Bundesliga 2015/2016

Balu said:
Yeah, it's totally insane and silly. Everything but the treble seems to be a failure for Guardiola, what a load of nonsense.



Why would you think it's boring if we turn around games in which we concede first? That certainly never gets old. It's nice that we don't dominate easily from start to finish in all games. I'd understand it if someone asked if it gets boring to annihilate Hamburg every year, but nope, that also never gets old :D.
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That's not it, but your team was so overwhelmingly dominant and the other team was not really aggressively trying to prevent the seemingly inevitable from happening. Even the commentator jokingly said "Unbelievable, the ball is in Bayern's half!". van Gaal for example has a possession-based approach as well, but the mid-table and lower-table teams are really pressuring us when we're in their half, which didn't seem to be the case with Augsburg and Hoffenheim. Granted, your team is ahead of ours in terms of cohesiveness and having adapted to Guardiola's game plan, but still, it never seems like one of the mid-table or lower-table teams is an actual threat to you.
 
Wade3 said:
That's not it, but your team was so overwhelmingly dominant and the other team was not really aggressively trying to prevent the seemingly inevitable from happening. Even the commentator jokingly said "Unbelievable, the ball is in Bayern's half!". van Gaal for example has a possession-based approach as well, but the mid-table and lower-table teams are really pressuring us when we're in their half, which didn't seem to be the case with Augsburg and Hoffenheim. Granted, your team is ahead of ours in terms of cohesiveness and having adapted to Guardiola's game plan, but still, it never seems like one of the mid-table or lower-table teams is an actual threat to you.
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It's odd that you pick examples in which we conceded first as games in which we were so overwhelmingly dominant and that the other team was not really agressively trying to prevent losing. All those teams played incredibly well against us in my opinion. Augsburg were fighting brilliantly and were robbed by an awful referee decision for example. But we can create an insane amount of pressure towards the end of the match, when the opponent is getting more and more tired after chasing shadows for so long, so it's not surprising that we look crazy dominant in the last 30 minutes when we still have to score to win.

There's always a bit of hindsight in these comments in my opinion. Without the shit penalty call, we wouldn't have won against Augsburg and many people would have talked about how bravely Augsburg fought till the end.

I also don't think you can throw all possession teams into the same pot. There are some significant differences between van Gaal's 'philosophy' and Guardiola's tactics. United has a long way to go to play the way we do and changing the manager might be a necessary step on the way.
 
Wade3 said:
That's not it, but your team was so overwhelmingly dominant and the other team was not really aggressively trying to prevent the seemingly inevitable from happening. Even the commentator jokingly said "Unbelievable, the ball is in Bayern's half!". van Gaal for example has a possession-based approach as well, but the mid-table and lower-table teams are really pressuring us when we're in their half, which didn't seem to be the case with Augsburg and Hoffenheim. Granted, your team is ahead of ours in terms of cohesiveness and having adapted to Guardiola's game plan, but still, it never seems like one of the mid-table or lower-table teams is an actual threat to you.
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It wasn't any different in van Gaal's second season at Bayern - from what I remember once teams realized the weaknesses of his side a lot of them exploited them methodically. But with all due respect: Bayern are way ahead of United atm, it's only natural that lower teams are a lot more intimidated by Bayern, because unlike United they don't seem beatable and barely reveal any weaknesses.

Wade3 said:
I'm looking forward to it, but hope Bayern wins comfortably. I'm tired of all the people complaining about Guardiola. Bayern has flat out dominated the Bundesliga since he's taken over, always reached the semi-final of the CL and from there on, it's minor details that decide the games away and made it to the DFB cup final twice IIRC? And then you have someone like Hamann come out and say he grades Guardiola's performance a 5 out of 10 because he hasn't won the CL yet.
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I can't recall anything of depth Hamann ever said as a pundit. I always get the impression that he is looking for the shallow narratives, so many people will agree with him.
On the other hand I think Pep's tenure at Bayern is difficult to judge. He's certainly doing well, but him dominating the shit out of domestic football has to be expected with how much Bayern are spending and then there were the very disappointing CL losses...
 
I can't believe Heldt is still talking about the past transfer window. So now he cries that Schalke couldn't buy Shaqiri and Inler, because they didn't sell Draxler early in the window? What an idiot. He's lucky that he didn't waste again a lot of money on two players that aren't good enough to bring the club forward and playing both regularly would have hurt the development of Meyer, Sane and Goretzka. Schalke really should fire him as soon as possible.

The line-ups:
Stuttgart: 22 Tyton – 2 Insua, 4 Sunjic, 5 Baumgartl, 16 Klein, 18 Kostic, 19 Werner, 20 Gentner, 26 Serey Dié, 33 Ginczek, 44 Maxim

Schalke: Fährmann - Aogo, Neustädter, Matip, Caicara - Meyer, Goretzka, Geis, Sane - Di Santo, Huntelaar
 
Balu said:
I can't believe Heldt is still talking about the past transfer window. So now he cries that Schalke couldn't buy Shaqiri and Inler, because they didn't sell Draxler early in the window? What an idiot. He's lucky that he didn't waste again a lot of money on two players that aren't good enough to bring the club forward and playing both regularly would have hurt the development of Meyer, Sane and Goretzka. Schalke really should fire him as soon as possible.
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Heldt is just quality entertainment :lol:
Unfortunately his contract is expiring after this season, but with Schalke there is always hope.


There must be some deeper upside I'm not getting at all about fielding di Santo and Huntelaar together. :wenger:
 
How is Stuttgart not leading by several goals yet? :rolleyes:

If anyone is thinking about tuning in: do it! Non stop action, barely any midfield :lol:
 
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BVB: Bürki, Ginter, Sokratis, Hummels, Schmelzer, Weigl, Gündogan, Hofmann, Kagawa, Mkhitaryan, Aubameyang
subs: Weidenfeller, Piszczek, Park, Castro, Reus, Ramos, Januzaj

Reus not fit to start yet? Hofmann starts for him, not Januzaj.
 
Sane :drool:

Heldt would have loved to spend a lot of money on Shaqiri to keep Sane out of the team though, excellent director of football.
 
Balu said:
Sane :drool:

Heldt would have loved to spend a lot of money on Shaqiri to keep Sane out of the team though, excellent director of football.
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He's been crap today but that was a well worked goal. He needs space to play his game.
 
gofelx said:
He's been crap today but that was a well worked goal. He needs space to play his game.
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He's 19 and struggled for 45 minutes, but just scored the first goal in the game.
 
Balu said:
Sane :drool:

Heldt would have loved to spend a lot of money on Shaqiri to keep Sane out of the team though, excellent director of football.
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To be fair Sane has been utter shit today and that counter attack showed how bad Stuttgart's defense really is. He seems talented, but nowhere near ready for a starting spot on an ambitious team.

Balu said:
BVB: Bürki, Ginter, Sokratis, Hummels, Schmelzer, Weigl, Gündogan, Hofmann, Kagawa, Mkhitaryan, Aubameyang
subs: Weidenfeller, Piszczek, Park, Castro, Reus, Ramos, Januzaj

Reus not fit to start yet? Hofmann starts for him, not Januzaj.
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Apparently Reus trained with the team since Friday. Hofmann getting picked ahead of Januzaj isn't surprising given Januzaj's tactical deficits and the punishing nature of Leverkusen's style.
 
Leverkusen:
Leno - Wendell, Papa, Tah, Donati, Kramer, Kampl, Calhanoglu, Bellarabi, Kießling, Chicharito

Not sure, how they'll line-up with that. 442-ish with Calhanoglu out wide? Or 433 with Chicharito as an inside left similar to how Son played before?
 
do.ob said:
To be fair Sane has been utter shit today and that counter attack showed how bad Stuttgart's defense really is. He seems talented, but nowhere near ready for a starting spot on an ambitious team.
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Give him 10-15 games in a row and he'll be ready. He's quality.
 
Balu said:
Leverkusen:
Leno - Wendell, Papa, Tah, Donati, Kramer, Kampl, Calhanoglu, Bellarabi, Kießling, Chicharito

Not sure, how they'll line-up with that. 442-ish with Calhanoglu out wide? Or 433 with Chicharito as an inside left similar to how Son played before?
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Probably some asymmetrical 433? Dortmund love to overload the half spaces so a 3 man midfield makes sense. Chicharito could play a Ronaldo-ish role to bind Ginter or exploit his high positioning with his pace.

Balu said:
Give him 10-15 games in a row and he'll be ready. He's quality.
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That wouldn't surprise me, but at the same time there isn't really that much certainty with youngsters and 10-15 games in a row might cost Schalke crucial points in the table.
 
PedroMendez said:
What is the worst start any Bundesliga team ever had?
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6 losses Fortuna Düsseldorf iirc.

Balu said:
He's 19 and struggled for 45 minutes, but just scored the first goal in the game.
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How does his age matter here? He's currently a starter and his performance was unacceptable up until that point. Of course he has bags of talent but he's not prone to criticism.
 
gofelx said:
How does his age matter here? He's currently a starter and his performance was unacceptable up until that point. Of course he has bags of talent but he's not prone to criticism.
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Well, yeah but my point was that it's a good decision in the longterm to give him playing time instead of buying someone like Shaqiri for big money who had his fair share of equally shit games. Obviously Sane was incredibly bad in the first half, no doubt about that.
 
Balu said:
Well, yeah but my point was that it's a good decision in the longterm to give him playing time instead of buying someone like Shaqiri for big money who had his fair share of equally shit games. Obviously Sane was incredibly bad in the first half, no doubt about that.
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I don't think it's that easy. If they miss the EL/CL because they are too weak in the short term then the damage caused by that could easily balance out the gain they get from letting Sane play more.

Stuttgart are cutting through Schalke's defense at will now... It was probably harder to keep missing all those chances than to score one.
 
do.ob said:
I don't think it's that easy. If they miss the EL/CL because they are too weak in the short term then the damage caused by that could easily balance out the gain they get from letting Sane play more.
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They won't make CL this season anyway, in my opinion. Bayern, Wolfsburg & Dortmund are simply stronger and should perform consistently without much problems. Schalke need to be surprisingly great and hope that Leverkusen fecks up to finish 4th and it's not likely. Schalke's better off developing the young core of players and benefit the following seasons than spending big money on players that increase their chances to finish 4th marginally.
 
do.ob said:
Stuttgart are cutting through Schalke's defense at will now... It was probably harder to keep missing all those chances than to score one.
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It really should have finished something like 4:2 for Stuttgart :lol:. Schalke should have scored that last chance as well.

And another one for Stuttgart :lol:.
 
I'm so happy we already played against Stuttgart. All they need is one good result and they will be back to winning ways. In contrast to Gladbach you can actually see a team playing football here.
 
Balu said:
They won't make CL this season anyway, in my opinion. Bayern, Wolfsburg & Dortmund are simply stronger and should perform consistently without much problems. Schalke need to be surprisingly great and hope that Leverkusen fecks up to finish 4th and it's not likely. Schalke's better off developing the young core of players and benefit the following seasons than spending big money on players that increase their chances to finish 4th marginally.
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Yes it seems unlikely, but Bundesliga's top teams are known to be inconsistent and Leverkusen right now have 1 point before their match in Dortmund. And it's not just about reaching the CL, they probably have to show some ambition if they want to attract players and keep the ones they already got. Höwedes was already publicly toying with the idea of leaving, Matip's contract is running out, that's two defensive key players.

You also have to wonder about their finances, they still have a lot of debt and their afaik their fan bond will be due in the near future.

gofelx said:
I'm so happy we already played against Stuttgart. All they need is one good result and they will be back to winning ways. In contrast to Gladbach you can actually see a team playing football here.
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Yeah, Stuttgart don't look like a team that lost every single game at all. On the other hand their defending seems really suicidal, especially in Bundesliga where teams love to work the transitions.
 
do.ob said:
You also have to wonder about their finances, they still have a lot of debt and their afaik their fan bond will be due in the near future.
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Another reason to trust their youth academy over Heldt's choices in the transfer market ;).
 
gofelx said:
I'm so happy we already played against Stuttgart. All they need is one good result and they will be back to winning ways. In contrast to Gladbach you can actually see a team playing football here.
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The problem is that Gladbach has actually quality in the side and will improve. Stuttgart on the other hand might start getting frustrated and lose confidence, then they're truely fecked.

Stuttgart play Hannover, Gladbach, Hoffenheim and Ingolstadt in the next 4 games. They need at least 3 good results from those 4 games or they'll in deep deep trouble. They still have to play all the top teams if I'm not mistaken and they won't get good results against Dortmund, Bayern, Wolfsburg and Leverkusen with that defense. The fixtures towards the end of the year are really tough for them.
 
Schalke are the kings of winning unconvincingly. Stuttgart on the ground despite actually playing decent football in this season.
 
Balu said:
The problem is that Gladbach has actually quality in the side and will improve. Stuttgart on the other hand might start getting frustrated and lose confidence, then they're truely fecked.

Stuttgart play Hannover, Gladbach, Hoffenheim and Ingolstadt in the next 4 games. They need at least 3 good results from those 4 games or they'll in deep deep trouble. They still have to play all the top teams if I'm not mistaken and they won't get good results against Dortmund, Bayern, Wolfsburg and Leverkusen with that defense. The fixtures towards the end of the year are really tough for them.
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I'm really not that convinced with this Gladbach team unfortunately. On top of losing important players they're also getting no luck with injuries anymore. When I look at the lineups in the last few weeks there are too many young and inexperienced players on the pitch who have to carry way too much responsibility. Schulz, Christensen, Korb etc. are not players you want in your backline.
Players who were overperforming in a well organized team like Jantschke and Brouwers are really getting exposed right now.
Drmic is performing just like he did in Leverkusen, no connection to the rest of the team at all.
Of course it's first and foremost a confidence-issue but I really haven't seen any signs of improvement so far.
Hopefully they get back on track though.
 
Leverkusen's line-up is a bit gung-ho, isn't it? Kramer - Kampl as a 2 man midfield? Against Dortmund? I guess if they defend disciplined in a 442 shape, it could work, but surely they go for it with their usual pressing game?

Should be a hell of a game, wouldn't be surprised to see something like 5-3 as a result.
 
Game commentated by Reif and refereed by Ayketin.

Oh boy.....
 
Leverkusen's pressing seems just as suicidal as Stuttgart's.. 3 people attacking Hummels during build up :eek:
 
My god, Schmidt´s pressing is truly insane. More intense and riskier than ours has ever been.
 
Tuchel (I think) just screamed "reiß Dich jetzt zusammen", translating to "get your shit together". I wonder who he was furious at so early.
 
Mkhitaryan on fire again.

Dortmund seem to seize control now, I think Leverkusen might be forced into a less agressive approach soon.
 
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