SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

So just seen the latest figures.

Can anyone explain why the North West has moved to tier 4 when everything is essentially steady as it has been?
 
Pexbo said:
We live in a tiny one bed flat so it just wouldn’t work. We’re currently purchasing a two bed house but realistically its going to be months before the chain completes, probably longer now. If that was to go through it would solve the issue but until then it’s a shitter.
Click to expand...

Oh that really sucks, has she absolutely got to go back or would her work be lenient?
 
Kag said:
Detailing the closure of certain primary schools in parliament and not having the list ready to release to the public (and the bloody schools themselves!) is peak Gavin Williamson.
Click to expand...

I thought that was just me not being able to find the lists. I should never doubt myself in comparison to Gavin Williamson!
 
TheReligion said:
Although hospital admissions haven't increased? So are we saying people are staying in hospital longer? If so where's these figures?
Click to expand...
This is my problem with the hospital capacity argument in relation to the North West going into tier 4. There are no figures available.

Would be happy if someone can correct me and share hospital capacity by UK region.
 
Cascarino said:
I didn’t say they wished them love, I said they didn’t wish death on her family, which is what you claimed. This is like the third time I’ve had to explain this to you ye damn tool.

Anyway, let’s move on. Wishing you love, prosperity and a long life :)
Click to expand...

Cheers, you too. Wish you all the best to you and the people close to you :)
 
United Hobbit said:
Feel for the teachers etc, surely the list should go live as the announcement is made, they need to know if they're going live lessons or not- even if it was tier 4= virtual lessons only, bar vulnerable children/ exam years- you'd think schools would have identified those pupils who's parents don't have access to equipment for virtual learning so those children can either be leant equipment, or included in the vulnerable group in schools

Some tier 4 having live lessons, others being virtual is clear as mud...
Click to expand...

Of course it should have been. But this is Gavin Williamson and the DfE we’re talking about.

There are still hundreds of secondary schools all over the country that haven’t received the laptops they were promised for their pupils. All the while, the disadvantaged gap just gets bigger and bigger.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
This is my problem with the hospital capacity argument in relation to the North West going into tier 4. There are no figures available.

Would be happy if someone can correct me and share hospital capacity by UK region.
Click to expand...

Well hospital admissions haven't increased in the NW and are still below the baseline.

Looking at the figures we've just been presented with I can see zero justification for placing the region in to 4. You're essentially saying the region is in the same difficulty as the South and South East when it's clearly not.

What's the point with the system when it doesn't differentiate.
 
30d94832-19f0-4124-8074-a44d2bb18224.png


116cd2e7-b21f-4ee8-b70b-f9e1ecf3a087.png
 
Let's be honest though there was no way London would stay in 4 and the rest of the country remain in less restrictive measures. They simply wouldn't have it.
 
TheReligion said:
Well hospital admissions haven't increased in the NW and are still below the baseline.

Looking at the figures we've just been presented with I can see zero justification for placing the region in to 4. You're essentially saying the region is in the same difficulty as the South and South East when it's clearly not.

What's the point with the system when it doesn't differentiate.
Click to expand...

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ter-news/non-urgent-care-still-pause-19539079 - they're reporting rises here.

Case rates aren't declining, they're increasing as a total. It would be foolish to keep Greater Manchester in Tier 3. Admission data for last week is patchy at best due to Christmas reporting.
 
F-Red said:
https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ter-news/non-urgent-care-still-pause-19539079 - they're reporting rises here.

Case rates aren't declining, they're increasing as a total. It would be foolish to keep Greater Manchester in Tier 3. Admission data for last week is patchy at best due to Christmas reporting.
Click to expand...

So why was London kept in 2 for so long previously?

By putting the whole of the NW into 4 you're saying the issue in that region is equal to London and the South; its not.

Can't see the point in this 'system' when there really isn't anything logical about it.
 
Are they going to create a vaccine for children, or use this one? I noticed they said they have enough supply for all "adults" in the UK, suggesting children haven't been factored in, what about this new variant they're more susceptible to?
 
F-Red said:
Click to expand...


Today's death numbers might be some backdating and hospital admissions did fall down until the end of Nov, so with the lag they will look like they have reduced day on day at this moment but throughout Dec admissions have crept up and today is the highest with 2.5k admitted and patients on vents have surpassed the peak in Nov.

Unless the recent large case amounts of 50k and hospital admissions are skewing younger I can only see regular large death numbers in the coming weeks.

Going to look pretty bad for the UK gov as this new strain rips through. Other countries will be vaccinated by the time it can take over.
 
Shouldn’t the entirety of England be in the same tier? It’s not like your country is huge or you have vast swaths of land that isn’t populated. Your country is a bit small, it seems a bit silly to think that there are potentially pockets that would be able to withstand this surge upon a surge.

Seems a bit weird to keep small parts of it able to still have the public interact somewhat, especially after all we’ve seen about this virus & its impact.
 
TheReligion said:
So why was London kept in 2 for so long previously?
Click to expand...

No idea, question for the government. It should have been in a higher tier in early December, but I'm guessing their hospital capacity across the region is far greater, and case rates in the over 60s might have been lower.

TheReligion said:
By putting the whole of the NW into 4 you're saying the issue in that region is equal to London and the South; its not.

Can't see the point in this 'system' when there really isn't anything logical about it.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying anything is equal. You have to look at each area in isolation of others, to insinuate that the case rate is stable (which it isn't, it's rising) and therefore the tier system should remain is flawed logic. Critical care cases have increased 30% in Greater Manchester in the last fortnight. Combine the impact of Christmas day mixing, which will probably be seen in early January, and it doesn't make any logical sense to keep Greater Manchester in the same tier, when all the signs are saying that it's going to be a shit storm in a few weeks.
 
redshaw said:
Today's death numbers might be some backdating and hospital admissions did fall down until the end of Nov, so with the lag they will look like they have reduced day on day at this moment but throughout Dec admissions have crept up and today is the highest with 2.5k admitted and patients on vents have surpassed the peak in Nov.

Unless the recent large case amounts of 50k and hospital admissions are skewing younger I can only see regular large death numbers in the coming weeks.

Going to look pretty bad for the UK gov as this new strain rips through. Other countries will be vaccinated by the time it can take over.
Click to expand...

Will they be vaccinated though? Europe is having issues it seems and barely has enough with countries now buying their own but there will be a delay on when they get it. Canada and US are a going through vaccination but also the US is still seeing high numbers.

This strain is out there already and we're all seeing high numbers.

Australia/NZ and I imagine a lot of Asia where they have low cases are OK only
 
What's the betting idiots still have house parties tomorrow? Wonder if that's another reason they've chucked most areas into tier 4, as in the lower tiers couldn't you meet a couple of people in the garden?
 
Stactix said:
*Schools are safe*

hahahahahaha.
Click to expand...
How can he say this with a straight face? OK, he actually didn't but how can restaurants and pubs be deemed unsafe despite all the rules and precautions they’ve put in place, but schools - where kids will be kids - are fine!?
 
redshaw said:
Today's death numbers might be some backdating and hospital admissions did fall down until the end of Nov, so with the lag they will look like they have reduced day on day at this moment but throughout Dec admissions have crept up and today is the highest with 2.5k admitted and patients on vents have surpassed the peak in Nov.

Unless the recent large case amounts of 50k and hospital admissions are skewing younger I can only see regular large death numbers in the coming weeks.

Going to look pretty bad for the UK gov as this new strain rips through. Other countries will be vaccinated by the time it can take over.
Click to expand...

No, UK is leading the way by a mile: over 800,000 people already vaccinated I think against 78,000 in Germany for example.

France will really start next Monday.
 
calodo2003 said:
Shouldn’t the entirety of England be in the same tier? It’s not like your country is huge or you have vast swaths of land that isn’t populated. Your country is a bit small, it seems a bit silly to think that there are potentially pockets that would be able to withstand this surge upon a surge.

Seems a bit weird to keep small parts of it able to still have the public interact somewhat, especially after all we’ve seen about this virus & its impact.
Click to expand...
It's small but some areas are relatively sparsely-populated. For instance, some cities still have hundreds of thousands of people living in Victorian/Edwardian terraced (row) housing, some areas have none of that. It's something to do with being an "old" country and the legacy of the industrial heritage.

When tourists come to England, they don't see those parts of it, on the whole. I lived in West Yorkshire for a number of years, and every little house around me was crammed full of large families.
 
Last edited:
Irish primary schools out until at least 11th January now. Ours were meant to return on the 6th
 
Penna said:
It's small but some areas are relatively sparsely-populated. For instance, some cities still have hundreds of thousands of people living in Victorian/Edwardian terraced (row) housing, some areas have none of that. It's something to do with being an "old" country and the legacy of the industrial heritage.

When tourists come to England, they don't see those parts of it, on the whole.
Click to expand...
But there’s no hidden pockets that could possibly be isolated from the virus for any appreciable amount of time, is there? Even here, with vast stretches of isolation, the virus is everywhere; there’s not a location that is spared. Just cannot fathom that a place exists in England (or any part of the UK) that could hold out.
 
Volumiza said:
I get you, and there’s not one post of mine absolving the government for their decision making, not one, and me putting blame largely on people does not constitute me defending the government. I am just saying I feel more annoyed with the behaviour of people disregarding masks, social distancing and restrictions that we all know exist than I do with the government.

Boris has been dreadful. He’s a good times Prime Minister and in this situation we need someone who isn’t scared of making big decisions that will make people unhappy. I know this, most on here know this but that doesn’t mean that we, or any other people should not wear masks, should flout social distancing or meet with multiple other households as I’ve been seeing with my own eyes.

We know what we should be doing in essence. We do. Most of us are doing this and I’m pretty sure it’s not people like me that is causing the spread of this virus. It is the people who are flouting the rules that we all know we should be abiding by regardless of the mixed messaging.

I would never have relaxed the restrictions for 5 days over Christmas. I’d have looked at the numbers In late November and early December and told people Christmas isn’t happening. It was clear we would have to curtail Christmas so my family made arrangements accordingly. Someone on here earlier gave a ‘can I?’ ‘Should I?’ scenario, so ‘Boris says I can relax over Christmas’ but anyone with a grain of sense actually thought ‘hmmm, I can, but should I?’

Same with holidays. ‘I can’ but actually ‘should I?’. I’ve not even thought about booking a holiday. I think it’s stupid.

Boris stupidly said everyone could relax, so what, if someone stupid tells you to do something stupid, you do it?

I live somewhere where a lot of people gather. I don’t moan about this, I’m lucky to live here and acknowledge that but it does give me a good view into the world right now and there are a heck of a lot of very stupid and selfish people living in it that clearly don’t care about catching or transmitting the virus. These are the focus of my annoyance and anger, not the government. The government are just doing a bad job.
Click to expand...

I understand and think we are on the same page.

I'm in the tricky situation of having moved my holiday that should have been June 2020 to June 2021. I don't think we will be vaccinated by then so am unsure what to do, if the holiday companies would allow me to just cancel I would but having spoken to them before Christmas they want the full £4,000 unless they are forced to cancel. Very frustrating.
 
calodo2003 said:
Shouldn’t the entirety of England be in the same tier? It’s not like your country is huge or you have vast swaths of land that isn’t populated. Your country is a bit small, it seems a bit silly to think that there are potentially pockets that would be able to withstand this surge upon a surge.

Seems a bit weird to keep small parts of it able to still have the public interact somewhat, especially after all we’ve seen about this virus & its impact.
Click to expand...

As it not popular for politicians to say there is a new national lockdown so the idea could be to
- say the situation is critical in some parts of the country only, condition public opinion and then apply the same strict rules to the whole country later; or
- apply a form of national lockdown at 75% from a geographical standpoint

Also, a sophisticated tier system look very serious. If you apply the same rules for the whole country, then some will argue that some areas are really safe, etc.

The key point is that it is easier to sell a hybrid or disguised national lockdown. France for instance implements a curfew from 6pm to 6am in some geographical areas, 8pm to 6am in other areas.
 
Ecstatic said:
No, UK is leading the way by a mile: over 800,000 people already vaccinated I think against 78,000 in Germany for example.

France will really start next Monday.
Click to expand...

LARulz said:
Will they be vaccinated though? Europe is having issues it seems and barely has enough with countries now buying their own but there will be a delay on when they get it. Canada and US are a going through vaccination but also the US is still seeing high numbers.

This strain is out there already and we're all seeing high numbers.

Australia/NZ and I imagine a lot of Asia where they have low cases are OK only
Click to expand...

Depends on how long it takes to even take hold of other countries, spread wildly and then the lag of deaths, that's 3-4 months.

You also have to take into account the vast majority of deaths are over 65. A good amount or nearly all could be vaccinated by that time or at least the most vulnerable in that category.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.