that didn't vanish legally until the 60's. Even today there are massive racism problem in the US, on both sides, whites hating blacks and blacks hating whites. So, any sort of issue that can inflame those passions is understood pretty well in the US. Comparatively, the US to Europe and even Canada, there is no comparison. Things change when you get into Eastern Europe of course.
Why is a neanderthal mix a bad thing? Crossbreeding between species is something that has shaped human evolution and contributed to our success. You embrace the stereotype of stupid neanderthals and go further by saying whites = part neanderthals = stupid. That's extremely racist, but I guess it's fine because it's against white people.
i struggle to understand how anyone in europe or outside the states generally don't understand or have heard of the historical context of blackface. i mean, we have had the internet for like 20 years. there's no excuse, we don't live on cultural islands anymore.
I think you are just reading too much into it. The irony there is Nazis/white supremacists etc... insist on the purity of the bloodlines while speaking strictly from a scientific viewpoint, black people are 'purer' than the rest. It shouldn't matter unless you buy into pseudoscience eugenics, which they do.
I repeat, golliwogs....in Salford. I'd hazard a guess that those who "didn't know" about blackface don't know about golliwogs either. Can't hide behind "it's an American thing" for that though.
This. Though educational system does absolutely nothing to teach people about different cultures and ethnic minorities in many parts of the UK.
I was born 1981, lived in India till 2005. Moved to US in 2005 and have been living in US ever since. I had no idea of blackface and I was considered 'above average' in world history compared to the general population. The first I heard was in a thread in RedCafe. I think you are being a tad harsh here.
I hadn't heard about it other than old Al Jolson references from the 1920s.
I lived in Indonesia my whole life, studied in UK in 2004. I got a good exposure of information due to American shows on television and I was privilege enough to have internet in late 1990s when many of my friends do not.
The first time I heard about blackface is when I read an article about Downey part in Tropic Thunder. You wont know about blackface unless there's a specific event about it, or you studied American history.
I later found that many of the comics I read as a kid have many racist connotations. From Carl Barks Ducks comics, to Tintin comics.
I've had access to international TV shows but mainly British ones. I grew up on British music and I had better access to international content. I practically gave up watching Indian movies from the time I was 10 because of my craze with American movies. I created my first email in 99 and had regular internet access through dial-up internet starting 2000.
I wasn't the most knowledgeable by any means for sure and I had studied general American history covering colonies, civil war, displacement of native Americans, and the world wars and yet had no knowledge of Black facing. You are right, unless you know a specific incident about blackfacing, it's quite normal for you to not know about it.
I do think you may have a point there. There seems to be a consensus there that every white person benefits from being white, more or less naturally but definitely more than a black person. I do not see the evidence for that.
I agree that on average white people are privileged, but there can be some cases where white privilege does not add up to being actually beneficial for a certain person. This may be due to specific individual circumstances. Therefore, I can understand that there are some white folks out there who don't feel privileged. And I think people need to recognize that and not always assume that where is a white person there is a white privilege.
It was no part of education. I agree that it is a thing that you may have come across in different movies or stories, but it's certainly not salient enough for normal european folks to think too much about it. It requires some cognitive elaboration to understand the matter.
Consequently, blackfacing is not a big issue in Germany, because painting your face black is a common thing for example during carnival. There have been some exceptions though when a group of blackfaced slaves were not allowed to participate. There have also been some reports and articles in the media about it. But if you are going as white person with a black face to a carnival party I would guess that almost no one will take exception to it.
Maybe a parallel discussion is about how good and noble forces are most always depicted as 'white and fair' and evil forces are dark and grotesque. In my local village festival of Easter, normally the devil characters have their faces painted black as an extension of Dark side vs light side (good)
I've never heard of the term golliwog. I'd bet that 99.99999% of people who live anywhere but the UK have no fecking idea what that is. I've spent 9 years studying history at a post secondary level, including 2 years devoted to racism in American history and I've never heard of golliwog, so if I haven't heard about it with a higher education in history, drawing the parallel isn't exactly helping your cause, since blackface is something that is far more recognizable from just a linguistic point of view, let alone a contextual one. Lot of people don't know what blackface is, or understand the contextual reasons why it is offensive.
Identifying a "golliwog" as offensive would require someone to actually see what it is, rather than say "golliwogs...in Salford". Without prior knowledge of what golliwog is, if someone said "hey let's go get a golliwog in Salford" to me, I'm going to think *Jesus fecking christ what in the feck is wrong with Brits and their incomprehensible slang, mother feckers invented the language and they can't even speak it*, and then I'm going to say "what is that, fish and chips?"
I think this has less to do with light skin versus black skin, and more to do with light, versus dark. Literally. Night time is scary. Darkness hides things. It's a primordial thing that goes back to the neolithic period where people literally had to huddle in caves and around fires because the monsters that ate them tended to come out at night. If anything skin color is a coincidence. If Europeans were black, and Africans were white, the trope would be the same, white hats vs black hats, not because of skin, but because of light versus dark, light (the sun) is life, darkness (the absence of light) is death.
No, I get that point. My local village is in Southern India where we do not see any other skin color. I'm pretty sure black painting the devils literally have to do with dark vs light as you said and I've suggested that very fact in my post. I can't be 100% sure about the portrayal in movies however.
Can someone summarize this thread?
They were very popular toys when I was a kid in the 60s. I had one, I loved it, I didn't ever think it represented a human being.
The word 'context' seems to be last in CE forum.
Yeah, some people over reacting to Griezmann being a bit silly and going in fancy dress as a Harlem Globetrotter.
Princess Michael of Kent is in the news for all the wrong reasons (again):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42462724
It's definitely a 'racial comment', she knew the significance of the broach, the fact a mixed race person was marrying into her family and thought she'd wear it. What the comment is only she knows, I'd guess at a 'inside joke' but it maybe she thought it'd simply appropriate. At it's worst it maybe 'let me remind you of your place'.
It's not 'ignorant', she knew what it was. I'm not particularly bothered by it, but it's more the sub-text of whatever shes trying to say.
Maybe, but equally she may have just put that jacket on which could have already had the broach on it and didn't think anything of it. Bit of a stretch to assume she's trying 'keep Meghan in her place'. Assuming they marry, Meghan will surely massively outrank her.