Should Wenger be sacked?

Should Arsenal sack Wenger

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I'm no Arsenal fan, and really am indifferent to them, but I'd say the guy needs to go.

They're stuck in a rut and have been for a decade, you just know every year they'll flatter to decieve, get knocked out early in the champions league, push for the title for a few months and end up 2/3/4.

I know to some teams that's the whole goal (I wouldn't mind it as a LFC fan) but they're just not going anywhere. It's groundhog season every year. With the ground, finances and half decent squad to build on they should be more of a threat. I can think of 3 seasons they should have taken advantage but never did.

They're just stagnating under Wenger, must be really frustrating as a fan, or one of their 3 class players.

Does anyone ever see them as title threat in August? I sure don't, but you can nail on they'll be in top 4. That'd drive me crackers as a gooner, perpetual also rans when you know a change in management could catapult them from bottlers in March, to grinding it out.

It's like the club just settles for the champions league place. Are they scared with no Wenger that'd go away? If so, sometimes you've gotta take a risk to move up a level. Or you end up like my team, aiming for mediocrity.
 
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What happens if he goes on to win the FA cup and finishes runners up?

Greatest manager in Arsenal's history. Fans should show him some respect for his achievements.
 
Sultan said:
What happens if he goes on to win the FA cup and finishes runners up?

Greatest manager in Arsenal's history. Fans should show him some respect for his achievements.
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Even if he - finally - won the League, would it be worth the ages-long wait? For such a football sophisticate, that would seem like typically plodding manager-logic: "See - I was right all along (please ignore, as I am, the years without challenging for the title)." And despite further pedestrian football-logic of a title setting Arsenal off on a period of dominance, who would seriously bet on that actually happening?
 
SteveJ said:
Even if he - finally - won the League, would it be worth the ages-long wait? For such a football sophisticate, that would seem like typically plodding manager-logic: "See - I was right all along (please ignore, as I am, the years without challenging for the title)." And despite further pedestrian football-logic of a title setting Arsenal off on a period of dominance, who would seriously bet on that actually happening?
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It's difficult, Steve. We have a few elite teams in the Premiership with United, Chelsea, City and Arsenal having monopolised the league. Has he been allowed to spend? I don't think any other manager taking over will fare any better unless they spend equivalent to other 3 teams.

Anyway, I personally think he'll walk into probably an international job at his age.
 
Sultan said:
It's difficult, Steve. We have a few elite teams in the Premiership with United, Chelsea, City and Arsenal having monopolised the league. Has he been allowed to spend?
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Rightly or wrongly, mate, I view the ol' back n' forth between Arsene and the board ('They won't let him spend'/'Arsene refuses to spend') as a very convenient device for both parties; neither truly wants to spend.* For instance, even the attention-grabbing spending was 'tactical' - the Ozil signing came at yet another time when Wenger was under fans' pressure; the Sanchez signing took place only once CL money was guaranteed via qualification.


*Albeit for differing reasons, perhaps.
 
jem said:
I'm taking your word on a lot of that, but that was a fantastic post. Very enjoyable read.
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Thank you. A lot of the older financial stuff comes from Arsènal book. There's a lot of interesting stuff on the 90s drinking culture from interviews though and especially Tony Adams book. Here is a comment from a Bergkamp interview thats interesting about drinking culture but also the importance of that defense to the mentality of the 98-04 Arsenal sides, which is lacking now.

Arsenal was famous for having a big drinking culture in the '90s with the likes of Tony Adams, Paul Merson and Ray Parlour – was that a bit of a shock?
Dennis Bergkamp said:
It was something I just couldn't understand! Pre-season we went to a training camp in Sweden and trained twice a day. In the evening I went for a walk with my wife and saw all the Arsenal players sitting outside a pub. I thought it was unbelievable. The funny thing is you never noticed it in training because they were so strong and they always gave 100 per cent. I didn't drink, and they respected me. They did, and I thought: 'It's part of England so you've got to respect that.' The next year Arsene came and it all changed. Later, we were successful because of our English defenders. They put the spirit in the team, which the Europeans lacked. They would say, "Get stuck in!" and all sorts of other phrases. I loved it, especially: "How much do you want it?" I thought about it. It stuck with me. Do you really want it more than the opponent? How much are you prepared to give? How much time do you want to put in to become better? It's the English warrior tradition; a moral code. We go out together and we're going to give 100 per cent.
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http://www.fourfourtwo.com/us/features/dennis-bergkamp-one-one#aHHypTPgjxzwEVX2.99
 
On the mirror it says he might want to stay for 4 more years. (Can someone embed Neil Hendersons tweet plz as I can't as I'm a newbie.)

:( Please God no. I'm not supporting Arsenal anymore if this is the case. I'm not watching football anymore either.
 
It's only the Star though, mate:

 
Some of the headlines on the sunday front pages Henderson posted...sheesh:
'Princess Di wrote love letters to Rose West'
'McCanns sue Ozil over Brexit'
'Becks marries shoe shop'
 
SteveJ said:
It's only the Star though, mate:
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It's the Star but it's got some quotes in there from Wenger about how he's got nothing outside football unlike Fergie and wants to carry on.

It's sad though. He and Henry were the ones to get me into football and brought me joy watching the game. Now he's bringing me nothing but despair and resentment. All the promises about being able to compete with the big boys after we paid off our debt, pushing on from the FA cup to win the league, attracting top top players etc all lies. How can I be excited for next season when I already know how we'll do. I'm not watching football if he stays on or I'm not supporting Arsenal while he's there.
 
I think they're just looking for the right time to announce it. They know if they do it now, there will be anarchy.
 
Sultan said:
It's difficult, Steve. We have a few elite teams in the Premiership with United, Chelsea, City and Arsenal having monopolised the league. Has he been allowed to spend? I don't think any other manager taking over will fare any better unless they spend equivalent to other 3 teams.

Anyway, I personally think he'll walk into probably an international job at his age.
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100 mill spent in 2 of the last 3 seasons. probably more than Bayern Munich
 
I dislike Arsenal and Wenger but he won't be sacked and doesn't deserve treating like that after what he's given them. Any parting of the ways will be mutual for the benefit of the outside world even if internally he's being forced out.
 
I know its been said before but he truly is a monologue manager in a digital age.

He is stubborn, constantly gets tactics wrong, keeps signing the wrong kind of player and has been, in Jose's words "A serial loser". If I was an Arsenal fan I would be furious this man has the power to sign a contract when HE wants even when he's won almost nothing in the last TWELVE years. Another thing is this whole "golden era" in the late 90s, early 2000s, he supposedly led. Arsenal won 3 Premierships in 9 years, thats hardly ground breaking stuff. I've always felt he has been over rated and gets more privileges than he deserves.

As a United fan though, I hope they give him a 10 year contract. Long may the 4th place finishes continue ;-)
 
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Nori- said:
I know its been said before but he truly is a monologue manager in a digital age.

He is stubborn, constantly gets tactics wrong, keeps signing the wrong kind of player and has been, in Jose's words "A serial loser". If I was an Arsenal fan I would be furious this man has the power to sign a contract when HE wants even when he has won almost nothing in the last TWELVE years. Another thing is this whole "golden era" in the late 90s, early 2000s, he supposedly led. Arsenal won 3 Premierships in 9 years, thats hardly ground breaking stuff. I've always felt he has been over rated and gets more privileges than he deserves.

As a United fan though, I hope they give him a 10 year contract. Long may the 4th place finishes continue ;-)
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I think a lot of Arsenal fans are starting to wake up and smell the coffee or stale milk as Claude would say :D

He said that before he came Arsenal weren't competing in Europe but under the old format he'd only have been in Europe 3 times. He conveniently leaves that out. I don't hate the man though as I realise what he's done for us and how much time he's given to us. It's dreadful now though. I mean if he was anywhere else he would have been told to leave by now. He just can't adapt to the new types of play and tactics anymore. I think he's living off the invincibles tbh and managing to work on a tight budget but we've stagnated and everyone can see that.

Top 4 finishes and CL money means nothing to me as a fan so I don't know why other fans bring up that we might finish out of the top 4 if he leaves. We're not doing anything with the top 4, we're not attracting WC players with top 4, We're not pushing on to win the league or CL with top 4. He should be able to leave when he wants but I really think he's taking the mick as he knows he won't be sacked.
 
Newman123 said:
I think a lot of Arsenal fans are starting to wake up and smell the coffee or stale milk as Claude would say :D

He said that before he came Arsenal weren't competing in Europe but under the old format he'd only have been in Europe 3 times. He conveniently leaves that out. I don't hate the man though as I realise what he's done for us and how much time he's given to us. It's dreadful now though. I mean if he was anywhere else he would have been told to leave by now. He just can't adapt to the new types of play and tactics anymore. I think he's living off the invincibles tbh and managing to work on a tight budget but we've stagnated and everyone can see that.

Top 4 finishes and CL money means nothing to me as a fan so I don't know why other fans bring up that we might finish out of the top 4 if he leaves. We're not doing anything with the top 4, we're not attracting WC players with top 4, We're not pushing on to win the league or CL with top 4. He should be able to leave when he wants but I really think he's taking the mick as he knows he won't be sacked.
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I don't think the Europe bit is either true or fair. If we're going by the old format, he would have qualified for Europe every single season basically, back when the UEFA cup was rightly incredibly prestigious.

I agree with the rest though.
 
africanspur said:
I don't think the Europe bit is either true or fair. If we're going by the old format, he would have qualified for Europe every single season basically, back when the UEFA cup was rightly incredibly prestigious.

I agree with the rest though.
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I was under the impression only the league winners play in the old format? He only won the league 3 times?
 
Newman123 said:
I was under the impression only the league winners play in the old format? He only won the league 3 times?
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Oh sorry, I meant that while he would have been in the European Cup only 3 times, he still would have been in the UEFA cup most of the rest of the time, which was more prestigious and difficult to win than it is now.
 
It's a bit of a strange defence to effectively say: "Arsenal hadn't won the CL before I got here, whereas I...well, I haven't won it either. But it's the thought that counts."
 
SteveJ said:
It's a bit of a strange defence to effectively say: "Arsenal hadn't won the CL before I got here, whereas I...well, I haven't won it either. But it's the thought that counts."
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Exactly which is why its insulting and not a really well thought out remark by Wenger. All it does is show him as arrogant and condescending. I bet Jose is loving this. AW was this untouchable manager for years and he's seeing the wheels coming off now after knowing the truth about Wenger.

Anyway as for my replacement. I would love Jardim :drool: what he's done with Monaco is astonishing. He sorted out their defence and then the next season he sorted out their attack. I remember reading somewhere Monaco had the most goals scored in the CL group stages this season? He's relatively young too and so can stay long.
 
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Voted no, but purely out of respect for what he has done. Maybe he has a poor trophy haul, but his football is very pleasing on the eye.

Respect goes both ways though, and he should do the decent thing, and step down.

Their fans could be in for a shock with what follows though. The grass isn't always greener.
 
SteveJ said:
It's only the Star though, mate:

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British authorities say Arsenal fans are out of control at the River Thames.

lemmings-off-the-cliff-o.gif
 
4 years. Thats a pisstake by saying 4 right?

Also weve now seen one paper saying this whilst another saying hes going to leave. So basically one is guessing (or more likely they are both guessing). Its a good way to sell papers whatever it is.

If I was on the Arsenal board I wouldnt sack him, it would be silly to, even if he misses out Top4 this year. If he did it 2 years in a row, it would be time to move him on missing that sweet sweet CL money that will line their pockets.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
What odds?
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6/4. 2.50 in decimels which I thought its worth the risk since you get back 2 and a half times more. I added another 100 euro more. In spite of all the recent rumours, I still think he will be Arsenal manager at the start of next season. Just can't see their board sacking him and seeing his prematch conference yesterday, he mentioned that he would still be in management next season, I'm quite confident he will still be in charge of Arsenal come next season.
 
When the inevitable happens and the scousers turn on Klopp he could be a good fit for Arsenal. Give it a year or two...
 
It's a funny one for me with Wenger. I want him to stay obviously as I think that he pretty much guarantees the status quo - Arsenal will most likely finish in Top 4, win a FA/COC every now and then and that's about it. On the other hand, there's this feeling that should he go, Arsenal might endure the same kind of trouble we've been going through, irrespective of whom they appoint, which would be even bigger delight. There's also this part of me that somewhat fears that if they appoint somebody capable of actually dragging them up.

All in all I think that if they want to move forward he has to go, at first they might struggle without him, drift out of top 4, be in a bit of a freefall to ultimately benefit from it. Thing is though, do they have the same kind of money we've been able to throw at players recently? Obviously not. So their next appointment, or one after, has to be spot on.
 
dogwithabone said:
I dislike Arsenal and Wenger but he won't be sacked and doesn't deserve treating like that after what he's given them. Any parting of the ways will be mutual for the benefit of the outside world even if internally he's being forced out.
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Yeah that's probably my take on it as well. Top 4 in itself is a success in today's PL-world.
 
He said he has 4 more years in management. Whether at Arsenal or somewhere else.
 
Newman123 said:
It's the Star but it's got some quotes in there from Wenger about how he's got nothing outside football unlike Fergie and wants to carry on.

It's sad though. He and Henry were the ones to get me into football and brought me joy watching the game. Now he's bringing me nothing but despair and resentment. All the promises about being able to compete with the big boys after we paid off our debt, pushing on from the FA cup to win the league, attracting top top players etc all lies. How can I be excited for next season when I already know how we'll do. I'm not watching football if he stays on or I'm not supporting Arsenal while he's there.
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This is basically how I felt about Van Gaal staying another season.

Next season will just be more of the same. Wenger is far too stubborn to ever walk away.
 
He was a great manager until 12 years ago, since then Arsenal have stagnated under him and if I was I fan i would be absolutely tearing my hair out.

I can't understand why they as a club are happy to qualify for the Champions League each year then draw a big club in the first knock out round and get humiliated.

You can predict every year what will happen with Arsenal, they'll plod along somewhere around the top of the table, most of the season looking like they could challenge for the title then when the going gets tough over Christmas and again later in the year they implode and somehow convince their fans that qualifying for the Champions League somehow constitutes a successful season.

For the sake of the club, Wenger has to go, Sanchez will probably leave too and should for his own sake, he looks like their only player that gives a f*ck.

They should take the chance on someone like Simeone, there seems to be this fear that if Wenger leaves Arsenal, they will plummet down the table and not get CL football, but if I supported Arsenal I'd rather that than consisent predictable and boring mediocrity.
 
Eire Red United said:
I can't understand why they as a club are happy to qualify for the Champions League each year then draw a big club in the first knock out round and get humiliated.
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The obvious conclusion, sadly, is that it's all about gaining the CL money.
 
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