Chelsea won there too.
Tottenham Hotspur vs. Manchester United
- Thread starter nemanja15
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Chelsea won there too.
Jizz-worthy lineup.
And we'd still have Hernandez, Anderson, Welbeck, Valencia etc on the bench!
Jizzworthy indeed!
If this XI can't beat Spurs -- snow or no snow, home or away -- we haven't got a prayer of beating Real Madrid.
well, in all fairness no team plays the same every game so that's a silly suggestion.
However I do agree with you that we should definitely win this game.
I've wanted to see Rooney, RvP, Nani and Kagawa with Carrick & Cleverley behind them for a long long time, not to mention just seeing Vidič's name in the line-up makes me feel that much more optimistic about the whole thing.
It's not silly at all. If indeed our best XI, which this may well be, can't beat a team which is significantly inferior to another team, it's hard to imagine how we could beat that other team. Dodgy ref calls, deflections, crazy own goals perhaps would do the trick. But if we get beaten honestly (a deserved result) by Spurs, then we'll have to dig very deep to find the formula (or get really, really lucky) to beat Real, a club which I think we would all agree would destroy Spurs.
But I'm feeling pretty good going into WHL.
I think Valencia will start instead of Nani.
Reckon it'll be young and kagawa/valencia, will need Young's work rate, and would expect him to play, would be good to see kagawa on the other side. Can't see Nani starting this one.
Pretty sure Young's out for at least a week or so.
He will. Nani will be on the bench tomorrow.
Holy Mother of God! Over the last hour there was a police standoff and a suicide right next door to me.
Taser action. Self-stabbing. Death. Cops everywhere.
Taser action. Self-stabbing. Death. Cops everywhere.
Yep, Valencia will be extremely useful in this game, more for his defensive work on Bale than any of his attacking work. He's becoming a Park type, he will play in the big games away from home because he can be trusted to carry out a job defensively.
One game would hardly indicate incapability of beating a team, some days some guys have bad days, sometimes matchups should come into consideration, then also like you mentioned throw in a couple of dodgy calls, offides/penalties, etc. all of these things can happen at any point.
I'm hardly dissagreeing with you on the fact that we should beat Spurs or that Real is a highly superior team, I'm just trying to make my point by saying you can't base a team's capability from 1 game. If that were to be the case, then consider how many points Real has dropped to teams in La Liga that aren't nearly as highly regarded as United. Does that make their team incapable of beating United? I don't think so.
I see your point, which has great merit. I suppose all I'm saying if that we get beaten in a fully deserving manner without being subject to injuries and the like, it is difficult to see how we could beat a significantly better team without the benefit of luck our way. And because Spurs beat us before, we know all about them.
I'm gonna have to sign off for the day. I got a good look at everything that happened right next to my driveway. Nasty business.
Rafael and Valencia on the right is the best bet to deal to both deal with Bale and push him back into defending on that side too.
Cleverley is a no brainer to provide dynamism in midfield.
Left is the debate, Kagawa, Nani? Does Lennon need a bit of double teaming to help Evra? Neither of those 2 are much good defending. Might it be Rooney over there?
Cleverley is a no brainer to provide dynamism in midfield.
Left is the debate, Kagawa, Nani? Does Lennon need a bit of double teaming to help Evra? Neither of those 2 are much good defending. Might it be Rooney over there?
Kagawa had a great second half against Spurs at Old Trafford, so I wouldn't mind him starting this at all.
I'd rather have Nani on the right. He does a fair bit of defending and, more importantly, leaving a full-back alone to deal with him is a recipe for disaster (which isn't true of Valencia at the moment). Either Bale will have to drop back a lot, or we'll get loads of joy down that wing. I'm confident that Rafael can handle Bale, provided someone with a bit of pace like Jones or Smalling is next to him (not Ferdinand).
So for me, it's still this:
De Gea
Rafael Jones Vidic Evra
Carrick Cleverley
Nani Rooney Kagawa
RVP
Rafael Jones Vidic Evra
Carrick Cleverley
Nani Rooney Kagawa
RVP
With Anderson to come on for Nani or Kagawa if they're underperforming or get tired.
really a massive game. If we can get through with a win, City really will be worried.
Reckon it will be the following:
Dea Gea
Rafael
Evra
Evans/Vidic
Rio
Valencia
Carrick
Cleverley
Nani
Rooney
RVP
I think Nani will play over Kagawa tomorrow. Not sure on the centre back pairing due to rumours over Evans being injured.
Dea Gea
Rafael
Evra
Evans/Vidic
Rio
Valencia
Carrick
Cleverley
Nani
Rooney
RVP
I think Nani will play over Kagawa tomorrow. Not sure on the centre back pairing due to rumours over Evans being injured.
Not Rio surely? His lack of pace is a serious weakness against Bale, who looked much better than he should have as a result in the reverse fixture.
Rio's played very well in every big game this season and Bale's hardly the only pace merchant in the league. If Evans is injured, then he is sure to play over Smalling or Jones and even if Evans is fit, he may well start over Vidic in any event.
Nonetheless, Rio undeniably got completely turned over by Bale in the reverse fixture. Jones, on the other hand, has done fantastically against Bale in the past for us, and has just put in a brilliant performance against West Ham. I reckon he deserves a shot.
I don't think there's any chance of Kagawa starting unless Rooney isn't match fit.
United's defeat against Spurs has far more to do with an extremely bad first half performance from the team and bad team selection by Fergie than anything to do with Rio. Rio's played in all of the big games this season and has had to deal with plenty of players with pace and trickery. He's more than capable and is far higher up the pecking order than Jones.
I'd hardly count Jones's performance at O.T. last season against Bale as a fantastic display. He had a good game against an injury ravaged Spurs side but that game was very open and we could have conceded until Welbeck scored.
Jones is currently far more likely to cost United a goal than Rio at centre back as his run in the side last season showed. He's not starting at centre back tomorrow unless there is a big injury crisis at centre back. He's probably 5th in the pecking order for the position.
None of which changes the fact that several times in Rio's last game against Spurs, Bale ran right past him as if he wasn't there, whilst in Jones' last game against Spurs, he kept Bale reasonably quiet. Of particular note were the several instances in which he was able to catch up with and dispossess Bale.
Your statements about those two games overall are probably right, but with regard to Jones' and Ferdinand's performances, that's irrelevant. I'm talking about how the two defenders handles specific incidents in those games, and why those incidents came about ('bad selection by Fergie', 'injury crisis for Spurs' or whatever) doesn't matter.
Besides, Jones is just one of the options. Evans and Smalling both have the pace to deal with Bale better than Ferdinand. Your idea of a 'pecking order' is all very nice, but not really how team selection works - you pick the player who is best suited to the requirements of the game. And whatever you think about the match, Ferdinand has given us good evidence that he is not suited to defending against Bale.
Rio might be ahead of Evans, Smalling and Jones at the moment (not ahead of Evans, for me, but that's an argument for another time), but not by enough that we can just ignore that their biggest threat, Bale's pace, thrives on Ferdinand's biggest weakness. Fergie has always tailored his line-up to the specific threats of the opposition, and I hope he does so again.
What about on the left wing?
Caf's obsession with stopping Bale and Lennon is ridiculous, like they are Ronaldo and Messi and we need just to focus on them, and not on our attacking. 
btw, I would like to see this:
No, he's not.
btw, I would like to see this:
de Gea
Rafael Rio Evans Evra
Carrick Cleverley
Nani Welbeck Kagawa
van Persie
Rafael Rio Evans Evra
Carrick Cleverley
Nani Welbeck Kagawa
van Persie
No, he's not.
Who's obsessed?
Welbeck over Rooney? Also, if you do go with that you should surely swap Welbeck and Kagawa? The former was very good in a wide forward role against Liverpool, whereas the latter has looked uncomfortable when playing wide, and dangerous when playing centrally.
Read couple of previous posts and you'll see.
Welbeck over Rooney yes, he was great against Liverpool, so I don't see problem seeing him starting again. Rooney might start instead of Kagawa though, but I would like to see Kagawa playing getting more games in a row.
And Welbeck didn't play wide forward against Liverpool, he played behind the striker, or in free role, while Kagawa played wide left.
Why exactly is Nani starting in so many teams?
He has what, 70 minutes of rather mediocre football to his name in 3 months?
I hope that he'll get back to the player he was a year or two ago during the remainder of the season however he is not close to that right now.
He has what, 70 minutes of rather mediocre football to his name in 3 months?
I hope that he'll get back to the player he was a year or two ago during the remainder of the season however he is not close to that right now.
Ashley Young or Nani.
Because he is a class player, has the pace which we will need against Tottenham and he was the only United player in the reverse fixture who got at them and worried them. Over the last few seasons Spurs have had a tough time coping with Nani. I think Nani likes playing them for some reason.
Yeah, I don't know how everybody is ignoring our best player this season, Valencia.
Young is injured.
Young is out injured, and Nani showed more promise in those 70 minutes than Valencia has in his last 7 games. So it's not unreasonable that some people want him to start this one.
Valencia has right wing sewn down. He's good going back and will allow us to double up on Bale who is their main threat by some distance.
Bang on, as usual.
Also i'm not 100% sure Young will definitely be out of this one. I think he'll at least make the bench in spite of what Fergie says.
DDG
Rafael Rio Vidic Evra
Valencia Carrick Cleverley Nani
Rooney RVP
Think we will edge a tight game 2-1
Rafael Rio Vidic Evra
Valencia Carrick Cleverley Nani
Rooney RVP
Think we will edge a tight game 2-1
We need to think about how to handle Bale, but only to a certain point. Valencia has been very poor offensively recently. Nani showed signs of doing very well offensively. That has to be the main concern for a winger, so Nani should get the nod, provided his match-fitness is up to scratch.
Either of them should contribute enough defensively to help contain Bale. The days of Nani not doing his job off the ball are long gone. And after all, we'll presumably be starting Rafael this time, and we all know he has a special place in his pocket for Gareth.
Bottom line is, I'd much rather see Kagawa and Nani start this and Valencia left out, despite his defensive work rate. Valencia doesn't warrant a start IMO. Especially not in a game this important.
Besides, Nani and Kagawa tend to work well together.
Besides, Nani and Kagawa tend to work well together.