Pep Guardiola's Bayern

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thiago is key to pep at bayern, if thiago stays healthy and develops into the star he's destined to be as measured by his talent, bayern will continue to be the dominant force under pep. i think bayern without that creative technical midfielder that thiago is far less effective, and only building the midfield would be the sensible guardiola decision.
 
In his first season he wins 4 trophies, not bad eh? I know he was expected to win those but its still an achievement. It will take him time to fully implement his philosophy at Bayern but if he gets time I think they will win the CL again during his reign.

It's evidently been a far from disastrous season - but Bayern have arguably taken a step backwards this year.

He seems only to be able to play one way. Having 70% possession is fine but teams with pace and power can always hit you on the break.
 
A few moments ago 2 good journalists said, that Mandzukic is gone. He left München and so on. Will be interesting what we will do in the summer.
A world class CB must come. There is no way around it. Laporte or Luiz(who should be world class in our system).
Schweinsteiger is 30 in the summer and had big injury issues in the last seasons. We could buy for the time after 2015; Pogba, Koke and so on.
Some papers from München talked about 5 new transfers beside Lewa and Rode; could be an upgrade for the bench. Shaqiri could go, van Buyten will go. What will happen to Pizzaro?
Will be an interesting summer for us. We could spend 40 million or 80+.

It's evidently been a far from disastrous season - but Bayern have arguably taken a step backwards this year.

He seems only to be able to play one way. Having 70% possession is fine but teams with pace and power can always hit you on the break.

Sorry, but we didnt take a step back. Possession is Peps idea. That is all ok. We played mostly great, he will make changes in the summer and one of his key players, Thiago, wasnt there for the big months. Next season will see a better Bayern in april and may.
 
It's evidently been a far from disastrous season - but Bayern have arguably taken a step backwards this year.

He seems only to be able to play one way. Having 70% possession is fine but teams with pace and power can always hit you on the break.
I think people really should compare our injuries this season with last season and then rethink their opinion about our performances this year. Last season was a once in a lifetime season, anyone who expected us to replicate it was always going to be disappointed. But for a large part of the season, it looked like we actually improved (or at least kept the same level) despite countless injuries to key players.

People also should rewatch some of our performances this year. The away game at city was easily on the same level as all the performances last season. Successful, effective, brilliant to watch with a wonderful balance of possession and directness. The criticism towards Guardiola is way way over the top.
 
I think people really should compare our injuries this season with last season and then rethink their opinion about our performances this year. Last season was a once in a lifetime season, anyone who expected us to replicate it was always going to be disappointed. But for a large part of the season, it looked like we actually improved (or at least kept the same level) despite countless injuries to key players.

People also should rewatch some of our performances this year. The away game at city was easily on the same level as all the performances last season. Successful, effective, brilliant to watch with a wonderful balance of possession and directness. The criticism towards Guardiola is way way over the top.

The issue for me is the level they were at when he arrived. The league and Cup are nice but he will be measured on what he does in Europe. With the squad he had the league should be a given anyway.

Last year, Bayern destroyed a Tiki-Taka Barca side still playing the way they did under Guardiola. They looked to strong, too fast and just too good.

Now, Guardiola wants to make them like Barca - only Bayern don't have Lionel Messi as an outlet.

Against Real Madrid - in the big game that really mattered, they had no cutting edge. Loads of the ball but not enough encisiveness. He was also tactically out thought in my opinion.

He is clearly a very talented man, but he needs to develop what he has done in the past and reinvent it a bit - with more pace and a bit more power. He needs a plan B for the big game when plan A doesn't work. Without that he risks falling short of the big prize again.
 
A few moments ago 2 good journalists said, that Mandzukic is gone. He left München and so on. Will be interesting what we will do in the summer.
A world class CB must come. There is no way around it. Laporte or Luiz(who should be world class in our system).
Schweinsteiger is 30 in the summer and had big injury issues in the last seasons. We could buy for the time after 2015; Pogba, Koke and so on.
Some papers from München talked about 5 new transfers beside Lewa and Rode; could be an upgrade for the bench. Shaqiri could go, van Buyten will go. What will happen to Pizzaro?
Will be an interesting summer for us. We could spend 40 million or 80+.



Sorry, but we didnt take a step back. Possession is Peps idea. That is all ok. We played mostly great, he will make changes in the summer and one of his key players, Thiago, wasnt there for the big months. Next season will see a better Bayern in april and may.

As I said above - they were outplayed in the big game when if mattered.

They were hit on the break by a quick and powerful side and the defence looked shaky when it was exposed. As it is I don't see how Thiago would have made any difference to that.

As I've said above - it was the same with Barca. The A plan works 99% of the time but you still need something else up your sleeve.
 
Why do you (and others) keep saying Pep wants to turn them into Barcelona? No one who paid any attention to either that Barcelona side or this Bayern side can surely think it's the same style. They're both possession orientated sides but that's when the similarities end.

Oh and the Barça side that was destroyed by Bayern was one that had already abandoned Pep's frantic pressing game so I'm not sure how that can be used as a victory over him and his ethos...assuming that's what you were trying to say.

This Plan B you're talking about - didn't people say that Pep needed to use a target man and cross the ball a lot more when "tika-tika" wasn't working? Well, he tried that against Real Madrid and it was awful. Deviating from his usual style cost them I reckon.
 
It's evidently been a far from disastrous season - but Bayern have arguably taken a step backwards this year.

He seems only to be able to play one way. Having 70% possession is fine but teams with pace and power can always hit you on the break.

No team in history of the game has ever done two treble in a row, I repeat, no team in the history has ever achieved that.
Sometimes people expectation is just being way too harsh. Not retaining a CL trophy doesn't mean taken a step backwards. There's only at most 1 or 2 teams which match with Guardiola's level of success this season.
 
No team in history of the game has ever done two treble in a row, I repeat, no team in the history has ever achieved that.
Sometimes people expectation is just being way too harsh. Not retaining a CL trophy doesn't mean taken a step backwards. There's only at most 1 or 2 teams which match with Guardiola's level of success this season.

Your missing the point. It's not about the trophies or the CL in particular - it's the manner of he defeat in Europe that would concern me if I were a Bayern fan. Any side can get beaten in a close game but Madrid were much the better side in the second leg, soaking up the pressure and hitting Bayern on the break time and again while Bayern looked devoid of ideas.

Last year they were formidable and showed up the flaws in he Guardiola type system when they battered Barca over two legs. They had, for me brought something new to the table.

Now Guardiola has come in and tried to taken them back to what Barca were doing to a greater or lesser extent. The "pass, pass, pass" is fine and generally very effective but Madrid had little issue with it and exposed the weaknesses of playing a pressing game.

For me Guardiola got his tactics wrong - Madrid were happy to sit back and play in the break and once they went in front they could open Bayern up in a few passes as Bayern had to chase the game.

It's all opinion but the Bayern team last year looked more solid at the back and had the ability to break quickly and decisively. They lacked that in the most important game of the season - the game that a top manager will be judged on.

As I've said he is clearly a very talented man, I just think he still has something to prove. The Barca style possession game looks like its been worked out, if a team had the pace and quality to do it. He needs to develop something else and take it on a level like the best managers do.
 
As I've said above - it was the same with Barca. The A plan works 99% of the time but you still need something else up your sleeve.
I don't get the plan B nonsense. Mourinho and Ancelotti clearly lacked a plan in possession this season, that helped them break down teams that defended deep. It cost both teams the league. They were at their best when they were allowed to play counterattacking football and also failed to win against excellent counterattacking teams, yet no one says, they lack a plan B or a plan A or whatever you want to call it. Most of the time it's blamed on their players. With Guardiola, it's always the tactics that failed, it's crazy. For example, we won away at Dortmund with Martinez playing behind the striker and playing longballs over the midfield to bypass Dortmund's pressing, our first league win against Dortmund after more than 3 years, something Heynckes failed to achieve. But everyone seems to have forgotten about it. Guardiola showed quite often tactical flexibility this season, pretty sure he did it more than Ancelotti or Mourinho. What he never did is change the style he built his team on, but no manager does that. It's always about small tweaks and getting the players to perform to the best of their abilities. The significant drop in form in the 2nd half of the season wasn't only because of Pep's tactics. The players lost some of the determination, their focus, made more individual mistakes. Guardiola's man-management in the 2nd half of the season was a problem, saying that the league is over and that he doesn't care about it anymore completely destroyed the rhythm of the team. He experimented too often with different tactics and used players in too many different positions in the 2nd half of the season, which meant they didn't feel comfortable all the time. Add countless injuries to key players and you have a reasonable explanation why the team didn't continue to play on the same high level over the whole season.

Guardiola's season wasn't perfect, no doubt. But the way people criticise his general idea of football and solely blame the failure to repeat a treble (how insane that sounds) on it is mind-boggling.
 
Your missing the point. It's not about the trophies or the CL in particular - it's the manner of he defeat in Europe that would concern me if I were a Bayern fan. Any side can get beaten in a close game but Madrid were much the better side in the second leg, soaking up the pressure and hitting Bayern on the break time and again while Bayern looked devoid of ideas.
To be honest, the defending of set pieces played the biggest part in both Bayern's 4-0 win last season against Barca and Bayern's 4-0 loss against Real this season. Conceding cheap goals early which makes it easy for the counterattacking team to play to their strengths is such a huge deal and can often turn close games into crazy one-sided results. Blaming it solely on possession vs counterattacking is just lazy and isn't fair to either style of football, because both clearly showed that they can work against the other one when executed properly.
 
Your missing the point. It's not about the trophies or the CL in particular - it's the manner of he defeat in Europe that would concern me if I were a Bayern fan. Any side can get beaten in a close game but Madrid were much the better side in the second leg, soaking up the pressure and hitting Bayern on the break time and again while Bayern looked devoid of ideas.

Last year they were formidable and showed up the flaws in he Guardiola type system when they battered Barca over two legs. They had, for me brought something new to the table.

Now Guardiola has come in and tried to taken them back to what Barca were doing to a greater or lesser extent. The "pass, pass, pass" is fine and generally very effective but Madrid had little issue with it and exposed the weaknesses of playing a pressing game.

For me Guardiola got his tactics wrong - Madrid were happy to sit back and play in the break and once they went in front they could open Bayern up in a few passes as Bayern had to chase the game.

It's all opinion but the Bayern team last year looked more solid at the back and had the ability to break quickly and decisively. They lacked that in the most important game of the season - the game that a top manager will be judged on.

As I've said he is clearly a very talented man, I just think he still has something to prove. The Barca style possession game looks like its been worked out, if a team had the pace and quality to do it. He needs to develop something else and take it on a level like the best managers do.


When was the last time that Real Madrid beat Barca 4-0? By your analysis, it should have been happening all the time. Though, it never did.

Another thing. Barcelona and Bayern are two very different teams, drawing analogies between them the whole time is completely void. Barcelona have been battered once in their last 360 games or so, and have won much more than anyone else in European football since 2008. Even at their worst, they have been challenging on all fronts. And like Balu said, both Barca and Bayern were undone by set-piece defending, not because of any inherent flaw in the possession game. The way I see it, there is an pent-up frustration in many people that results in overeagerness in dismissing the possession game as a thing of the past.
 
Your missing the point. It's not about the trophies or the CL in particular - it's the manner of he defeat in Europe that would concern me if I were a Bayern fan. Any side can get beaten in a close game but Madrid were much the better side in the second leg, soaking up the pressure and hitting Bayern on the break time and again while Bayern looked devoid of ideas.

Last year they were formidable and showed up the flaws in he Guardiola type system when they battered Barca over two legs. They had, for me brought something new to the table.

Now Guardiola has come in and tried to taken them back to what Barca were doing to a greater or lesser extent. The "pass, pass, pass" is fine and generally very effective but Madrid had little issue with it and exposed the weaknesses of playing a pressing game.

For me Guardiola got his tactics wrong - Madrid were happy to sit back and play in the break and once they went in front they could open Bayern up in a few passes as Bayern had to chase the game.

It's all opinion but the Bayern team last year looked more solid at the back and had the ability to break quickly and decisively. They lacked that in the most important game of the season - the game that a top manager will be judged on.

As I've said he is clearly a very talented man, I just think he still has something to prove. The Barca style possession game looks like its been worked out, if a team had the pace and quality to do it. He needs to develop something else and take it on a level like the best managers do.

I think you can't judge a team under the microscope on one single match only. They have had a great run for most part of the season, that is when Guardiola took over the team with his new possession style of football, and they still enjoy a glorious unbeaten run in the league and progress all the way to the semi-final of CL. Their only disappointing moment this season is perhaps got beaten by the best counter attacking team led by the best player in the world, and they simply got their tactics wrong for this match. Its not a perfect season for them for this reason alone, but I wouldn't say they had taken a step backwards yet.
 
I think you can't judge a team under the microscope on one single match only. They have had a great run for most part of the season, that is when Guardiola took over the team with his new possession style of football, and they still enjoy a glorious unbeaten run in the league and progress all the way to the semi-final of CL. Their only disappointing moment this season is perhaps got beaten by the best counter attacking team led by the best player in the world, they simply got their tactics wrong for this match. Its not a perfect season for them for this reason alone but I wouldn't say they had taken a step backwards yet.

Just to give an example. Their star player, who many thought should have won the Golden Ball last year, has been far worse this season than last. There are many factors outside tactics and managers affecting football games, but it seems that most people on football forums completely fail to recognize this. It is always SAF versus Jose, Pep versus Ancellotti, Klopp versus Simeone, or possession versus counter-attacking and things of this sort. There are so many variables outside managers/tactics that determine football results. I can readily name three more important factors straight away: a) Quality of players at hand, b) Physical conditioning at the time of the big matches, c) Luck.
 
Just to give an example. Their star player, who many thought should have won the Golden Ball last year, has been far worse this season than last. There are many factors outside tactics and managers affecting football games, but it seems that most people on football forums completely fail to recognize this. It is always SAF versus Jose, Pep versus Ancellotti, Klopp versus Simeone, or possession versus counter-attacking and things of this sort. There are so many variables outside managers/tactics that determine football results. I can readily name three more important factors straight away: a) Quality of players at hand, b) Physical conditioning at the time of the big matches, c) Luck.

The simple fact that few teams had ever won the treble means that luck has to play a big part on winning every big matches and sweeping every trophies on sight too, especially when there are several equally heavy weight teams (Bayern, Barca and Real etc) competing for the same trophy. Consistency on performing over long period of time (over 100 matches in 2 years) is another factor. Players are only human afterall (except Ronaldo and Messi). They are due to have a bad game or two.
 
The simple fact that few teams had ever won the treble means that luck has to play a big part on winning every big matches and sweeping every trophies on sight too, especially when there are several equally heavy weight teams (Bayern, Barca and Real etc) competing for the same trophy. Consistency on performing over long period of time (over 100 matches in 2 years) is another factor. Players are only human afterall (except Ronaldo and Messi). They are due to have a bad game or two.

I agree with this 100%. Except with your statement about Messi and Ronaldo, simply because they have bad games as well. Granted they sometimes manage to mask this by scoring or by some moment of genius. Ribery has been underwhelming for most of the season as far as I know.
 
I agree with this 100%. Except with your statement about Messi and Ronaldo, simply because they have bad games as well. Granted they sometimes manage to mask this by scoring or by some moment of genius. Ribery has been underwhelming for most of the season as far as I know.
He was absolutely brilliant in the first half of the season. He got injured in the return leg of the worldcup qualifier playoffs, missed a few games and since then, he struggled with form and injuries throughout the rest of the season.
 
He was absolutely brilliant in the first half of the season. He got injured in the return leg of the worldcup qualifier playoffs, missed a few games and since then, he struggled with form and injuries throughout the rest of the season.
Would you say not winning the ballon dor has affected him mentally and therefore his form on the pitch?
 
He was absolutely brilliant in the first half of the season. He got injured in the return leg of the worldcup qualifier playoffs, missed a few games and since then, he struggled with form and injuries throughout the rest of the season.

Alright. He was underwhelming in the critical part of the season, even if that drop in performance can be excused due to injury.

I paid particular attention to him in both CL fixtures, and he did very little to put it mildly.
 
Would you say not winning the ballon dor has affected him mentally and therefore his form on the pitch?
Wouldn't rule it out, he's quite sensitive, always has been. Especially with the reopening of the poll and all that questionable stuff, it might have distracted and frustrated him a lot.
 
With Ribery - it could be a lot of reasons - or everything combined.

He struggles a little with the system and the changes it means for him, the injuries that took him out for many matches, the Ballon d'Or, Uli Hoeness conviction and the changes in the club with it... (Hoeneß was the fatherly friend he always could go to with his problems off and on the field - and you can imagine that a guy like Ribery has a lot). He is pretty sensible for things like that.
 
What imo people fail to realize is that this isn't same job as in Barcelona. Guardiola was promoted to manager at Barca because he had shown the people who run the club and make the decisions there that he had a vision in his mind, that he had designed a new "formula" which could make the footballing philosophy Barcelona follow and teach in their academies prevail in European football, and that he also had the right method and the proper skills to make Messi and co. play that kind of football on the pitch.

Bayern Munich and German football in general follow a quite different philosophy. It's all about fast tempo, direct passing, dynamic-vertical runs into space, ultra fast transition, stamina and players with great physical attributes. It's almost a 180 degree turn from what Barcelona are playing/teaching. And it's not only about Bayern Munich, there are other teams which have excelled in that style of football (e.g. M'Gladbach in the 70's, Hamburger SV in the 80's, Dortmund in the 90's) and of course the German national team that has played in seven world cup and six European championship finals throughout the years.

It's natural for them to feel that this is the right way to play, Bayern were European champions after all. Yet, the board made a conscious decision in appointing a new manager. I believe the main plan is to combine Pep's possession football with the athleticism, the work ethics and the mix of "power" and directness of the German footballing philosophy. We'll have to see how it'll work out, as it's certainly a challenge for both Bayern, who were reigning European champions, and Guardiola who, for the first time in his career, must convince his "audience" that his tactics are the way to go.

Has he done a good job? I'd say yes. I have to admit i'm a bit surprised to see how underestimated Bundesliga is on this forum. People seem to forget that Klopp's Borussia Dortmund play in the same league, a league that has been won by 6 different clubs in the last 20 years. They did extremely well in the league with 25 wins and 3 draws before their first defeat. During that period they were a joy to watch most of the time, they won M'Gladbach comfortably twice, they thrashed Schalke home & away, they beat 3-0 at Westfalen in a game where Borussia also played extremely well, they won Wolfsburg away 6-1 and Werder away 7-0 etc. They also outclassed City and Arsenal in the CL and when the shite hit the fan they scored 3 goals in 15 minutes against us.

People criticize this Bayern team for losing a tie against a Real Madrid side who had reached their top form in that point of the season. Of course the matches against United and Real Madrid (and some matches in the league) showed that Guardiola and Bayern Munich are still somewhat away from their final goal and that there are still lots of little but important details which need to be sorted out next season. Don't forget that the two signings Guardiola demanded, Gotze and Alcantara, haven't found their role in this Bayern team yet and that he has made it clear he doesn't have faith in Mandjukic.

His biggest challenge still remains the creation of a functional midfield (at top level). That's the biggest change from last season with Kroos playing deeper and Schweinsteiger in a more advanced role. He was unlucky with Alcantara because he was the only CM who already knew and understood his philosophy at the start of the season. They do the right things in the midfield but they are not doing them fast enough.

But to say this is the end of possession football and that they've failed....... I'd say that Bayern Munich still are the club with the most chances of being in the final four of the CL next season.
 
Would you say not winning the ballon dor has affected him mentally and therefore his form on the pitch?
I'd say yes. There was a noticable drop in his form ever since then. It is obvious to me that it affected him quite a lot. Then there was the injury that didn't help either. It's a shame he lost his form in the most important part of the season, but that's football and we can't help it.
 
When was the last time that Real Madrid beat Barca 4-0? By your analysis, it should have been happening all the time. Though, it never did.

Another thing. Barcelona and Bayern are two very different teams, drawing analogies between them the whole time is completely void. Barcelona have been battered once in their last 360 games or so, and have won much more than anyone else in European football since 2008. Even at their worst, they have been challenging on all fronts. And like Balu said, both Barca and Bayern were undone by set-piece defending, not because of any inherent flaw in the possession game. The way I see it, there is an pent-up frustration in many people that results in overeagerness in dismissing the possession game as a thing of the past.

Firstly, I'm not making sweeping statements about what should happen when one team plays another as if football is some kind of video game where you add all the variables up and crank out a result. Evidently that is not the case.

As regards the bolded part - where am I saying that? As I've said, the possession game is effective a lot of the time, as it was for Bayern over most of this season.

Seems some on here refuse to see Guardiola criticised at all. The point I was making was that in my opinion, Bayern looked a more solid and dangerous side last season - which I think is a fair opinion. They looked incisive, strong and with Robben and Ribery could hit teams on the break as well as control the possession of the game if and where needed. I don't see that you need to have one or the other.

They were undone of set pieces, but the tactics they employed after that left them wide open - against a side with a huge amount of pace, which was obviously always going to be a huge risk and everyone could see that. They had loads of possession but it was always in front of, and not behind the Real Madrid defence, and despite having quality players, to me the slow build up didn't help in trying to break them down.

Rather than suggest I'm making sweeping statements about thee death of possession football - look at what I actually said, specifically that Guardiola, in my opinion still has something to prove. He doesn't have a Messi at Bayern to lead the line and bag him 50 goals and isn't likely to find one either and for me he needs to develop the Barca style a bit further to deal with the new challenges he was always going to face. He may very well be capable of doing that and they could be superb next year - time will tell, but I don't see that its a particularly controversial to suggest that they were arguably a more effective side last year.
 
Plan B to people means route one, which is funny. Guardiola has several formations his team's play to manipulate space. They should be considered A,B,C. They all stem from a possession based game.

Opponents set up against Guardiola in one way mainly. Luiz will be a good addition and so will Leandowski having a genuine no.9 who can link up, drop deep, hold up the ball and is also an aerial threat and good finisher will work wonders. There are not many strikers I would pick before him in the game.

@Balu if someone was to say Kroos has the best attacking mind (not ability) at Bayern what's your opinion ?
 
Plan B to people means route one, which is funny. Guardiola has several formations his team's play to manipulate space. They should be considered A,B,C. They all stem from a possession based game.

Opponents set up against Guardiola in one way mainly. Luiz will be a good addition and so will Leandowski having a genuine no.9 who can link up, drop deep, hold up the ball and is also an aerial threat and good finisher will work wonders. There are not many strikers I would pick before him in the game.

@Balu if someone was to say Kroos has the best attacking mind (not ability) at Bayern what's your opinion ?
Not sure what you mean with 'attacking mind'? I wrote the following earlier in the Kroos transfer thread, maybe that answers your question?

It's fascinating how many people blame Guardiola for Kroos' lack of balls. The same criticsm of safety first passing was aimed at Kroos during Heynckes' 2 years at Bayern and it's the main reason why so many Bayern fans dislike him and wouldn't mind seeing him gone. It's no coincidence either that our style last season changed from more possession based tactics to a very direct counterattacking style when Müller took his place in the middle and Robben came into the team. Kroos was always a master of retaining possession and needed someone next to him who plays the risky final pass. Guardiola publicly said at the beginning of the season, that he wants someone like Thiago in the team, because we lack that type of player. The idea that Kroos' creativity is limited through Pep's tactics is nonsense and I actually like Kroos a lot. It's just important to keep in mind what kind of player he is or some of you will be really disappointed when he comes to United.

So no, I wouldn't say he has the best attacking mind. He's all about controling the pace of the game not about making the difference in attack.
 
Plan B to people means route one, which is funny. Guardiola has several formations his team's play to manipulate space. They should be considered A,B,C. They all stem from a possession based game.

Opponents set up against Guardiola in one way mainly. Luiz will be a good addition and so will Leandowski having a genuine no.9 who can link up, drop deep, hold up the ball and is also an aerial threat and good finisher will work wonders. There are not many strikers I would pick before him in the game.

@Balu if someone was to say Kroos has the best attacking mind (not ability) at Bayern what's your opinion ?

How exactly will Luiz be a good addition? Their team mascott is shit?
 
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Not sure what you mean with 'attacking mind'? I wrote the following earlier in the Kroos transfer thread, maybe that answers your question?



So no, I wouldn't say he has the best attacking mind. He's all about controling the pace of the game not about making the difference in attack.

Your earlier post does answer my question. He's more a dictator but he needs the player who will make the telling final pass. When I watch him I always see him central to Bayern's attacks, he may not provide an assist but he provides a pass that opens up the pitch for somebody else, or the hockey assist as they say.
 
How exactly will Luiz be a good addition? Their team mascott is shit?

He defends well in an expansive system, as shown with Brazil. It is the disciplined and defensively rigid system of Chelsea that he tends to struggle in. He wants to play and he wants the ball, for Pep he would get to do that much more. Same thing as if he went to Barca, no surprise those are the teams that want him. He is mobile and he is technically gifted, those things are important for a Centre back especially one who plays for Pep as they are left exposed more than others.
 
He defends well in an expansive system, as shown with Brazil. It is the disciplined and defensively rigid system of Chelsea that he tends to struggle in. He wants to play and he wants the ball, for Pep he would get to do that much more. Same thing as if he went to Barca, no surprise those are the teams that want him. He is mobile and he is technically gifted, those things are important for a Centre back especially one who plays for Pep as they are left exposed more than others.

He didn't prove anything. He doesn't defend well in that system either, he played at Chelsea when they were playing high line and was still awfull, and I am quite sure he will prove it again at the World Cup. I am not sure we know that they really want him except for the rumours, but even if they do it proves nothing. Barcelona bought Song because they thought he is good at CB.
Bayern has 3 centre backs who are all better centre backs than him, because the first thing centre back should know is how to defend, and Dante, Boateng, and Martinez are all waaay better defenders than him, and probably all of them are better passers than him too. Only thing where he is better than them is his pace. He isn't even that good with the ball, he hoofs it quite often, I am sure Guardiola will appreciate good passers more than the likes of Luiz who hoof the ball more often than Rio.
 
I sure hope we stay away from Luiz, he is a disaster waiting to happen in CB. And I doubt he'd be good for us with Pep's high defensive lineup. I also don't think he is worth so much money. I know there aren't many world-class CBs available right now but I don't believe he is the solution.
 
As I said above - they were outplayed in the big game when if mattered.

They were hit on the break by a quick and powerful side and the defence looked shaky when it was exposed. As it is I don't see how Thiago would have made any difference to that.

As I've said above - it was the same with Barca. The A plan works 99% of the time but you still need something else up your sleeve.

We were in the game in Madrid. Any defense has shaky moments against Real on full form. We could and should have scored 1. And 1 away goal changes everything for the home tie. So we had to open up and had bad luck too with 2 early goals.
Again; everyone can have his opinion but for me the press and many fans went into hyperwhatever. ;)
1 bad game doesnt change a great great season.
And we won many bid games; Dortmund, a great going Arsenal, Chelsea and so on. Even United was proven at the top and highly motivated.
Pep won 4 trophies, lost the Super Cup to Dortmund and in the semis to Real.
Mou, who became the best trainer for 24 hours after our 0:4 won nothing. Barca 1 Supercup. And so on.
Our year was an A+ for me.

I sure hope we stay away from Luiz, he is a disaster waiting to happen in CB. And I doubt he'd be good for us with Pep's high defensive lineup. I also don't think he is worth so much money. I know there aren't many world-class CBs available right now but I don't believe he is the solution.

Would love Laporte; young, a good market(France) behind him and he can play LB.
 
I would say that Guardiola has not shown as yet the ability to coach a tight defence, maybe the Bayern experts on here will tell me that the defense has been fantastic all year but not in the games I have seen.

Obviously the pressing and high possession statistics are a defence in themselves, but I mean the ability to coach a very strong back line.
 
I would say that Guardiola has not shown as yet the ability to coach a tight defence, maybe the Bayern experts on here will tell me that the defense has been fantastic all year but not in the games I have seen.

Obviously the pressing and high possession statistics are a defence in themselves, but I mean the ability to coach a very strong back line.

Bayern had 38 goals against in all competition - and that included the 0:5 against Real Madrid. A lot of this goals against came from set-pieces, too. Yes, the defenders had their blips - but until March that were really exceptions.18 of that goals came after the Bundesliga Championship was done...

The thing you can blame Guardiola for this season might be that he tinkered a little too much with his tactics, tried too much and maybe even looked too less into the last two years when it was about things that did not really work. But we are talking about a coach who does his first year in a league with a new team and with a new language. Maybe sometimes you should be a little bit more patient.
 
He didn't prove anything. He doesn't defend well in that system either, he played at Chelsea when they were playing high line and was still awfull, and I am quite sure he will prove it again at the World Cup. I am not sure we know that they really want him except for the rumours, but even if they do it proves nothing. Barcelona bought Song because they thought he is good at CB.
Bayern has 3 centre backs who are all better centre backs than him, because the first thing centre back should know is how to defend, and Dante, Boateng, and Martinez are all waaay better defenders than him, and probably all of them are better passers than him too. Only thing where he is better than them is his pace. He isn't even that good with the ball, he hoofs it quite often, I am sure Guardiola will appreciate good passers more than the likes of Luiz who hoof the ball more often than Rio.

Did you watch the Confed cup? How many times have you watched him for Brazil? He almost always plays well. I don't think you do. He will show what he is about in Brazil and for Barca/Bayern, he would be a good signing for both.
 
We were in the game in Madrid. Any defense has shaky moments against Real on full form. We could and should have scored 1. And 1 away goal changes everything for the home tie. So we had to open up and had bad luck too with 2 early goals.
Again; everyone can have his opinion but for me the press and many fans went into hyperwhatever. ;)
1 bad game doesnt change a great great season.
And we won many bid games; Dortmund, a great going Arsenal, Chelsea and so on. Even United was proven at the top and highly motivated.
Pep won 4 trophies, lost the Super Cup to Dortmund and in the semis to Real.
Mou, who became the best trainer for 24 hours after our 0:4 won nothing. Barca 1 Supercup. And so on.
Our year was an A+ for me.



Would love Laporte; young, a good market(France) behind him and he can play LB.

One bad game doesn't change a season - but as I said, I suspect the heriarchy at Bayern were not happy with the manner in which they went out of the CL. Once they went one nil down you could see that Madrid were just going to play on the break and Bayern didnt seem to have any answer for it.

In conmtext they've had a good year - the problem Guardiola has is that last year was even better, and as I've said above, its arguable that this years system isn't as effective as last years.

He is of course, a very good manager and perhaps they will reap the rewards next year.
 
Did you watch the Confed cup? How many times have you watched him for Brazil? He almost always plays well. I don't think you do. He will show what he is about in Brazil and for Barca/Bayern, he would be a good signing for both.

Confed cup is pretty much tournament of friendly games where lots of average players plays well, we'll see him at the World cup, or even better, at Barca or Bayern. Or he'll stay at Chelsea, with 35 year old being picked ahead of him at CB every week.
 
One bad game doesn't change a season - but as I said, I suspect the heriarchy at Bayern were not happy with the manner in which they went out of the CL. Once they went one nil down you could see that Madrid were just going to play on the break and Bayern didnt seem to have any answer for it.

In conmtext they've had a good year - the problem Guardiola has is that last year was even better, and as I've said above, its arguable that this years system isn't as effective as last years.

He is of course, a very good manager and perhaps they will reap the rewards next year.

You are right. The board cant be happy with the way we went out. But that happens. And former players like Kalle and Uli now that. Pep could have made one or more mistakes for the home leg. I dont deny that. But the team didnt show up either 100%. It was a bad day all around. And that happens to anyone.
But Pep showed in the Cup final that he has other ideas, that he can react for a special team. In this case play a 3-4-3 and stop the fast breaks of Dortmund with more players in the middle.
And sorry, but your last sentence shows what was wrong this season. We won 4 out of 6 trophies(the lost German Supercup the smallest one) and reaches the CL semi after a quadruble season and that wasnt enough reward?
No. It was a fantastic year.
You are right in the way that the CL is the great price but it shouldnt be(fate).
Pep will learn from mistakes every human makes and we go on.
He can model the team further in his ideas this summer and Im excited! Lets go!
 
I don't find a thread dedicated to Mario Mandzukic but my question may fit in here, too:
This weekend, Manduzkic finally stated the obvious, that he feels it's time to move on. With Diego Costa on his way to Chelsea, which clubs could be in for MM, and which ones would be of interest to him?

Arsenal? Liverpool? Atletico? ... ?

Wolfsburg would take him back in a heart beat, I guess, but I doubt he'd be satisfied with moving back (as much as he may enjoy playing with his buddies Olic and Perisic).
 
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